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March 31, 2009 at 6:16 pm #203930
Anonymous
GuestRay, I got an email saying you threw something together but I didn’t see any of the text (or attachment). I thought I would outline some of the points/analogies that have crossed my mind. The main point is to explain that we are not supporting traditional apologetics, but that we are also not trying to change the direction of the church or its members. I think it’s clear that we do support some unorthodoxy, this is what I see as the possible point of concern. I would love for broader members to be able to understand our purpose here – a lofty and probably unrealistic goal, but I think an effort to explain in terms they would better understand is not a waste of time. I see good sources to reference, Bushman’s conference from last summer being one.
Highlights of my thoughts include possible analogies include a ‘slippery slope’ that some of us have traversed from the bottom. I think it’s an important distinction – when people have hit ‘bottom’ they have no where else to go but up. It cannot get any worse than it has been (as far as the relationship with the church), so the view may be “helping those who are already ‘lost’” as far as some members may be concerned. That it is better for people to sit in church on Sundays than elsewhere – no matter their motivations for being there. If we can reach the ‘unreachable’ and help them feel better about sitting in church I think that’s a worthy goal.
I also like the analogy of a “spiritual” spinal cord injury. Injury patients do not learn to walk in the same way a child learns to walk for the first time. Learning balance with a functioning body is one thing, it’s an entirely different process when an injury is blocking the signals. We deal with people who don’t respond to the traditional spiritual instruction (method of learning to walk) – we are a spiritual “therapy” that needs to take steps that are not familiar to or understood by the broader membership. Yes, it is possible – even probable that the “injury” may keep someone from walking/running in the same way (associate with church activity) as other members. Even still progress can be made and the “patient” can learn to shuffle along and not rely on a wheelchair forever.
I had some more thoughts I can try to share when they return to memory.
The goal here in my mind is to avoid becoming “blacklisted”, whether in any official way or simply through opinion. Again, unrealistic in a total sense but I think you understand.
Along these lines maybe we should set clearer boundaries as to where we do and don’t go. These may help this concern – as in:
We will not condone or allow personal criticism or attacks on church leaders (difference of opinion is something else – but I would leave this unsaid).
We do not support organized grass-roots efforts to effect change in the church.
(And similar)… Personally I see our mission in helping others fit comfortably into the framework of the church – emphasizing personal growth over the hope that the church itself will change.
Gotta run, hope these ideas are helpful. What do y’all think?
March 31, 2009 at 9:35 pm #216281Anonymous
GuestI went back to my e-mail and realized I forgot to add the attachment. Early onset Alzheimer’s . . . Here’s what I dashed off quickly. Obviously, it needs to be edited and enhanced, but I really like the idea of a clearly defined “mission statement” addressed to both members who are struggling and those who aren’t. I also REALLY like having a clearly defined list of “Not Allowed” actions – outside of a mission statement. Anyway, here’s my quick, initial thoughts:
Meeting People Wherever They AreStayLDS.com is dedicated to helping people who are struggling in some way to remain involved in the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.We are committed to being a supportive, positive environment in which people with any difficulty can commune openly and honestly in a spirit of love and support. No topic is off limits, as long as it is approached and discussed in a civil, non-threatening, understanding way. It is fine to express disappointment, frustration, despair, grief and any other manifestation of internal struggle; it is not acceptable to dwell on bitterness, anger and strident accusations. It is fine to voice institutional concerns; it is not acceptable to disparage or criticize individual leaders – or to condemn “The Church” itself. This is not a place for polemics, debate or heated argument; it also is not a place for classic “apologetics”.While we would love to help anyone, this site is focused primarily on those who have moved past their initial feelings of bitterness and anger – or, at least, desire to do so and remain actively engaged with and/or within the LDS Church. In order to do this, it is necessary to meet people wherever they are – to speak their language – to recognize the reality and validity of their personal struggles.Those who actively participate here all have experienced somehow, to some degree, the feelings Elder Joseph Wirthlin identified in his April 2008 General Conference talk, “Concern for the One”. He said:
Quote:
1) “Some are lost because they are different. They feel as though they don’t belong. Perhaps because they are different, they find themselves slipping away from the flock. They may look, act, think, and speak differently than those around them and that sometimes causes them to assume they don’t fit in. They conclude that they are not needed.Tied to this misconception is the erroneous belief that all members of the Church should look, talk, and be alike. The Lord did not people the earth with a vibrant orchestra of personalities only to value the piccolos of the world. Every instrument is precious and adds to the complex beauty of the symphony. All of Heavenly Father’s children are different in some degree, yet each has his own beautiful sound that adds depth and richness to the whole.
2) “Some are lost because they are weary. It’s easy to feel overwhelmed . . . Others simply feel too weak to contribute. And so, as the flock moves on, gradually, almost imperceptibly, some fall behind. Everyone has felt tired and weary at one time or another.”
3) “Some are lost because they have strayed. Except for the Lord, we have all made mistakes . . . the Church is a place for imperfect people to gather together”
Due to the singular mission of this forum, we reach people by speaking in terms with which they are comfortable (even if that means we sometimes use words or phrases that sound foreign, or even “non-Mormon,” to many active members) in order to help craft mutually understandable discussion. We accept unorthodox ways of framing many things, if that is necessary to foster faith and activity with and within the LDS Church; we also accept many orthodox ways of framing many things. We have no particular vision that all must accept, but we also are striving to foster true communal commitment for those who have felt isolated from the “mainstream” community. We are not attempting to create a separate community; rather, we are attempting to strengthen the LDS Church by helping those who are struggling find a way to swim once more in the mainstream – even if that means they must do so at varying levels of “activity” and with slightly unique views of some teachings. We prefer to have them with us as we worship than have them be somewhere else while we worship.
