My talk for tomorrow

Possibly.

Ray could get away with it…I never could.

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2

You could also say it was different depending on the audience.

:clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:

I am so happy for you.

A serving middle-way SP would be awesome.

I know personally of at least three.

The talk we t really well. I even mentioned that when JS translated the BOM that. He used a different process than what is shown in the picture the church usually shows. The SP was there and he said it was a great talk and when I asked him if it was too much he said no and that it was about what he expected from me. I talked about how we need to accept people who believes differently then the mainstream. It was good day.

There needs to be more of this in church. The fear of the past needs to stop. We need to embrace what happened and not try and hide it. I think things are moving this way, but slowly. Very, very slowly.

Good on ya church0333!! :clap: :clap: :clap:

How did it go over? Care to post a transcript?

The talk went well. Here it is.

Brothers and Sister it is nice to be with you this morning. It is nice to speak to my home ward because through the years I have felt your love, support and your friendship. Some of the best friends I have ever had are in this ward and their kindness and understanding and overall goodness has helped me in so many ways. I have spoken many times in this ward and and I am sure that many of you know that I speak from my heart more than I speak from the scriptures. I was told by a few other high councilman, when I first got called, that the talks are pretty easy to prepare if I were to use the church website to gather my information and then quote the church leaders while adding some of my own thoughts. For some reason that just doesn’t work for me very well so I spend a lot of time thinking and worrying about what I am going to say but in the end I hope that it is a message that uplifts, inspirers, and causes you to think. I hope that you go home and talk about what you hear in your different meetings today.

My message today will be on the apostasy and the restoration. I want to be upfront with you today. I want to do this because I trust my leaders and because I trust you as ward members, because you as a whole have shown great love and support. Ever since coming back from Iraq and with some other events in my life involving the death of a young man, my mother in law and my daughter my faith has been challenged like at no other time. I love the Lord and the church and when looking for answers to strengthen my faith and resolve some of my issues and also researching my speaking assignments I have found other things that have made me question and maybe doubt even more. As I have been working through all of this there has been times of depression but also of great joy and a real sense of peace and clearness of mind. It has, at times, felt very liberating and it has giving me a much better understanding of those that struggle with their faith and church attendance and commitment to the church and the gospel. It has helped me to relate to my own children. It has also made me realize the importance of Christ in my life and His love for me as a person looking to return to His presence some day. It has made me look at what my expectations and assumptions of how I thought things involving the church were maybe wrong. My black and white thinking, which was very safe and required very little work on my part no longer works for me and I have discovered that there are shades of gray and even bright colors. This has been a journey of great pain to be honest with you and one I hope most of you will not have to make. But these things have made me the person who I am today for better or worse and I like who I am. I think that I am a good man, even with my many flaws and that I have a message to share. It might make some a little uncomfortable and I apologize for that in advance but I have found that it also has helped others to know that they are not alone in their struggles and doubts. Some times I wonder if I am considered by others to be heading toward apostasy because of my questions and doubts. Apostasy is a Greek word for apostasia and means literally” to stand apart from” and I will admit that at times I feel that I stand apart from what I hear at church. Apostasy also means “to rebel against“ or “to revolt” and I want to assure you that I am not there by any standard. I have told you all these things because I feel a need to be honest with you and with myself and because it fit in very well to the topic at hand.

Supported by scripture and the words of prophets, The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints teaches unequivocally that there was an apostasy from the Lord’s one and only true church following the deaths of Christ’s early Apostles. So thorough was this apostasy that the original Church of Jesus Christ was supplanted by an institution having a form of godliness but devoid of priesthood power and priesthood keys.

Knowledge of this apostasy underscores two other truths proclaimed by The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. First, one purpose of the Lord’s true church in any age has been to prepare Saints through participation in sacred ordinances to stand in the presence of Almighty God. Second, a restoration of power and authority to perform those ordinances was not only necessary but actually occurred through the instrumentality of Joseph Smith, Jr., beginning in 1820.

There is no question that the authority from God to guide and preside over the Church of Jesus Christ resided in the Apostles of the Lord. Jesus reminded the Quorum of the Twelve of this fact on different occasions. For example, he said to Peter, one week before they stood together on the Mount of Transfiguration: “I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall loosed in heaven” (Matt. 16:19).

