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Today my wife called me at work and asked if I would go to the temple with her tonight. I said no; what I didn’t say is that I’ve had enough of the temple for now. I’m tired of watching the same show over and over, and not getting anything out of it. Ditto for the other ordinances. It’s hours in my day that could be spent on more productive pursuits. I have told her at other times (well, actually every time we go) that I don’t enjoy the temple, and that I don’t feel anything special while I’m there. I do enjoy the Celestial Room, mostly cause it’s quiet and gives me time to reflect on my life. But going through the whole rigamaroll to get to the CR just isn’t worth it. I’d rather get up into the mountains and find a nice quiet spot there.
How have others dealt with this issue? I can tell it really worries my wife, and I don’t want to drive a wedge between us. For our entire marriage, I’ve just gone, but I’m at the end of my rope on this one…
Tough issue. I don’t know how to answer. Compromise? If she wants to go once a month tell her you’ll go every other month? What’s more important to you? Doing something productive or making her happy? I know it’s not so simple as this as always doing what you don’t want builds resentment. Personally, I haven’t been back to the temple since I was deep into my faith crises. I wasn’t avoiding it, we just don’t go often. I’ll be going in the next couple weeks. I”m actually looking forward to it as I think it will be fun going into it with the non literal mentality that I have now about the whole thing. I’d be interested to know what you do and how it works out.. My wife and I still struggle quite a bit on our differences of faith and I’m always happy to learn from others mistakes. 😯 Well, some thoughts, but keep in mind, I haven’t had a temple recommend for something like 12 or 13 years. I don’t go, because I don’t have a temple recommend. If you have a recommend, and are able to go, one approach to take is to go less often, like once every quarter… and do it as a celebration of your wife’s faith and devotion, and in an effort to connect with her, more than with the temple itself. If she goes more frequently, fine, but you ought to be able to sit through it 4 times a year, and then enjoy extra time in the celestial room. Go to dinner afterwards, so that it will feel more agreeable to you.
I love the temple, but that’s because I put my body on auto-pilot and let my mind take me wherever it goes. I’ve had some great contemplation and enlightenment with that approach – which is what I personally think the temple is all about anyway. So, I have no advice for you other than to echo what On Own Now said:
Go regularly but less often than your wife goes, specifically as a sign of your love and respect for her.
One of the things I used to do to keep myself interested in the endowment was to start the process picking a random role in my life (father, husband, boss, employee, friend, church calling) and think ‘given this is a parable, what can I learn from it to be a better ‘father’ (or boss, friend etc). I agree with Ray. Use it as a place of quiet contemplation. No reason you need to focus on the ceremony, just use it as a time that you can meditate on other things. And being married to “one of us” as a TBM can be really difficult as well, sometimes it is helpful to do things that make it a little easier.
Thanks for all your replies. I didn’t end up going the other night, but I thought about what each of you said, and talked more with my wife about it. Although she doesn’t understand my feelings, and I don’t really understand hers, we agreed to disagree on this one. We didn’t really come to any resolution, but I told her I’m willing to go as a way of showing my love for her. She wasn’t completely appeased by this, but said she’s appreciative of the gesture. Not really sure how it’s all going to play out, but you’ve given me some coping tips to work with as I muddle through. Thanks.
I know the temple is pretty much an amalgam of Joseph Smith’s translation of genesis intermixed with masonic ritual. I don’t believe the genesis account, and I hardly think the masonic ritual had anything to do with Solomon’s temple. yet…I love the temple. I love the ritual — i take it seriously, even if I know it’s not real.
Confucius is often considered a secular humanist. Indeed he seldom talked about religion or spiritual things. Yet there was a deep spirituality in all he did. I do not think he intellectually believed in the sacrifice for ancestors that was part of the Shang religion practiced by his people. Yet listen to the words of the Lun Yu — The Analects of Confucius:
Confucius, in the Lun Yu, wrote:Some one asked the meaning of the great sacrifice. The Master said, “I do not know. He who knew its meaning would find it as easy to govern the kingdom as to look on this;— pointing to his palm.
