Home Page Forums General Discussion The Baggage Associated with the term Middle Way

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  • #206690
    Anonymous
    Guest

    The term “middle way Mormon” sounded great at first, but after some of the history associated with it, I’m starting to fall out of love with the term. The fact there was a group forming calling themselves a Middle Way group that caught negative church attention, and what people assume about it makes me question if it’s a good term to use anymore.

    Or, would we expect ANY term that describes any approach to Mormonism that is not all-or-nothing be viewed negatively? For example, the term “unorthodox” certainly doesn’t seem to carry the same instantly negative connotations a “middle way” approach seems to conjure up in the mind of others.

    Comments?

    #253232
    Anonymous
    Guest

    I didn’t get a favorable reaction to “unorthodox” when I used it.

    In my opinion, orthodox is the only term, everything else is unfavorable in some way or another to stage 3 thinking.

    I think that is why the labeling terms in any way just don’t work. Labels…meh.

    #253233
    Anonymous
    Guest

    Middle Way sounds a lot like Revelation 3:16: “So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth.” or possibly like D&C 76: 79: “These are they who are not valiant in the testimony of Jesus; wherefore, they obtain not the crown over the kingdom of our God.”

    To some, orthodox sounds like “valiant.” I am not sure I agree with that. To me, orthodox also carries baggage: prideful, self-righteous, fundamentalist, unthinking, judgmental, correlated, inauthentic. You can be a believing Mormon and not be a tool. You can believe and not irritate the crap out of everyone about it. You can have faith without resorting to using your testimony as a weapon of last resort when your arguments have failed to persuade.

    But I agree Middle Way isn’t great. Middle between what? Good and bad? Valiant and non-commital? Practicing and doing your own thing? Believing and disbelieving? Mormon and non-Mormon? Again, we get into this territory: James 1:6: “But let him ask in faith, nothing wavering. For he that wavereth is like a wave of the sea driven with the wind and tossed.” Middle Way sounds like living together vs. being married, or dating other people instead of monogamy – and in some ways it can be like that. But I think you can “embrace the good of all faiths” as JS said without being disloyal or non-commital. You can have faith in some things and not others. You can be willing to act in faith (and live as a Mormon) despite doubts or even “unbelief” (as the Apostle Thomas). You can be just as Mormon while being an authentic individual full of curiosity and open-mindedness and non-judgmental attitudes.

    #253234
    Anonymous
    Guest

    Yeah, I think somewhere along the way the church hijacked the termed middle way and made it a dirty concept. Kind of like what the conservatives did with the term liberal.

    I will own it…just like I have had to own the liberal term amongst my Republican friends.

    #253235
    Anonymous
    Guest

    I’m tired of labels altogether.

    Regardless of the situation or context.

    Mike from MIlton.

    #253236
    Anonymous
    Guest

    I love the phrase “orthodox heretics” but unless you’ve read Peter Rollins, it won’t have any meaning. And the odds of most LDS having read Rollins are slim…

    He writes, “we must question the difference between the heresy of orthodoxy, in which we dogmatically claim to have the truth, and orthodox heresy, in which we humbly admit that we are in the dark but still endeavor to live in the way of Christ as best we can.”

    I love that he characterizes orthodoxy as the real heresy, one in which we claim a certainty that is largely unknowable, essentially redefining faith in order to give us a comfortable grasp of the divine – something with clean lines and perfect order – something homogeneous, palatable, and clearly recognizable in contrast to the darkness of apostasy and unbelief.

    IMO, the real measure of faith is in grappling with the uncertainty, allowing for the possibility that your beliefs are wrong, accepting the messiness of jagged lines and shades of grey and then choosing, in spite of the unknown to live what you believe.

    This is why stage 3 “faith” never fully satisfies. In stage 3, we have a belief rooted in false certainty. We strut through town with the bravado of a man walking a lion on a leash. We act as if we have it all figured out, blissfully unaware of the raw power of the animal we’ve harnessed. It isn’t until we’ve grappled with the beast and been bloodied by the reality of uncertainty that we reach the point where we can take the leash off and walk side by side in peace. Real faith comes after we’ve stared into the eyes of disbelief, realized that it has every right to exist freely alongside us, and chosen to continue the walk anyway.

    #253237
    Anonymous
    Guest

    I have a different view. Confucius’ key philosophy on how to live a rich and full life was based on something he called “the Middle Way”. This is represented in one character “Zhong” (中) which means “the Middle”, “Middle Way”, or “the Center”. The book typically has the english title “Doctrine of the Mean”, where “Mean” is used in its sense of being the average of things — this isn’t what Confucius was saying.

    The Middle Way of confucius is a balanced, centered life. The explicit statement, coming from the first chapter is as follows (my translation):

    Confucius wrote:

    The mandate of heaven is called “Nature” (性 xing),

    Following nature is called “the Way” (道 Dao),

    Cultivating the way is called “Learning”. (教 Jiao)

    The Way cannot be departed from for a moment

    If you could depart from it, it would not be ‘the Way’.

