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Just wanted to get some perspectives, generally, about how to deal with chronic situations in your life or family that simply will not unlock. I have had one for the last 20 years that simply will not go away. If I manage it with all my might, it improves, but then the second I slack off it a bit, or get distracted due to life’s competing demands, then the problem comes back again in full force. (The problem is day-to-day mess in the house) It causes myself and my daughter a lot of angst — to the point she is in tears at times. And it makes me want to scream inside half the time. I cope with it through sheer endurance.
Changing others in the family who will not cooperate unless goaded after(they are the source of the problem) is not the answer. They refuse to change unless I turn into the authoritarian and create more conflict that only worsens the situation.
I’m not really looking for solutions to the problem of “how do you keep your house clean as a family”. I have gone that route, read multiple books, tried multiple routines, spoken to multiple people. My interest is in strategies for keeping your inner peace when life throws you chronic problems that seem not to go away even after decades of trying.
Some quick thoughts from my own experiences living with messies: when other areas in my life are really stressing me or making me feel out of control ….work,finances, etc. the messes left by the messies can make me feel very ballistic/depressed all at the same time. Recognizing this helps me to rein it back in. I have actually timed how long it takes me to do certain clean up things. That helps when I realize it really only takes 5 minutes to do this other thing behind this other person.
Perspective: A friend was very upset over some situations with her son getting married. It was major hurt and frustration. Then, one of the son’s friends died suddenly. The next time she saw me, she said the hurtful situations were nothing. The death of the other young man brought it to a different perspective. She is just glad to still have her son in her life.
An older woman in RS years ago caught my attention when I was a young adult. The teacher and a few others were talking about overload and one woman related she didn’t even answer her door when her VT’ers came that week. She was just fed up and tired with people. The older woman spoke up and said it wasn’t that many years ago she was in their shoes and all of a sudden, she was a widow, alone and few visits from anyone.
I don’t know if any of this is helpful to you or not. Just throwing out what has been workable to me to give me inner peace.
As much as I can get online I think I will need to watch this thread. My family nucleus is currently stuck in the in-laws’ house and it has turned out to be a toxic environment: the place is choked with junk and the spirit of contention is a constant companion, even though these are outwardly respectable and faithful (or maybe fanatical?) members of the church. So I don’t have much to offer in the way of advice, but I too would like to read what others may offer. SD, I understand that situation personally. Here is the thread I wrote a while ago about it: http://forum.staylds.com/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=238&hilit=my+marriage+as+a+metaphor Short summary:
I live with it and do the best I can.
There was a movie with Jennifer Connely and Ben Kingsley called “the House of Fog and Sand” which I think might be better named “The House of Bricks and Sand” based on what you wrote. Really, you are suggesting the cost/benefit analysis. In your case, the bricks outweigh the sand, so you tolerate it and work as much as you can with it. My problem is that often, the sand outweighs the bricks. Like after a hard week, I want to enjoy my home but there is a five hour cleaning job while people in the house won’t move off the couch as they watch television….
I think part of it, for me, is the thread someone mentioned about men putting their homes in order. There are times when I feel like a real let-down as a father when I can’t seem to get this situation under control. I’ve tried everything and it works for a while, and then goes back to normal — which is messes in every room. So the task is to simply learn to be at peace within it…
The hard part was when my daughter, who I love dearly told me she was going to move out as soon as she could because she doesn’t like the mess and lack of cooperation. She had actually figured out how much a studio apartment is, and she’s only 13 years old. Her room is immaculate and she helps me at times…that part really saddened me…
But the key is — how to cope when you have people that you know will not change, including my son who is only 9 years old and throws a fit if you ask him to clean something up.
No you can’t make people change. 
Another thing that I did when my first business was doing very well was hire help. I know we think in this country that help is only for the super rich, but I reasoned this: I can pay someone $8 an hour to clean my house. When I work, I make $X.XX and hour. I am losing $X.XX an hour by doing my own housework. So it worked for me. But I suppose that logic only works if you are self employed and are the one who does your own housework. Or maybe if you figure the math for what overtime would pay and use those housecleaning hours to work instead.