He sacrificed to the dead, as if they were present. He sacrificed to the spirits, as if the spirits were present.
The Master said, “I consider my not being present at the sacrifice, as if I did not sacrifice.”
Wang-sun Chia asked, saying, “What is the meaning of the saying, “It is better to pay court to the furnace than to the south-west corner?”“
The Master said, “Not so. He who offends against Heaven has none to whom he can pray.”
I believe that as we participate in the ritual, whether it be the temple or the sacrament, we are doing something deeply meaningful and significant. It has nothing to do with the stated words or purpose — it is something we feel within. When we intellectualize these things, something profoundly limbic is lost.Thanks wayfarer, great post. The number of changes that have been made to the endowment convinces me that this is very much a man-made parable.
But it’s a man-made parable that is beautiful to me. I believe the man who made it and the men who changed it were inspired to do so. Inspired by God or their internal spirit (or what wayfarer calls the god within).
Given some of the strong parallels of the endowment to the ceremonies of Egyptian temple priests, early christians and early fraternities helps me feel that other men have had the same internal/external sources of inspiration to create interactive parables.
not been for 10 years – are kindles frowned upon?? brit-exmo wrote:not been for 10 years – are kindles frowned upon??
in the temple, all things of the world are set aside. There are no mobile phones, kindles, ipads, books, even your personal scriptures are set aside. My clothing changes from worldly attire to pure white: all people are equal in the temple, and the entire point is to be a place separate from the world.The temple works as a refuge to the world, a place of serious and quiet contemplation, and as a spiritual feast only to the extent that I take it most seriously. Regardless of the apparent “man-made” origin of the temple rite, humans have for tens of thousands of years been participating in rites — there is something mystical that speaks to me in the mythical nature of the rite. When I bring a sense of wonder and humility, of awe, into the temple, I feel of its spirit and power. It cannot be explained.
To me, every aspect of going to the temple is rich with personal symbolism. Even the most mundane aspects become symbols of a larger spiritual context. Nothing said in the temple is literal, nor should it be. When I realize the power of the myth and set aside the literal, I come back into the Faith more ready to understand the symbols of my faith and set aside the literalism that flaws my understanding — that causes my disaffection. In this Way, the temple becomes my anchor in a Faithful Middle Way.
In Laotzu, there is a statement: 道者，万物之奥 – dao zhe, wan wu zhi ao. One might translate this, “The Way is the “Hidden Mystery” of all things”, or in particular, “The Way is the Sanctuary of all things”. but in my impression, it’s completely untranslatable, almost ineffible, because of one completely amazing word, “奥 ao”. While the term often means “mystery”, it is used in the transliteration of “alpha and omega”, and it is functionally symilar to the sanskrit “Om”. It is the Amen of prayer, the I AM. Even some translators call it “the Sacred”, or “the Sanctuary”. Without going into arcane details of ancient chinese, their sense and use of “is” is complete reflexive: to say, the Way is the Sanctuary is also to say the Sanctuary is the Way.
Whatever the meaning of this deeply mystical statement, the concept is clear: the mysterious appears incomprehensible to the mind, yet the inner-mind, the god within, feels completely at home in the Sanctuary, because the God within, when it is a god, is one with the Way. The temple of the mind is the residence of the God within; the temples of the Saints are the home of the collective God of the Saints, the “I AM”. That such things are sacred, mysterious, even ineffible, is entirely consistent with the way the Saints think about the temple. When we put the shoes from off of our feet, and cast aside the cares of the world, we enter the Sanctuary of the Gods. When we allow our conscious minds to quiet down and become one with the god within, and do so in the collective oneness of the Saints through quiet meditation in the Temple, the gods unite with us as we enter into their presence, and we are One.
I love the temple. Every aspect of it. It represents Zion, and the covenants I make there lead me to Zion, at least in my heart.
alltruth wrote:Today my wife called me at work and asked if I would go to the temple with her tonight. I said no; what I didn’t say is that I’ve had enough of the temple for now. I’m tired of watching the same show over and over, and not getting anything out of it. Ditto for the other ordinances. It’s hours in my day that could be spent on more productive pursuits.