In summary, we listen for the sounds of the non-piccolos and encourage them to tune their own unique instruments in a way that will bring a uniquely “beautiful sound that adds depth and richness to the whole.”For any members who find this site who are not struggling in some way, please understand that we are Mormons who love Mormonism – that our mission is to “reach out to the one(s)” who have experienced some kind of crisis of faith
(who feel different, are weary and/or have strayed)and help them find a new home in the fellowship of the saints. We are not here to preach any particular doctrine or enforce any common standard or create any kind of “cookie cutter” member. As Elder Wirthlin said, we understand that not all faithful members will “look, talk and be alike”. We remember that Joseph Smith said: “It does not prove that a man is not a good man because he errs in doctrine.”(History of the Church, 5:340) We are not here to judge or condemn or challenge others’ views “in doctrine”. We all see things in our own way, and we strive to honor that individuality. We are here to reach out and share and interact with all who desire a safe and caring place to converse about their own attempts to endure to the end on their uniquely individual journeys within our collective LDS community. March 31, 2009 at 10:50 pm #216282Anonymous
GuestMaybe you should add something about how we are Mormons who love Mormonism also. I think it might help for any drive-by TBMs if we declare that we are in some way faithful. April 1, 2009 at 2:13 am #216283Anonymous
GuestMan I love you guys. April 1, 2009 at 2:23 am #216284Anonymous
GuestHawk, I like that phrasing. I edited my previous comment to include that phrase (“we are Mormons who love Mormonism”) in the final paragraph addressed to faithful members. April 1, 2009 at 4:15 am #216285Anonymous
GuestVery cool, good job Ray! April 1, 2009 at 4:37 am #216286Anonymous
GuestGreat job! Stick a stamp on it and send it off! FYI, guys, just got a new calling – RS secretary. When they were organizing the presidency, the bishop said “Although the priesthood is important, in a very real way the RS presidency sets the culture for the ward.” And when he set me apart he specifically blessed me as a woman, both in my spiritual calling, as a mother and in my life “as a professional woman in the workplace.” He made it clear to the new RS president that I also have a career and am not available during the daytime. I thought that was pretty cool and thoughtful of him.
April 1, 2009 at 6:39 am #216287Anonymous
GuestThat IS cool, Hawk. So, how are we going to post the mission statement once it is completed? Are we going to put it on the main page – outside the message board? As a separate post on the message board? Both?
Are we going to create a “read first” section for new members, with some selected samples of posts? What think ye?
April 1, 2009 at 2:11 pm #216288Anonymous
GuestAWESOME! This is really good. sorry about being slow. this week has been busy. i’ve been trying to at least glance over every day and see what is happening here (and skipping other places I usually hang out). Hopefully I can come up for air soon.
I think this should be in the “About” section of the main website, and also in the “Rules & Policies” section in the mission statement post.
April 1, 2009 at 4:38 pm #216289Anonymous
Guestvaloel, My vote is for you posting it wherever you think would be appropriate. All in favor, please make it manifest by manipulating your keyboard properly. April 2, 2009 at 5:40 pm #216290Anonymous
GuestAgreed, both places would be good. I also wanted to say I really like the JS quote: “It does not prove that a man is not a good man because he errs in doctrine.” I think it lends weight to loosening the bands of orthodoxy when the need arises. I don’t know if it would fit comfortably into this essay – I just really like it.
What do you guys think about the following insertion — “…or create any kind of “cookie cutter” member. We remember that Joseph Smith said: “It does not prove that a man is not a good man because he errs in doctrine.” (
History of the Church, 5:340) We are not here to judge or condemn…” You won’t hurt my feelings, it’s simply a suggestion.
April 2, 2009 at 6:53 pm #216291Anonymous
GuestI really like it, Orson. I will insert it into the text, probably where you put it, but I’ll read the whole thing again and see where it feels best. (My immediate instinct is in the paragraph addressed to the non-struggling members, kind of as a subtle prod or reminder.) OK, I just edited it and added a little to that section. It now reads:
“We are not here to preach any particular doctrine or enforce any common standard or create any kind of “cookie cutter” member. As Elder Wirthlin said, we understand that not all faithful members will “look, talk and be alike”. We remember that Joseph Smith said:
“It does not prove that a man is not a good man because he errs in doctrine.”(History of the Church, 5:340) We are not here to judge or condemn or challenge others’ views “in doctrine”. We all see things in our own way, and we strive to honor that individuality.” April 2, 2009 at 9:11 pm #216292Anonymous
GuestI Like it, very nice! Thanks Ray! April 6, 2009 at 4:24 pm #216293Anonymous
GuestI updated the “ABOUT” tab to reflect the expanded mission statement. I also posted just the “member-friendly” section as a blog article on the main website. I updated the Mission Statement post in the forums to reflect the changes the ABOUT tab.
Let me know if you see something to comment about or want changed.
April 7, 2009 at 3:07 pm #216294Anonymous
GuestWonderful, wonderful stuff, ya’ll. Just as an FYI….ya’ll are up to around 6,000 visits per month (depending on the month) by over 600 individuals per month.
Daily average for April: ~220 daily visits….so you’re already at 1500 visits only seven days into the month.
Great work. I think you’re really starting to make a significant difference.
You have my deepest love, respect and appreciation.
John
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