Understanding Religion & Politics

Thanks for the post. The relationship between organized religion and politics has troubled me lately. I don’t want to hijack your post. I just read the lamentations from a friend of another Christian faith who pointed out where politics seemed to be transcending the spiritual consensus that used to be achieved during church meetings. He explained that when the Spirit of the Lord is present, there is a feeling of peace and unity that calms the room. Many people can actually “feel” this presence. A unanimous decision is often reached.

I have had this overwhelming feeling of peace before. One, I serve on a genetic screening committee at Utah State Department of Health. We were a very diverse group of many different religious persuasion. We were told that we must elect a spokesperson and then come to agreement on ethical issues. I think we argued, debated, discussed, but as we listened to each other there appeared to be one theme that kept rising above the others. The bad ideas seemed to just fade into the background and be forgotten. Each person brought a unique wisdom, a special truth, a perspective, an understanding, if you will. Many times, I felt the Spirit of the Lord guiding me, slowly leading me to an ultimate truth. It is as if the light just kept getting brighter and brighter until it shown like noon day and all of the shadows were gone. We could all feel this together, in unison. Suddenly, it was as if we could all see with the same eyes. It was as if truth chased away all lies, as if mercy conquered all prejudice, as if right triumphed over wrong. That feeling of unity, that unanimity, that ultimate consensus was the Spirit of God, telling us we were right.

This was NOT groupthink!!!

From Wikipedia:

Groupthink is a type of thought exhibited by group members who try to minimize conflict and reach consensus without critically testing, analyzing, and evaluating ideas. Individual creativity, uniqueness, and independent thinking are lost in the pursuit of group cohesiveness, as are the advantages of reasonable balance in choice and thought that might normally be obtained by making decisions as a group.[1] During groupthink, members of the group avoid promoting viewpoints outside the comfort zone of consensus thinking. A variety of motives for this may exist such as a desire to avoid being seen as foolish, or a desire to avoid embarrassing or angering other members of the group. Groupthink may cause groups to make hasty, irrational decisions, where individual doubts are set aside, for fear of upsetting the group’s balance. The term is frequently used pejoratively, with hindsight.

I fear that there is way too much Groupthink amongst the LDS people in Utah. I fear that it effects our legal, ethical, moral and spiritual decisions because we so fear not agreeing with the brethren or with the “Coalitions for Traditional Families” that have become defacto faiths or authorities.

Thanks,

Swimordie,

For me, the MOST troubling aspect of the current LDS Church Leadership is the oft repeated phrase, “When the Prophet Speaks the Debate is OVER”. That bothers me when applied to politics in a Democratic society. Our U.S. Constitution guarantees us all freedom of speech, that sacred right to speak our minds without fear of punishment. We didn’t always have that right, we won it with our blood and tears. The other sacred right is the right to be listened to by our elected officials. “No taxation without representation” -remember. That right to speak, that right to be heard is often called political debate. Political debate is at the heart of effective democracy, a government by the people, for the people and of the people – all of the people.

When we proclaim in politics that, “When the Prophet speaks, the debate is over”, what do we do with freedom of speech? What happens to the right of nonmembers to representation? Are we still a democracy?

As a young girl, I grew up with a brother who was a State champion debater and then went on to win the regional. I just loved debate. My favorite form of debate was to argue a side that I did not agree with. I actually allowed me to grow intellectually to the point where I could begin to see another person’s side. I had to see an issue from more than one perspective. I had to learn what it feels like to be wrong and how it feels to lose a debate (or an argument). You also learn how to weigh the strength of an argument against its weaknesses, black and white thinking evolves into discernment of different shades of gray.

Right now, young LDS persons are being told by Coalition Members that they must only vote for one party, (Republican) and that they must vote exactly as prescribed by the Coalition. E-Mails are sent out using the Doctrine and Covenants Scriptures proclaiming:

PS. For those of you that are LDS and for those of you who are not, but

> can share in the wisdom of the message, I would like to share some

> scriptures in the Doctrine and Covenants that have great meaning and

> comfort to me. In section 101 verses 86-95, the Lord gives us some

> lobbying instructions, starting with local government and working our way

> up through the state and federal government. We are told after we

> importune at the feet of our elected officials and they heed not (a

> righteous message) the Lord will arise and come forth and vex the nation

> and in His time will cut off those wicked, unfaithful, and unjust

> stewards, and appoint them their portion among hypocrites, and

> unbelievers. He also mentions outer darkness, weeping and wailing and

> gnashing of teeth.

That’s an E-mail quoted from one of our good old coalition members. Ya gotta love it!!!

For me, the MOST troubling aspect of the current LDS Church Leadership is the oft repeated phrase, “When the Prophet Speaks the Debate is OVER”.

MWallace – you have GOT to read this: http://bycommonconsent.com/2009/06/25/when-our-leaders-speak-the-thinking-has-been-done/” class=”bbcode_url”>http://bycommonconsent.com/2009/06/25/when-our-leaders-speak-the-thinking-has-been-done/ Very illuminating about the phrase “When the prophet speaks, the thinking is done.”

Personally, I think that goes to the heart of two different mentalities, also somewhat portrayed in the political diagram. On the one side, you have authoritarians, those who want the security of being told what to do. I really have a hard time thinking that somehow one can do this and mere obedience will turn them into a God. On the other side, you have anti-authoritarians, those who want to make their own way and don’t want to comply with others’ wishes. I also have a hard time thinking that someone can be so prideful and turn into a God. It seems that elements of both ways of thinking are needed to progress and grow spiritually. (Sorry for the non-Pride & Prejudice fans) One needs to be a cross between Darcy & Bingley: confident and independent with sound judgment and principles, but willing to comply with a friend when the stakes are low just to be agreeable.

Thanks for the link Hawk!!

I read every word.