I have told her at other times (well, actually every time we go) that I don’t enjoy the temple, and that I don’t feel anything special while I’m there. I do enjoy the Celestial Room, mostly cause it’s quiet and gives me time to reflect on my life. But going through the whole rigamaroll to get to the CR just isn’t worth it. I’d rather get up into the mountains and find a nice quiet spot there.
How have others dealt with this issue? I can tell it really worries my wife, and I don’t want to drive a wedge between us. For our entire marriage, I’ve just gone, but I’m at the end of my rope on this one…
I do not prefer the endowment. I hate feeling like I am the slowest at working through the process and feel like all eyes are on me.
I do like the washings and annointings. I also like Baptisms for the dead. Is there a ordinance you do like. Where you could go and do that one part. Also you can ask to spend time in the celestial room without going through an endowment. Just ask. If your told no, ask a member of the temple presidency. This shouldn’t be an issue.
wayfarer wrote:
in the temple, all things of the world are set aside. There are no mobile phones, kindles, ipads, books, even your personal scriptures are set aside. My clothing changes from worldly attire to pure white: all people are equal in the temple, and the entire point is to be a place separate from the world.The temple works as a refuge to the world, a place of serious and quiet contemplation, and as a spiritual feast only to the extent that I take it most seriously. Regardless of the apparent “man-made” origin of the temple rite, humans have for tens of thousands of years been participating in rites — there is something mystical that speaks to me in the mythical nature of the rite. When I bring a sense of wonder and humility, of awe, into the temple, I feel of its spirit and power. It cannot be explained.
To me, every aspect of going to the temple is rich with personal symbolism. Even the most mundane aspects become symbols of a larger spiritual context. Nothing said in the temple is literal, nor should it be. When I realize the power of the myth and set aside the literal, I come back into the Faith more ready to understand the symbols of my faith and set aside the literalism that flaws my understanding — that causes my disaffection. In this Way, the temple becomes my anchor in a Faithful Middle Way.
In Laotzu, there is a statement: 道者，万物之奥 – dao zhe, wan wu zhi ao. One might translate this, “The Way is the “Hidden Mystery” of all things”, or in particular, “The Way is the Sanctuary of all things”. but in my impression, it’s completely untranslatable, almost ineffible, because of one completely amazing word, “奥 ao”. While the term often means “mystery”, it is used in the transliteration of “alpha and omega”, and it is functionally symilar to the sanskrit “Om”. It is the Amen of prayer, the I AM. Even some translators call it “the Sacred”, or “the Sanctuary”. Without going into arcane details of ancient chinese, their sense and use of “is” is complete reflexive: to say, the Way is the Sanctuary is also to say the Sanctuary is the Way.
Whatever the meaning of this deeply mystical statement, the concept is clear: the mysterious appears incomprehensible to the mind, yet the inner-mind, the god within, feels completely at home in the Sanctuary, because the God within, when it is a god, is one with the Way. The temple of the mind is the residence of the God within; the temples of the Saints are the home of the collective God of the Saints, the “I AM”. That such things are sacred, mysterious, even ineffible, is entirely consistent with the way the Saints think about the temple. When we put the shoes from off of our feet, and cast aside the cares of the world, we enter the Sanctuary of the Gods. When we allow our conscious minds to quiet down and become one with the god within, and do so in the collective oneness of the Saints through quiet meditation in the Temple, the gods unite with us as we enter into their presence, and we are One.
I love the temple. Every aspect of it. It represents Zion, and the covenants I make there lead me to Zion, at least in my heart.
To quote a former british prime “I agree with Nick.” (I mean wayfarer, and if your real name happens to be Nick, trust that it’s pure coincidence).
My advice is to do something different each time an not just another endowment. Bishop, I didn’t know you could go to the celestial room without having to participate in endowments. I always thought they were required for the celestial room.
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