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Had a situation today. I was sitting in a tutoring area at the university where I work. Students and a manager were talking about Mormons. The conversation was largely negative, focusing on how intrusive it is to have missionaries come to the door. One person said the missionaries came three times at 8:30 am and finally she told them to get lost. Another commented that a set came. One was black and said he had the mark of Cain and was praying for white skin. The manager was listening but made only neutral comments.
I saw there, somewhat across the room, but within ear shot. I knew all three people pretty well, two of whom were former students of mine. I’m a college teacher.
What would you do in this situation? If anything?
Hmmm? Nothing – I suppose. I was not part of the conversation and it was none of my business.
Interesting comments. I’m guessing the manager may have been making neutral comments because he/she knew you were within earshot and probably didn’t want to offend. Possibly. Given the same situation, I might have done nothing like cwald suggested, OR if I felt comfortable with the group I might have walked over and said something like, “Excuse me, I don’t mean to eavesdrop or pry, but I thought I just heard you mention Mormon missionaries bothering you and saying some strange things. I’m a Mormon myself and I gotta say that just sounds weird.” And, regarding missionaries bothering people early in the morning I might say something like, “I agree those guys can be a bother, but they’re used to people telling them to take a hike. Next time maybe just tell them the first time. They’re young and exuberant… anxious to share a message with whoever will listen. It can be interesting stuff, but it’s probably not for everyone, especially first thing in the morning.”
I don’t know… sometimes I feel like I have to apologize for idiot missionaries. And, even though I don’t agree with everything, I’m still a member of this church and something in me feels like I have to defend it at times, or not defend so much as tone it down… in effect say, “you don’t have to be a radical zealot or even a conservative right wing republican to belong to this church. We’re not all zealots!”
I think it might be fun to talk to the black elder praying for white skin, though. I can imagine him holding his hands together in prayer, then opening up his hands, looking at his palms and smiling… saying “Thanks, God! It’s working already.”
Okay, that was bad. I’m sorry.
In the past I would’ve stood up and said something kindly. But this time, it was like I didn’t know what I was, and so I didn’t know how to respond. I thought of standing up and saying “I investigated the Mormon Church once, and attended for over a year”. And then corrected some of the fallacies in the conversation using the investigator experience as my authority. If they asked me why I didn’t join, I would tell them that I DID join and that I too was a missionary etcetera. I did this once before and the people dissing the Church later apologized to me at a different time.
This time, though, I didn’t feel I could because I’m not totally on fire about the gospel like I was during my State 3 period that ended a while ago. The fact that this was a work environment also mitigated my desire somewhat.
I almost took a general approach by piping up and kindly saying “I couldn’t help but overhear your comments — do you think there’s a possibility that there is a Mormon in this very room at this very time? How might they react if you heard this?” And then cite a blunder I made once in spouting off opinions about a particular group, only to find there were members in the midst. Help them see that being sensitive in your public statements is part of being a savvy and sensitive person. I might’ve unveiled my membership at the end depending on their statements.
As it stood, I said nothing and just let the conversation move on to criticizing Jehovah’s Witnesses, in which I participated wholeheartedly (I’m just kidding, I didn’t criticize them at all — I think they deserve the same respect I would like to have from people of other faiths).
Afterwards I wondered if I was like Peter denying the Christ. Someone used that analogy when I expressed concern about piping up for the Church when I was in a minority. This time, that didn’t bother me. The Church is not Christ. No one asked me directly if I believed in Christ. It was about the Church, which is a related, but separate entity from Christ himself.
I don’t know what I’d do either.. depends on my mood. I’m a big fan about the biggest thing we can say to people is with our actions. Maybe your actions were a good thing, maybe they were a bad thing. It doesn’t matter anymore because God is in control. I’ve always liked the statement that the church has made that ‘good publicity or bad publicity, it’s all good publicity’. Maybe the things that that person said really made someone think poorly of the Mormons, or more likely, it showed what sort of an ignorant fool that person was. By shutting them up, you would have stopped the opportunity for them to continue putting their feet in their mouth. 😆 I’m tired of feeling guilt about whether or not I might be a good example for the church, or a bad example. I entirely feel too much guilt in my life. I choose to let go, forgive myself and let the atonement cover my imperfections. All you can do it try your best, and even when we don’t… we still try!
😳 I generally try to insert a simple comment like, “Wow. I’ve been Mormon all my life, and I’ve never heard of something like that” – or something else that is appropriate for whatever is said. Frankly, I have to question the statement about the black Elder saying he was praying to be white. It might be accurate, but it just doesn’t ring true to me – especially in that situation. It sounds like someone who was inserting anti-Mormon propaganda in a pack-participation mentality. I have no way of knowing, but I just can’t imagine that comment being made at someone’s door. It’s bizarre enough all on its own, much less in that setting.