    When one sets aside extremes, e.g. joy, anger, sorry, and pleasure; this is called ‘The Middle Way’ (中 zhong).

    In the Middle Way, when one can express emotion yet remain centered, this is called “Harmony” (和 he).

    The Middle Way is the root of all things under heaven.

    Harmony is the realization of the Way.

    When the Middle Way is actualized with Harmony, All things thrive.


    To be on the Middle Way as applied to being LDS: the True Believing aspect of our faith is one of absolutes, of extremes: If you are not with me, you are against me. It’s either all true, or all fraud. Be ye therefore perfect, as your Father in Heaven is perfect. “I KNOW” the church is the only true church on the face of the earth… etc.

    Once a True Believing member realizes that there are profound problems with the historical and current truth claims of the church, it is highly likely that the TBM goes to the other extreme of emotion: hatred. So one emotional extreme morphs into another: joy in the gospel that everything is wonderful turns into rabid hatred of the church. These two extremes are not on the Way as Confucius would point out. He suggests that instead of starting from a position of one pole, it’s better to center your life — to calm the mind of emotion, and find the pivot point of the Way: the Middle/Zhong. From this position of the Middle, Confucius is saying that it’s ok to send out emotion, but you remain anchored in the Middle Way.

    In this sense, to be on the “Middle Way” is to be balanced in one’s view of the church: to be in harmony with the Spirit of the Gospel, while recognizing that the physical manifestation of that spirit is subject to a lot of human error. It is to be open minded and not strident in one’s beliefs, to accept the value in both the church as well as other belief systems, while being true to one’s authentic self and the truth.

    There are so many writings in asian culture about this concept. Buddhism, Taoism, Japanese culture and tradition are all based upon an idea that detachment from extreme emotion allows one to be authentic in one’s emotions. It’s a deep paradox. Wuwei of the Taoist, Buddhiyogaad of the Hindu, Dharma of the Buddhist — while being a bit different in extended meaning, all start from a position of detachment in order to connect.

    I am truly suggesting that the Middle Way is more enlightened and divine than a position of extreme and Blind Faith in the Church and it’s 14 fundamental-styled teachings; or, on the other hand, divorcing oneself entirely from the church in anger. I’m also saying that by adopting Confucius’ Middle Way, you can better see the truth in the church, and not react to its problems through another extreme emotion: hostility. The Middle Way is to be balanced, to be centered: what the Bhagavad Gita calls “Yoga”: the unity of mind and spirit.

    This “Middle Way” is not a movement or an organization — it is not anything organized at all — it is an individual approach to life that finds the center, the pivot point of the Way, and then joyfully expresses thought and feeling from the authenticity of the center of one’s soul.

    Laotzu says, “名可名,非常名” – “The names that we can name are by no means constant names”, meaning that labels are insufficient to accurately and completely define a thing. If we struggle for a name of something, like the “Middle Way”, it’s because the concept is much broader than the words imply. Confucius Middle Way is a state of sattori — peaceful enlightenment, where emotions are at rest, and being at rest, one is free to be authentic in one’s emotions and expressions. It may be better to say, “I am centered”, which better implies this state of harmony (和).

    #253238
    Anonymous
    Guest

    I like that Wayfarer.

    Sent from my SCH-I500 using Tapatalk 2

    #253239
    Anonymous
    Guest

    I agree with that completely, wayfarer – but, in the context of our own time and within the context of our own church, “the middle way” has come to mean something very different than Confucius’ meaning. Confucius focused on an individual path, as you described; “the middle way” that we are discussing is becoming more and more a group path that is radically different than what Confucius taught.

    To make my point a little differently:

    Most members I know, even most members who would be classified as traditionally orthodox, actually do strive for balance in their lives. Nearly all members actually are “cafeteria/buffet Mormons”, as we’ve discussed here. Of course, there are too many who are extremists, but they are nowhere near the majority, ime. Even within the FP and Q12, that is true. For example, President Packer is a lightning rod due to his stance on moral issues, especially homosexuality, but he also has made many statements over the years that sound like they are straight from Confucius’ middle way philosophy. I mean that seriously. I think most members who struggle with his stances on moral issues would be shocked at how dominant his “balance” statements are numerically. The message of balance is taught repeatedly – but the messages that jar the most (like the 14 fundamentals, Prop. 8, etc.) shock our systems so much that they dominate our memories and distort the other messages that aren’t extremist.

    Again, my problem with the way “the middle way” has come to be used in our Mormon culture is that it has begun to morph into an actual movement – and it’s becoming an extremist movement of rejection, not a movement toward balance and being centered. In a very real way, it’s beginning to distort and twist and manipulate reality by claiming that the piccolos are the only accepted instrument in the orchestra and, thus, all other instruments should leave the orchestra. It’s not there fully yet, but it’s headed in that direction – due to some very strident voices who use that term to justify their very real movement.

    That’s NOT Confucius’ middle way – not at all. I absolutely love Confucius’ use of the term, while I really dislike how the term is beginning to be used by some church members.

