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I have really enjoyed some of the great topics especially from Cwald and Cadence lately. I have found myself in similar situations lately and it has really helped to hear others working though similar problems in their own lives. Mid last week was reading D&C 132 and the spirit whispered to me that this is all made up. I had thought this in the past but have never had it confirmed to me. This put me in what I can only describe as a great depression. I knew then, that I had to leave the Church. The only problem is how do deal with this new found knowledge and feelings? Well… I want to share what happened yesterday. I had a business partner in town from China so we took him and his wife to Music and the Spoken Word. They did a tribute to MLK Jr and a women from the SLCC talked afterward on love and it was really beautiful. After breakfast we drove home and as we passed the Church (it was just starting) my 4 year old saw her friends and said she wanted to go. So, I put on my best face and headed in. I have never been more happy that i went to Church in my entire life. In EQ we discussed service and what it means to serve. In SS we talked about the birth of Christ. Both of these topics I really love. Then the crowning jewel was sacrament meeting, with two kids under 4 SM usually really sucks. But we had two great speakers.
The first talk was on tolerance and he discussed how he was once a racist and all of the horrible things he would say and then he talked about his mission to the south and his interaction with African- American members of the Church and how he had to change his thinking and repent for his years of being racist.
The next talk was by a former bishop and he talked about dealing with families kicking kids out of the home and couples breaking up. He talked about that it all comes down to expectations and that we need to examine ourselves more than we examine others. It was really great.
So here is the question, what to do now that I don’t believe but see there is wonderful things to be had at Church? Although, those wonderful things might be few and far in between. I know this is StayLDS and that is the stated mission of the site but if any of you are willing to share I want to know how I can balance what I see as the problems with the good that I see.
Focus on those good things. Recognize that you’ll find warts in other Churches, and recognize that for all its problems and doubt-causing features, the LDS Church has a clear mission and programs in place that are meant to help youth and kids grow up being honest, clean-living peple who care about relationships. You’ll rub shoulders with some really fine people. And there will be many good experiences, intermingled with angst-causing ones, as in all Churches. I think the consensus that most LDS people are good people speaks volumes for the fact that it does help people make good choices in a lot of circumstances. The character of the people supports the idea that there is at least universal truth in its core spiritual principles, notwithstanding questions you and I may have about some of its historical or other claims. Yes, there are good people in other Churches, but even the South Park creators acknowledge that as a Church, we have a lot of plain old good people.
Recognize that you don’t know for SURE that your revelation that it’s all made up is true either. If we can claim that revelation that “THE CHURCH IS TRUE” is unreliable (as Cadence does), then we can just as easily lay that same argument on revelations that the Church is NOT true. So, I would live your life assuming it might be true, giving as much as you feel you can. Go on the basis of the best impressions you have — and the one you shared here is one of those impressions, in my view.
Also, look at the great unknown of eternity and the mysterious judging criteria we will meet at that time — unknown to many of us. My father once tried to dissuade me from joining the Church, telling me it was false. I told him that if I could live the standards of that religion, I felt I was more likely to fare well in the next life if there was a judgment of some kind. If I was wrong, at least the Church encouraged me to live a good life to the best of my ability that might help me when I meet my Maker, assuming that happens.
Inherent in my philosophy of the Church is that I don’t know for absolute sure whether it’s all made up or not. One definition of faith is “belief in things which can’t be scientifically proven”, so I don’t expect there to be conclusive evidence any time soon. So, at some point, you have to make a decision, commit, and start getting the benefits the experience has to offer.
One thing I mentioned to the BP yesterday, was that I don’t believe the church is all true, or all false. I don’t believe that it’s all white or all black. I don’t believe it’s all true, or the greatest fraud ever in the history of the world. I don’t believe that it’s all just man made doctrine, and I don’t believe it’s all god inspired either. To me the church is true, and it’s false. It has some white, and some black, and some gray, and many shades of color. To me it is one pathway that some people can use to find god and spiritual enlightenment. That is how I am trying to cope with it. I came to my conclusion using logic, reason and the light of Christ. Is my conclusion the right one and the only possibility? I highly doubt it. It is my conclusion and it is the path that will work for me at this time. Other will come to to different conclusion using their logic, reason, and spirit.
behappy wrote:… and the spirit whispered to me that this is all made up. I had thought this in the past but have never had it confirmed to me. This put me in what I can only describe as a great depression. I knew then, that I had to leave the Church. The only problem is how do deal with this new found knowledge and feelings?….So here is the question, what to do now that I don’t believe but see there is wonderful things to be had at Church? Although, those wonderful things might be few and far in between.
This sounds VERY similar to the experience I had. Perhaps I might suggest you ask the next question, as I did. “Should I leave the church?” I thought for sure when I felt the “spirit” tell me it was not “the one and only true church on the earth” and that much of it was just designed by man, that the spirit would tell me to leave.
But, that is not the impression I got when I asked. I wanted it to be – but it was not the pathway I was destined for. Others will perhaps get a different answer – but I would ask anyway. If “god” or the “spirit” or your “sub-conscience” spoke to you about the (un)truthfulness of the church, it seems logical that he would speak to you about what you should do with that knowledge.
Letting go of the extreme viewpoint your post highlights (“I felt this particular thing was wrong / made-up, so I have to leave it all.” – i.e., throwing out the baby with the bathwater) is a great start. It’s more difficult in many ways to muddle in the middle and find your own faith inside a communal religion, so to speak, but it’s much more empowering and progressive for me, personally. Recognizing that there is a HUGE difference between “the Church” and “the Gospel” is a giant step forward, and accepting that you can create your own vision of the Gospel AND your own participation pattern in the Church is an even greater step, imo. I really like cwald’s follow-up. If you feel like you got a spiritual confirmation about D&C 132, then you feel like you got a spiritual “answer / witness” in your experience getting to and while attending church, don’t make an extreme change based on strictly an emotional reaction. Either pray explicitly about staying or leaving or accept BOTH spiritual manifestations you just had – and stay for what you can gain while sorting through what you actually believe about each of the details.
Maybe you just have to figure out what you can accept and can’t accept within the Church – ’cause I feel pretty confident that you aren’t going to find any other religious community where you will believe everything that is taught and that has occurred in the past, as long as you are open and honest about it. I can’t say what path you should walk, but I can say that it’s possible (and even VERY rewarding) to craft your own individual faith as separate from your worship community.
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