Yeah… I agree… I think that person was full of it. That is one thing about most Evangelical religions that really rubs me the wrong way. It’s like they think the best way to spread the good news is to rip the other persons faith apart as if though they assume that once their faith has been destroyed, they will immediately come join their church. Then they’re surprised with that person becomes an atheist. Intolerance of other peoples religions or beliefs really urks me! Yeah, acarlton – and it irks me more in the Church than outside it. I try not to impose unrealistic expectations on members just because they’re part of my own tribe – but it’s hard sometimes. I’ve learned to let it go generally as the years have gone by, but it still is difficult sometimes. Haha for all you know they could’ve been JWs and confused them with Mormons. I say set the example be a good person and wear the title Mormon. We’re just too new to avoid stereo-types. I supposed I reserve myself to using equally applied force and it seems to work like a charm. FenixDown wrote:Haha for all you know they could’ve been JWs and confused them with Mormons. I say set the example be a good person and wear the title Mormon. We’re just too new to avoid stereo-types. I supposed I reserve myself to using equally applied force and it seems to work like a charm.
Upon reflection, I might end up talking to the students personally about my involvement, letting them know I’m not offended, but also correcting their false beliefs and their social blunder. I think that would be better than a public grandstanding in front of everyone at the time, potentially embarrassing the people who made the social blunder.
I also have a bit of a concern, though, with everyone knowing I’m LDS. It never used to bother me, and in the beginning, I was proud to be a Mormon. HOwever, life’s experiences and exposure to some of the questionable doctrines and history, which is still fairly new from the perspective of world history, I’m now on the fence about whether I’m actually proud to be a Mormon. Hate to say it, buy it’s true.
But it did offend you. So don’t lie about it. Don’t try to come off as different than you are. Let them know it bothered you. You don’t have to make a big deal out of it. Just let them know how you feel, or just correct the situation. But don’t say anything that isn’t true. What she said was deeply insulting and ignorant. So don’t lie about it! SilentDawning wrote:FenixDown wrote:Haha for all you know they could’ve been JWs and confused them with Mormons. I say set the example be a good person and wear the title Mormon. We’re just too new to avoid stereo-types. I supposed I reserve myself to using equally applied force and it seems to work like a charm.
Upon reflection, I might end up talking to the students personally about my involvement, letting them know I’m not offended, but also correcting their false beliefs and their social blunder. I think that would be better than a public grandstanding in front of everyone at the time, potentially embarrassing the people who made the social blunder.
I also have a bit of a concern, though, with everyone knowing I’m LDS. It never used to bother me, and in the beginning, I was proud to be a Mormon. HOwever, life’s experiences and exposure to some of the questionable doctrines and history, which is still fairly new from the perspective of world history, I’m now on the fence about whether I’m actually proud to be a Mormon. Hate to say it, buy it’s true.
The fact SD is however it’s not your choice. Mormonism is a sub-culture, when I was going out to bars drinking, etc my friends always said I was a Mormon. Even ExMos are still Mormons by culture. If you want to effect change in the Mormon world we need to show it as such to the secular world. In other words we must let others know that Mormon does not mean white shirt and name tag only, but a diverse culture that includes the ENTIRE spectrum of the Latter-day Saint movement.
Quote:The fact SD is however it’s not your choice. Mormonism is a sub-culture, when I was going out to bars drinking, etc my friends always said I was a Mormon. Even ExMos are still Mormons by culture. If you want to effect change in the Mormon world we need to show it as such to the secular world. In other words we must let others know that Mormon does not mean white shirt and name tag only, but a diverse culture that includes the ENTIRE spectrum of the Latter-day Saint movement.
I think I have as much choice as I claim here. Yes, speaking up could help dispel misconceptions, and could also help these students see a professor who they consider normal, as an affiliate with the religion. It will either help them see us as a more normal religion, or could just lead them to believe I’m a screwball. Probably the latter (and they aren’t that far off either!)
Fwiw, I believe remaining silent in situations like this does reinforce the negative at the expense of the positive – and that it does it in one way that gets overlooked by almost everyone: With many people who are Christian, if they respect you but don’t know your religious affiliation, they will assume (because they respect you) that you are “like them”. At the very least, they will believe you aren’t part of a “damnable cult” like Mormonism, as they see it. Your silence reinforces that stereotype and actually contributes to the solidification of their characterization – since they will look at you as an example of someone who knows better than to associate with people who are damned to Hell, like Mormons and Jehovah’s Witnesses (and, in some cases and places, Catholics).
It’s worth considering, imo – no matter how you choose to act.
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