    #253240
    Anonymous
    Guest

    I agree, ray, that terms can become contaminated. Hence “Middle Way” has been labeled by the SCMC and some of the brethren as a ‘movement’ in opposition to the church. It is not, but we can’t change “Newspeak” as it were.

    I think that bringing us back to Confucius’ Middle Way is more than just a term: it’s a way of coping with the ‘all or nothing’ emotionally laden language that causes fine TBM people to go nuclear when they find out some of the more sordid things of Church history and current practice. We had a CES coordinator — paid professional by the church — living here in N Va area for a while — He was over-the-top zealous for keeping to the Iron Rod, for unabashed worship of JS and BY. He was dogmatic in the extreme — and way too much to take for a lot of members. CES is full of these types, because doctrinal purity has been hammered into them throughout. As a result, the ‘indoctrination’ of seminary and institute students leads to an “all or nothing” approach. And the result is that there is no ‘middle way’. There needs to be.

    We can avoid the term, but by invoking it, particularly in the context of Our Master Kong (the literal translation of ‘Confucius’/Kongfuzi), I think there is a point to be made.

    #253241
    Anonymous
    Guest

    Wayfarer, I like those thoughts and have also looked at it in similar terms. middle way is not a compromise of positions, where a person can’t feel passionately about an opinion. Looking at it as a compromise or a lack of a position is the middle point between two extremes on a single line. But the middle way of Buddhism I was reading suggests it is the apex of a triangle, with the two extremes being the lower triangle points. It is similar to the image drawn for a new married couple told they are the two lower endpoints of the triangle and the closer they move up to God, being the apex of the triangle, the closer they become to each other.

    While I have embraced that image of the middle way, I do see what Ray and others are saying, which is, that is not how other groups are starting to use it, so it is starting to become defined differently and establishing a connotation that I have started distancing myself from.

    But I like your Confuscius teachings. That speaks to me.

    #253242
    Anonymous
    Guest

    I would have no problem at all with using “Confcius’ middle way”. I think most people in the Church who talk about “the middle way” don’t make the connection without it being explicit.

    #253243
    Anonymous
    Guest

    Old-Timer wrote:

    I would have no problem at all with using “Confcius’ middle way”. I think most people in the Church who talk about “the middle way” don’t make the connection without it being explicit.


    of course they don’t. It’s not part of their education (to use Confucius’ term), therefore they don’t know about the Way or the Middle Way either.

    Jesus said, “I am the Way, the Truth, and the Life”.

    Isaiah 35:8 wrote:

    And an highway shall be there, and a way, and it shall be called The way of holiness…it shal be for those: the wayfaring men, though fools, shall not err therein.


    As you can probably imagine, as a wayfaring fool, the Way is very meaningful to me. for me, the term “Middle Way” works, and I don’t care what others think. for others, the term may be “Yoga”, which means unity: of mind, of body, of self-with-god… to be seated in yoga (“yogastah”, in sanskrit) is to be detached from the desires and emotions that enslave us. the Gita says, “Yogastah, kuru karmaani, Sangam tyaktvah” – “yoga-seated (in the mind), do your work, renouncing attachment (to emotions).”

    Whatever the word, there is something gained when we come to realize that our LDS faith does not have to enslave us: we are free, not just to choose good vs evil, but to choose between good and better: a more excellent Way, as Paul taught the Corinthians:

    Paul to the Corinthians 13:9-12 wrote:

    For we know in part, and we prophesy in part.

    But when that which is more complete is come, then that which is in part shall be done away.

    When I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child:

    but when I became a man, I put away childish things.

    For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face:

    now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known.


    Most of us are here because we have come to understand church history and current church behavior more completely. We have partaken of the meat of further light and knowledge. It isn’t knowledge the church wanted us to have, but now having it, there is no going back. The church, all churches, ‘know in part”, and some, very few, claim to ‘prophesy’, yet even so, since prophesy and revelation is inherently a human activity of the mind and heart, we ‘prophesy in part’.

    when our prophesies and presumed ‘knowledge’ (aka ‘testimony’) are altered by the further light and knowledge, we aren’t regressing to cast aside some of our prior ‘knowledge’ that was wrong. The ‘more complete’ truth of the gospel is come, and we must do something with it: we must do away with incorrect beliefs and embrace the fuller knowledge. And as adult believers, we must put away the milk-based pabulum we have been forced to take in correlation.

    Paul is laying out the ‘Way’ for us here — Whether we call it ‘middle way’ — well that’s what i call it, without apology. Perhaps we could just call it ‘the Way’.

    #253244
    Anonymous
    Guest

    mercyngrace wrote:

    Real faith comes after we’ve stared into the eyes of disbelief, realized that it has every right to exist freely alongside us, and chosen to continue the walk anyway.

    This is a fantastic point. I don’t think I could say it any better.

    #253245
    Anonymous
    Guest

    I feel like we are losing ground if we let antagonists define the term “middle-way.” We don’t have to throw up our hands and wave the white flag of surrender.

    Screw them!

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