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Not sure where to put this so I will put it here. I’ve been inactive for 30 years and began learning about all the problems with church history about 20 years ago, and I am pretty well steeped in all of those issues. The truth is, obviously, that I never have been able to leave it alone though. I was born into the church and come from a pioneer/polygamist background, which may have to do with that. Mormonism is in my blood. At any rate, despite all of the problems that there are with church history, with the Book of Mormon, with how it was translated, with the first vision, and on and on, to the point that I had come to what I thought was an ironclad conviction that the church could not possibly be true, I cannot, for the life of me (and if I am honest have never been able to), shake this undeniable feeling/belief that Joseph Smith was (is) a prophet of God. And I have no idea what to do now. Well, you came to the right place, that’s for sure. I’m sure you’ve figured that out by now. I think your problem can be resolved by judicious redefinition of the words “true”, “prophet”, and “God”. I say that without any trace of sarcasm. There is a wide range of completely reasonable (IMO) meanings for these words that, when put together with your experiences as you have explained them, could lead to a self-consistent worldview, and bring you a measure of peace on this subject.
I think perhaps a huge key is to study/pray/think/mediate on the source of that undeniable, deep feeling. Where is it coming from? Why do you feel that way? In my mind there are 2 possible answers.
1) It is coming from God.
2) It is coming from you.
Which is it? I have my personal opinions, but those wouldn’t mean much to you. I would suggest that you include looking at people who have very different beliefs than you who feel the same way about what they believe as part of your study though…
bc_pg wrote:In my mind there are 2 possible answers.
1) It is coming from God.
2) It is coming from you.
both! seriously.1) In the final Harry Potter book, there is a point where Harry says to Dumbledore something like, “Is this real, or is it all in my head?” Dumbledore’s answer is something like, “Of course, it’s all in your head – but that doesn’t make it any less real.” 2) In Sunday School today, the teacher said that each person needs to figure out what he or she believes at the most fundamental level and base their own faith from there. He is a scientist and a former Bishop – someone who appears to be a stereotypical TBM in most ways.
3) Don’t fight what you “know”. Figure out the implications as they make sense to you, and then own your own interpretation. Iow, act – rather than allowing yourself to be acted upon. Be an agent unto yourself, even as you continue to be part of a community.
wayfarer wrote:bc_pg wrote:In my mind there are 2 possible answers.
1) It is coming from God.
2) It is coming from you.
both! seriously.
Like
Old-Timer wrote:“Of course, it’s all in your head – but that doesn’t make it any less real.”
Double like.
Quote:I think perhaps a huge key is to study/pray/think/mediate on the source of that undeniable, deep feeling. Where is it coming from? Why do you feel that way?
In my mind there are 2 possible answers.
1) It is coming from God.
2) It is coming from you.
How do we know? I would be really interested in hearing what others have to say about this. I am thinking in particular of the promise in Moroni 10:4 that if one asks if the Book of Mormon is true or not that he/she will get answer, usually expected to be yes (if humbled and with true intent, etc.). But I wonder if this is the proper approach in praying about such an issue (or any issues, I suppose). Is putting the question in such a stark yes/no, either/or format the correct approach? And, this is the heart of the question for me, does the format itself set us up for hearing what we want to hear? That is what I am trying to get at. And, if so, is there another way of seeking out such answers through prayer?
Welcome! There in there lies the irony. If a person recieves the revolution or answer that it is true then what? It’s true inspiringly? It’s historically true? It’s true but has some inaccuracy from being written down by humans who being human and not writing it down as it happens(and the brain being what it is and does with age and time) the memery more vague then at the time of the event that took place? Now it doesn’t seem so easy the answer. True? True in what sense? I’m not saying this to sound confusing but it really is how I feel the answer can get misinterpreted. I don’t know. What I do know is that it doesn’t have to be all true or even historical (or Historicly accurate) to give significant meaning and purpose to it in my life. To me it helps me be a better person and that’s all that really matters to me. That and to reject anything that can be disproven and accept things that give meaning to our lives in a spiritual and positive way. If people want to defend the honor or what ever they feel they need to with the BOM that’s fine. But to me those semantics are really illrelavent. It will all be sorted out in the end. I’m just here on earth to do the best I can and love my fellow spiritual brothers and sisters and love god(does it really matter what he looks like?) I think by just being here on this site shows in express in interest to try to figure it all out. We may never do that until die and that’s fine. It’s the struggle of the journey and profession that is the important thing.
Hey, curt. As far as knowing, I try to keep it simple. If I feel good about something, especially if the feelings are persistent, then I go with it. Maybe think of this – isn’t at least 95% of church history good? I think we can feel things are true, and they are indeed true for us, even if they are not factually/historically accurate. If you feel like Joseph Smith is a prophet-figure to you, then your soul/higher-self/whatever you want to call it is attracted to some of his ideas, or at least the audacious nature of his claims. Maybe some other things from JS repulse you too. I doesn’t have to be all or nothing.
I think JS was a prophet. I just don’t think of that exactly they way I did perhaps 10 years ago. It means something different to me now. For one thing, it doesn’t mean that every possible idea or person who branched off of him was 100% correct. I don’t even think Joseph was right all the time. When he was right, he was inspiring. When he was wrong, he was wrong (and sometimes a scoundrel for it). I’m pretty messed up myself, so I can related to that
😈 What do you do with that? *shrug* I don’t know. You just follow your heart and your intellect as honestly as you can, doing the best you can with life. That’s all we can do. And that has to be good enough.
Go back and take the attitude that you belong in the Church for some reason, and then emphasize the parts you believe. That’s what I do now, and it seems to be working for the time being.
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