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Hi all, I wanted to see how you it gone for you today (assuming your unit is on schedule).
The first vision is a bit of a contentious topic for me. We teach it as a very simple, linear process. We put massive weight on what Joseph learned, when his writing would suggest he only realised the significance of the nature of God much later. Like the Book of Mormon, the first vision is one of those things that was largely ignored in the 19th C, but has been set up in the 20 & 21st C as one of the ‘sudden-death, make or break’ principles of being a good, TBM Mormon.
I kept quiet for most of it (biting tongue occasionally), apart from to make a couple of observations.
One point I made was that the ‘apostacy’ was perhaps a good thing. Unless the early church was restricted to a small space, with tight control, in an era of slow travel and communication, local adaptation was always going to happen. The more it was able to adapt to (or be manipulated by) local culture, the quicker it could spread. This meant the message of Jesus Christ had the opportunity to reach more people, more quickly. I hinted at the fact that as our church grows and times change we should also be prepared for certain adaptations to make it locally relevant. I wish I’d made the last point more clearly. I also wish that last point was more acceptable. I love a bishop who sees the handbooks as most useful for a wedge to stop his desk wobbling. I’ve had a few, those are the units where actually seem to focus on being more like Jesus and less like corporate drones.
When asked what truths the churches of Joseph’s day already had ‘right’ I pointed out that one reason why the church baptised so many from a Methodist background is that it’s a natural step, given their beliefs are close to ours. E.g. they consider grace to save us, but in co-operation with our contribution. (There were a few other similarities in 1800s, I need to read up on it).
A lot of the lesson focused on the preparation of the world in the years preceding the first vision. Printing press, open theology, increased literacy, Smith family being poor, mobile and religiously inquisitive (it mention Azrael Smith, JS Jr’s grandfather and his prophecy about a descendant making a big religious impact). There were a few others (and lots more that weren’t mentioned that are less well known).
As I sat there it occurred to me that everything we point to preparing the way for him to be prophet could also be listed as things that made Joseph’s ideas and claims a product of his environment.
Whether someone sees the foundational events as a produced by the environment of the day or as God-guided events to prepare the way will be down to their underlying attitude to the whole claims to restoration.
You stated, Quote:I’ve had a few, those are the units where actually seem to focus on being more like Jesus and less like corporate drones.
I miss those wards as well. It seems like the Church is trying really hard to get people to be that way, but the church has too many business meetings, and not enough spiritual “Day of Pentecost” type events.
I missed out on the First Vision lesson, but here are some of my experiences and thoughts with it.
Back in the 1990s I was a TBM when it came to the First Vision, but now I see it as the back of the $2 bill.
On the back of the $2 is the founding myth of the United States of America where all the founding fathers got together and signed the Declaration on the first Independence Day. Well, it didn’t really happen like that it is just easier to depict it in such idealic way. It was more of an arduous process to get the certain colonists to sign it and it wasn’t this monumental epoch day on July 4, 1776. It actually happened either the 2, or 3rd and thereafter.
First of all JS didn’t like to tell his First Vision, it was private and very personal thing. Then when he did tell it there are variants depending on the purpose of the telling and who his audience was. In my Institute Class on the D&C I was shocked to discover that the First Vision wasn’t promulgated in the Church until 1880. I guess by then the brethren realized what implications it had in the face of the Christendom that followed the Creeds. The first Vision is the very antithesis of the Nicene Creed. It is used as a missionary tract to take on the creeds and support that Joseph is a prophet even though a reading of the Book of Mormon does it for some. What’s interesting is that when I was a DL in the mission, one of the investigators totally forgot the FV, and when I asked him what were his reasons for believing that JS was a prophet, the investigator remarked, because of that Book the Elders gave me.
What I don’t like is how everyone thinks JS is the only prophet that saw either God or Jesus. The Current Prophets and Apostles won’t mention their visions (if they have some), I would like to believe that they do. But what purpose would they serve?