This, and more, did indeed transpire on the holy mount. The Twelve had been given the Melchizedek Priesthood a year earlier when they were ordained Apostles and sent on missions (see Matt. 10). But the keys of the priesthood (the powers of presidency needed to direct how and when the priesthood should be used) were not transferred to them until that fall season six months before the Savior’s crucifixion. The Prophet Joseph Smith said, “The Savior, Moses, and Elias, gave the keys to Peter, James and John, on the mount, when they were transfigured before him.”

One thing the Lord did not give to his apostles was the Church Hand book of Instruction or any how to build my church manuals. There were no corporate lawyers, CEOs or University presidents chosen by Jesus. He chose fishermen, a tax collector and other simple and humble followers to be his apostles. One would betray him and one would deny him three times in the last days of his life even though he had witnessed many miracles that the master had performed. None of the apostles would believe the women that went to the tomb and discovered that the Savior was resurrected even though Jesus had told them that would happen. The apostle Thomas, some times referred to as doubting Thomas would only believe when he saw and touched the scars in the Savior’s hands and feet. It makes me feel better knowing that even those closest to Jesus questioned at times. Even with their weaknesses these men moved forward after receiving the Holy Ghost and spread the message of the Savior first to the Jews and then to the Gentiles. These apostles organized a church and had a following. The Apostles preached all over that part of the world and the message was received by many but still their numbers were small in comparison to rest of the population. With time the Apostles died or were killed but before the Apostle Paul said good-bye for the last time to some of the members of the Church he had grown to love so deeply on his missionary journeys, he gave them this chilling warning of things to befall the growing body of disciples:

“I know this, that after my departing shall grievous wolves enter in among you, not sparing the flock.

“Also of your own selves shall men arise, speaking perverse things, to draw away disciples after them” (Acts 20:29–30).

This may be the most pointed description in all scripture of how the great apostasy of the early Church came about. It may also be the most important key to understanding how to recognize and avoid apostasy in modern times. Surely Paul knew that the apostasy that would significantly change the Lord’s church was not going to be a gradual drift from divine truth or a waning interest in gospel principles. Nor would it be well-meaning but erroneous activity on the part of a few misguided souls. As I said earlier Apostasy means literally “to stand apart from,” “to rebel against,” or “to revolt.” Apostasy is a conscious act of rebellion against God by deliberately attempting to change divinely appointed doctrine and practice and by opposing God’s chosen leaders. Paul foresaw that once the Apostles met their demise, the demise of the true Church would follow.

Paul used the analogy of wolves rending the flock of God to describe the thoroughly destructive nature of religious rebellion. Furthermore, he declared without equivocation that apostasy was an internal phenomenon. It was born of the desires of certain members to exalt themselves, to step into the limelight and gather their own group of followers: “of your own selves shall men arise, speaking perverse things, to draw away disciples after them” (Acts 20:30; emphasis added). Nephi of old may have labeled it something else (that is, priestcraft), but he outlined the same basic ingredient of apostasy—pride.

“He [the Lord] commandeth that there shall be no priestcrafts; for, behold, priestcrafts are that men preach and set themselves up for a light unto the world, that they may get gain and praise of the world; but they seek not the welfare of Zion” (2 Ne. 26:29).

After the death of the Apostles and the corruption in the church we are taught that the priesthood was lost and that revelation ceased to the church as a whole but as Dallin H Oaks said in one of his talks when speaking about those that still tried to follow the teachings of the Savior. He said the following: “We believe that most religious leaders and followers are sincere believers who love God and understand and serve him to the best of their abilities. We are indebted to the men and women who kept the light of faith and learning alive through the centuries to the present day. We have only to contrast the lesser light that exists among peoples unfamiliar with the names of God and Jesus Christ to realize the great contribution made by Christian teachers through the ages. We honor them as servants of God.”

The scriptures also tell of a restoration of all things lost. We are taught that an unschooled boy, seeking knowledge from the ultimate source, went to the woods to pray. Many of you might not know this but there are a few different written accounts of the first vision. In 1832 Joseph Smith wrote in his own hand one account and it is different in many ways then the 1838 account that we use today as the official version which was dictated by Joseph Smith to his scribe James Mulholland and later published to the world in 1842.