But kids do need to learn responsibility or picking up their own crap. I am infamous for going around with trash bags and confiscating anything they haven’t picked up. They can’t earn it back without doing extra chores. And if they messed with someone else’s stuff or left another mess for someone else, I go and take the equivalent from their room. Don’t fight, don’t yell, just make stuff disappear. But you probably read that kind of tactic somewhere too. And yes you have to be always vigilant or it falls apart pretty easily. If I am extra busy or sick for a few days it’s a battled again. They never stop testing you. In which case you can go to your corner of sanity and try to live in denial for a while.
Ragdoll — i like the advice. I think I practice some of that to cope. Our living room is generally clean, and easy to fix up if it gets messy – a corner of sanity. I will often attach priviledges to cleaning. Kids are notorious for wanting things from you. Often, I will say “sure I’ll drive you to Walmart to get binder dividers, but you need to put all your dishes away first”. My son gets paid for cleaning my car if he wants me to buy something. One thing I do — in the rare moments I watch television, I fold the laundry if it’s out after being dried.
And I rely on my daughter — she is highly organized and sometimes she helps me throw away stuff.
Can you hire someone to help? Years ago when we were struggling with controlling the mess and our children were small we paid a woman in our ward to come in a couple of days a week to fold laundry and do some light housekeeping. It helped us out and she needed the extra cash. In any event, I completely sympathize. My wife has never been tidy and all our children take after her. Be grateful you have one tidy child. None of mine are. I also second ragdolls advice of areas of sanity. Also you children are young enough still to teach them respect for their things and other peoples. My brother is a huge natural mess….my parents allowed his room to be as chaotic as he pleased, however their was a short list of things he needed to do to earn tv or video games each day, and if he didn’t have clean clothes he wore dirty ones for a day and then he had to do all of his laundry after school. They would also do what ragdoll said and pick up his items he left laying around and put in a bag which he had to go without for a 2 days. He learned quickly that he liked his shoes and coats. This was done with no emotion, no yelling, no lecture just a simple you know the rule and consequence choose something different next time when he pitched a fit. Alot like real life. If you are more at a stage of needing to accept things, then try to let it go. Take an alnon approach…accept what you can not change and change what you can. Easier said than done I know!
I pay someone to come in when I’m ready to nnap. I’ve only done it twice, but it resets the house. Last time, I put together family cleaning guidelines and layed down the law, and things got better for a while. Quote:“Some trials are meant to be overcome, some trials are meant to be lived with”
Hi SD, i know too well that living situation because i have been in it myself. i couldn’t tolerate it any longer and moved out. there were other reasons i ended that marriage but that was definitely one of the big issues. the mother in law was no help and developed a real hate on for me for leaving her daughter – but i did so for my own sanity.
there is also the very real possiblity you or some of your kids function better in a mess or subscribe to “organized chaos”…me and mom for instance always fought on this point. while i do like certain parts of the house clean….kitchen and bathrooms for instance. my room i really do not care and have no method to its organization….what to her looked like a mess was a clear stack of stuff that i knew was right there and its proper place was right there not on a shelf in a box in the closet because in my mind the closet was clothes and everything else i didnt need immediate access to it. living on my own now i realize i am comfortable with a half way clean house approach. it is not spotless but it is not terrible either because if it is spotless within 2 minutes i will trash the place how or why is a mystery….but if it is halfway clean i wont trash it but ill actually maintain it. dont know why but that is simply how my brain functions. there is also a chance you guys on some level enjoy the constant fighting over the mess it is what is your “normal”. for instance you cant just quit smoking as smoking is part of your “normal” you must create a new normal that no longer includes smoking. a better example might be an alcoholic his normal can no longer include frequent trips to the bar. he must make a new one. and it is very hard to make a new one….when quite frankly a messy house has been perfectly livable for all these many years there is no real desire to change it in some sense.
as long as you are not like the people on hoarders with bags of feces laying around i think your mess is probably in the realm of ok. though subscribing to organized chaos is a fine balancing act.
though your fundamental question of chronic problems that do not go away is a good one i am wondering about some of mine personally.
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