What’s interesting is if you read the current Lorenzo Snow manual, Lorenzo Snow testified that he “actually saw the Savior . . . in the Temple, and talked with HIm face to face.” The occasion was to reorganize the Priesthood upon the death of Wilford Woodruff in Sept. 1898. What’s interesting is that the Lord at that occasion tells Lorenzo Snow to reorganize the First Presidency quickly and not to wait like other Presidents did. [See Teachings of the Presidents of the Church p. 27] So I wonder: Are Some Prophets more in tune than others? The answer would be yes, otherwise the appearance of the Savior wouldn’t make any sense. I also wonder if the rise of mental health professionals has something to do with not stating that you have seen a vision.
I sometimes felt a bit uncomfortable sharing the First Vision with others because it was something so personal to Joseph. I felt that some people weren’t even prepared for it and felt like I was casting a pearl before swine. I don’t like the fact that we get so casual in the sharing of it, that we overlook the significance of it. I had one convert tell me that he missed believing in God in an abstract way and he thought God as an “ideal” was something more significant to him then as “just another man.” I took this in and thought for a moment, maybe he’s right. Maybe viewing God as “too human,” diminishes who He really is. Then I realized that he didn’t understand the principle of Exaltation. Because without the gospel principle of Exaltation, the First Vision doesn’t really make any sense to those who believe in the Creeds of Christendom. To most Christians God is only a Father figuratively and not spiritually or literally like we believe.
I really agree with your point, Jamison, that most Christians don’t believe God is our literal or spiritual father. Like most Christians believe the Bible is the only scripture they’ll ever be. Great post jamison – gave me something to think about. If this was a ‘too sacred to mention’ experience then it would provide a reasonable explanation for why it took 12 years to write it down and why the early versions were a lot more vague.
I don’t attend Gospel Doctrine, since I teach a youth class, but I asked our Gospel Doctrine teacher how it went. He used all of the first person accounts and talked about how they compare and contrast – and what we can learn about the reception and interpretation of personal revelation from those multiple accounts.
He’s a former Bishop.
Old-Timer wrote:I don’t attend Gospel Doctrine, since I teach a youth class, but I asked our Gospel Doctrine teacher how it went.
He used all of the first person accounts and talked about how they compare and contrast – and what we can learn about the reception and interpretation of personal revelation from those multiple accounts.
He’s a former Bishop.
Including 1832?
Man… I have ward envy. They have a radical like you teaching the youth and some guy willing to dig out the ‘dirty laundry’ in Adult Sunday School.
and three members of the Bishopric who would be considered orthodox by all reasonable members I know how fortunate I am, but I also know what can happen when differing views are expressed humbly, respectfully, meekly and with conviction – by people who really do love those whose views are different.
So I decided to do FHE on the first vision as well. I started having everyone write an account of a hike that had been particularly memorable the summer before last (we ended up spending the night sleeping in a ditch). Then we all read our accounts and compared them to each other, and noted how every account left out and included things that the other’s did not.
I then talked about the fact that there are different accounts of the First Vision, and in every account Joseph Smith left out and included things that at other times he did not.
I wasn’t going to bring up the fact that some of the accounts talk about Moroni visiting, until my youngest said: “I forget which one the first vision is, is that the one when Moroni came?” My daughter said, “No, that is the one when Heavenly Father and Jesus came”. I corrected them and said sometimes Joseph Smith did say that Moroni came. That was news to everyone except me, but hopefully lays the groundwork so that when my children hear it again, it won’t be a shock.
I then asked them to talk about what important lessons we can learn from the first vision.
rebeccad wrote:So I decided to do FHE on the first vision as well.
I started having everyone write an account of a hike that had been particularly memorable the summer before last (we ended up spending the night sleeping in a ditch). Then we all read our accounts and compared them to each other, and noted how every account left out and included things that the other’s did not.
I then talked about the fact that there are different accounts of the First Vision, and in every account Joseph Smith left out and included things that at other times he did not.
I wasn’t going to bring up the fact that some of the accounts talk about Moroni visiting, until my youngest said: “I forget which one the first vision is, is that the one when Moroni came?” My daughter said, “No, that is the one when Heavenly Father and Jesus came”. I corrected them and said sometimes Joseph Smith did say that Moroni came. That was news to everyone except me, but hopefully lays the groundwork so that when my children hear it again, it won’t be a shock.
I then asked them to talk about what important lessons we can learn from the first vision.
Good on you
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