Study, pray, attend church?

Hi Pickles,

Welcome to the board. I’d love to get to know you better. It would be great if you introduced yourself so we can know better where you are coming from, and why you want to hang out here and kick ideas around.

RE: Study, praying, & attending church:

The universal answer to every problem. The always say that these 3 things will lead you to the answer to your problems. So what does it mean when it doesn’t work? The Church starts to loose credibility with me when I follow their advice and it doesn’t work like they say.

I think those three suggestions are spot on for tackling some tasks. As you are noticing, they really don’t work for everything. It doesn’t really matter what other people claim. It mostly matters what you experience.

From your comment below, it seems like you are investigating the LDS Church and talking to the missionaries. So in that regard, those three are quite reasonable suggestions. If someone wants to know if they like a religious organization and want to join it, and they want some spiritual sense of destiny about it, it’s probably a good idea to study that church and pray. In addition, it’s probably a good idea to attend the church to see if you like it and connect (find meaning in it).

What if you don’t get an answer, or you don’t like attending the LDS Church? Well … I guess that’s the answer for you. I know this gets missionaries and members all bent out of shape because you aren’t “supposed” to get that answer. There’s only supposed to be one right answer — The Mormons (quoting South Park). Yes. “The Mormons” was the right answer. hehe. But seriously, if study + pray + attend = no answer, or you don’t like the Church, THAT’s the answer for you.

Does anyone really ask god if the book of mormon is true and get an answer? Why would the missionaries tell me to ask this of god and then ask me to get baptised a minute later. They must not care if you get an answer or not.

Yes. Some people do get an answer, or in other words, they have an experience they interpret as confirming their decision to join the LDS Church. They also feel like the Book of Mormon is true (we constantly discuss the truthiness of “truth” here, see other threads).

Missionaries have a lot of pressure to push people through the process of investigating the Church. Your point is well taken. I have to confess that I did that a couple times when I was a missionary a gazillion years ago. I had a very numbers and results-oriented Mission President. It really violated the letter AND the spirit of missionary work though. I remember thinking at the time it just was not right, and I sort of cringe thinking back on it sometimes. Does it excuse me at all that I was still young, idealistic and stupid? 🙂

But I also see some potential value in challenging people, and pushing them to study, to pray and to attend. I mean, if missionaries aren’t proselyting (pushing the church on people), then they aren’t really missionaries. That’s their job — to try and convince people to join the church.

So just say “no.” You are not ready, and that’s too bad if they don’t like it.

I know lots of people for whom it does work; I know lots for whom it doesn’t.

The missionaries, by and large (really the vast majority), are sincere, good people preaching what worked for them. Of course, they want people to do those things and get an answer quickly – and they probably assume all people can, if they did.

However, don’t discount their answers. They just might work for you. If not, fine. So, shrug and accept that – and go at whatever pace works best for you.

You forgot fasting.

By and large, as Ray pointed out, missionaries are good guys and gals doing what they think is right. Sometimes that includes following their mission president’s intructions whether or not they make sense to them. Statistics show that when people investigating the church are unwilling to make committments early on, then they are less likely to make committments later on. No big surprise there, but as a result there is a big push to get people to agree to do things as soon as possible. Often this results in the missionaries making fishing expeditions. Of course one needn’t take the bait, and anyone that shows interest will always be able to get face time with the missionaries.

The idea that someone might sincerely pray about the BoM and get the ‘wrong’ answer is anathema to missionaries and many church members alike. It just doesn’t happen, in their minds. The logical inconsistency of requesting that someone ask a question of this nature to which there is only one answer never occurred to me until recently. Nevertheless, I believe that it can and often does work (and provide the ‘right’ answer).

I know lots of people for whom it does work; I know lots for whom it doesn’t.

The missionaries, by and large (really the vast majority), are sincere, good people preaching what worked for them. Of course, they want people to do those things and get an answer quickly – and they probably assume all people can, if they did.

However, don’t discount their answers. They just might work for you. If not, fine. So, shrug and accept that – and go at whatever pace works best for you.

I was a full-time missionary, and we would often have spiritual experiences right as we met with the investigator. We would all feel the HOly Ghost very powerfully together. So, I don’t think it’s unreasonable for missionaries to believe you can get a fast answer to your prayers. Pay attention to how you feel in your meetings with them. The Holy Ghost method of discerning truth worked for me as an investigator, and as a full-time missionary too. Some of the experiences ranged from a pleasant warmth in the room all the way to no one being able to speak because the Spirit was so powerful and strong.