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I’ve learned growing up that there are many groups oppose certain evils or believed evils like pornography, abortion, war, global warming, gay marriage, whatever, that are too pushy, overgeneralizing, fanatical, dishonest, manipulative, and harassing to the very same people they claim they’re helping or love? Why? Why couldn’t God just design us be all good or all bad? Why do we have to be a mixture? It would sure cut down on some stress in life. Why do too many people have to be this in furthering their beliefs? Your thoughts? I really don’t have an answer to that. A lot of those same things bother me as well, but I just have to remind myself that my mindset was very much the same before going through my faith crisis. I sincerely believe that people are basically good; most of the evil things we do are not intentionally malicious. We just fail to see the harm in our actions because of our own short sightedness. It takes life experiences to expand our world view enough to understand the suffering of others, and there’s not much that can substitute for that. I have many relatives who have lived in the Mormon Corridor their entire lives, and I’m a little embarrassed at the things they say sometimes about “non-members”. I just try to remind myself that their opinions of people outside of the church has more to do with their lack of exposure than it does with their lack of moral character. The approach that has been healthiest for me has been to simply accept human nature for what it is. Even though I may disagree with somebody’s beliefs or tactics of spreading them, I can at least acknowledge that from their current world view they are doing something good, and it helps me to love them more as a person.
I think part of it is we only have so much capacity to understand things, and there is just too much to know. So we tend to filter things to help us function and survive and seek happiness. When we have to filter, our perspectives become influential on how we look at the world. Right or wrong, it becomes a necessary way to learn. It then takes effort, a lifetime of effort, to keep learning to see it more clearly. In Mitch Albom’s book, Have a Little Faith, the Rabbi said:
Quote:I know what I believe. Its in my soul. But wht I constantly tell our people, you should be convinced of the authenticity of what you have, but you must be humble enough to say that we don’t know everything. And since we don’t know everything, we must accept that someone else may believe something else.
In Mormon teachings, we refer to the veil of forgetfulness. By passing through the veil, we are limited in what we know and can remember. So we are left to learn through our point of view in this life, which provides an opportunity to grow and develop even amid uncertainty, perhaps because of uncertainty.This produces multiple opinions, and strong opinions, and groups that become fanatical about their opinions. We live in a world where we must decide how we will deal with that. It takes wisdom to navigate through it. And all things must have opposites, that we can learn wisdom.
That’s all true. You both have made good points. What I was originally trying to post was about a woman that’s a Christian and anti-porn crusader named _______________. You might have heard of her. Unfortunately, my longer original post was deleted, so I couldn’t post that one. I had to post this one. I have no problems with her helping people people out of the adult business, but way too many of her methods are too pushy and overgeneralizing of every single in the industry. I am recovering from some sex addictions, although I believe it will take me the rest of this life to fully recover. Maybe my problems are similar to many people in the church that struggle with same-sex attraction. I was originally going to put some info down about her, according to those that are for her and against her. I had made some points about her, according to those that either for her and against her. I I am praying and pondering about her, but I’m not getting a good feeling about her at all. I know you can’t always rely on every person that complains about a person, but I’m getting bad vibes about her being a religious fanatic and harassing (or stalking) the people inside or outside the porn industry that don’t agree with her methods, beliefs, or call her on her dishonesty. It appears she is mentally ill and if she is trying to help people out of business, then she needs to make sure she mentally stable as much as possible first. Again, you guys made good points. I believe that humans are evolutionarily wired to have us vs. them thinking. As humans we decide what our group is and that is “us”. We are incredibly altruistic to our group. Those outside our group however we define it we are not so kind to. One of the clarion teaching of Christianity as it should be taught I think is that the “us” should be the entire human family – thus the Good Samaritan “who is my neighbor” scenario.
I find it ironic and more than sad that so often religion especially Christianity and even Mormonism is a vehicle for us vs. them instead of what it should be – the opposite.
I removed her name from your comment, ilovechrist77 – just because I don’t want the thread focused on her. This is a very good topic, so let’s keep it focused on the overall issues in it, not on this particular person. Opposing evil is a good thing; fanaticism is not. Once a person starts a crusade, the crusade aspect takes over – and things get all out of whack.
That’s OK, Ray. Thanks for the reminder. I sometimes forget to keep those kind of names off posts. So far I feel that many of the ways many anti-porn organizations try to abolish porn is similar to the ways many people on this website feel about the Church getting involved in Proportion 8. I believe it’s too often too pushy, instead of doing it in a loving way. And, Ray, you made a good point. Opposing evil is good; fanaticism isn’t. Hi iLoveChrist77, i get what you are saying and i might have even come across this person’s work online. it reminds me a lot like those who oppose abortion and who will go to an abortion centre and will tantalize anyone who comes and goes there. as Ray says – it’s a good thing to oppose evil – just not good to be fanatical about it.
Mike
Ilovechrist77 wrote:Why couldn’t God just design us be all good or all bad? Why do we have to be a mixture? It would sure cut down on some stress in life. Why do too many people have to be this in furthering their beliefs? Your thoughts?
I have been thinking about the same thing. If God was really loving like we claim, could he have not saved many of us some pain by creating us a little bit better? Maybe there is a reason for evil in the world but then God is using some of his children to tempt his other children. I would never allow my children to harm each other. Why is God so willing to lose forever so many of his children?
The day I realized it was all made up was the day it made sense. I hope there is a God, but I also believe he is nothing like the God portrayed by Mormons and Christians in general. I believe the plan of Salvation as we understand it is bunk. The whole elitist nature of it makes my head spin.
Quote:Why is God so willing to lose forever so many of his children?
Personally, I don’t think he is – and the Plan of Salvation within Mormonism, as I view it, is as close to the opposite of that result as it is possible to get without losing all motivation to be good.
Iow, I think there is a HUGE difference between human elitism that narrows and limits God and “pure Mormonism” itself.
Cadence wrote:Ilovechrist77 wrote:Why couldn’t God just design us be all good or all bad? Why do we have to be a mixture? It would sure cut down on some stress in life. Why do too many people have to be this in furthering their beliefs? Your thoughts?
I have been thinking about the same thing. If God was really loving like we claim, could he have not saved many of us some pain by creating us a little bit better? Maybe there is a reason for evil in the world but then God is using some of his children to tempt his other children. I would never allow my children to harm each other. Why is God so willing to lose forever so many of his children?
The day I realized it was all made up was the day it made sense. I hope there is a God, but I also believe he is nothing like the God portrayed by Mormons and Christians in general. I believe the plan of Salvation as we understand it is bunk. The whole elitist nature of it makes my head spin.
I guess I still believe in the “natural man.” I think our biological bodies evolved from lower life forms, and we still have the instincts to survive, mate and reproduce. Humans, with the advanced evolution capacity to “be gods” have enough spiritual energy that perhaps we can overcome the natural man…and focus less on our reproduction and survival, and maybe a little bit more on our own, and societies, spiritual development.
You ever see the movie
Island of Dr. Munreau? The good doctor spends his whole life trying “to find the devil in his microscope.” He claims to have succeeded, and cut the devil to pieces and removed him from his creation. Perhaps this is what religion evolved to do…help one find the devil within himself, within his genetic makeup…and become “a god.” Something more than just an animal focused on survival and reproducing? Genetics and evolution are a fascinating field of study.
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