Again quoting Elder Oaks: “The divine teaching in that vision began the restoration of the fulness of the gospel of Jesus Christ. God the Son told the boy prophet that all the “creeds” of the churches of that day “were an abomination in his sight” (JS—H 1:19). We affirm that this divine declaration was a condemnation of the creeds, not of the faithful seekers who believed in them. Joseph Smith’s first vision showed that the prevailing concepts of the nature of God and the Godhead were untrue and could not lead their adherents to the destiny God desired for them.

Later Joseph Smith was given the responsibility to translate the Book of Mormon. The golden plates came with some translation aids but it did not come with an instruction manual and Joseph had to figure out how he was going to translate this wonderful book. I never thought much about it to tell you the truth and as I have studied I have come to understand that the process was quite different then what I assumed. After Joseph Smith translated the Book of Mormon he organized and started the church using divine help and inspiration and some common sense. Some things he did by trial and error. Did he do every thing right the first time and were all of his decisions the best? The answer to that question would be NO. He made many mistakes and as we read the D & C we can find where God lets him know that he wasn’t always happy with the things that Joseph Smith did but there is one scripture that I would like to read in D & C 124:1 which reads:  “Verily, thus saith the Lord unto you, my servant Joseph Smith, I am well pleased with your offering and acknowledgments, which you have made; for unto this end have I raised you up, that I might show forth my wisdom through the weak things of the earth”. God is calling Joseph weak in this verse but letting him know that he can still fulfill the divine purposes of God. The restoration didn’t all happen at once. It was a process and at times a painful process. We know some of the things involved in that process but we don’t know every thing so we need to be patient and kind and try to be understanding when it comes to the beginnings of the church and to the things that still happen today concerning the church. The early church leaders learned as they went along and they didn’t always get it right the first time, or second time even. Our leaders today are men and women that still have weaknesses and our as human as ever. Some times they share their opinions and sometimes they share inspired words and we can’t always tell the difference but I believe that they do the best that they can, but still this can be a stumbling block to some in the church.

So when the Gospel was restored, was all truth restored? Again the answer would be no and we know that because there are yet many truths to be reveled as we learn from the 9th Articles of Faith. The things that were restored were:

-the saving ordinances performed by a restored priesthood.

-the prospective of the potential of mankind.

-the sealing of the family.

-and the knowledge of who we are and were we came from.

Elder Donald L Hallstrom gave a talk in General Conference back in April 2012 and said the following: “I love the gospel of Jesus Christ and the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. Sometimes we use the terms gospel and church interchangeably, but they are not the same. They are, however, exquisitely interconnected, and we need both. Some have come to think of activity in the Church as the ultimate goal. Therein lies a danger. It is possible to be active in the Church and less active in the gospel.” I would like to add that it is also possible to be active in the gospel but less active in church. There are many of our members who believe in the Gospel but their faith in the church is in short supply and there are those that have doubts about both. Let me ask you a question. Do we as a ward and as a stake and also families want those that doubt or those that even don’t believe much at all to be part of us? I hope that we can answer that with a resounding yes we do, because I know that is what we say every time we reach out to non members and the less active.

I would like to start closing my remarks today by talking about some things we can do to reach out to those that are struggling today that might be on the verge of going into a full fledged apostasy tomorrow because I want you to know that there are in church many who are in a faith crisis and that we are loosing some very good people.

The first thing that we can do is love the person regardless of their activity in the church. Many times it is assumed that those that struggle or have doubts do so because they want to sin or that they aren’t praying enough or reading their scriptures enough. We sometimes assume that they want to leave the church when in truth they are looking for any excuse to stay. They don’t want to be judged or looked down on because of their struggles or concerns about church history and some policies and we are commanded to not judge them. They don’t want to become projects. Those with doubts want to feel like they are heard and that their feelings, not necessarily their doubts, are acknowledged and validated. They want to feel like as Elder Holland said in the last conference that it is okay to have doubts and have questions. Its okay to explore and even have different opinions than most of the people at church, and even be a Democrat and that they can still be considered a good Mormon. The members that we have often feel like the church is part of their tribe, their heritage, and their culture and they want to be part of it even if they don’t believe in every single thing taught over the pulpit. Let’s face it brothers and sisters we all don’t believe every thing we hear and we have been told that we shouldn’t believe without gaining our own testimonies for ourselves. Some people are blessed with the gift of faith and they don’t need to reason everything out in their own minds. They can just say that they are okay waiting until the next life to find out the things that they don’t understand. I can and do respect that and even admire that at time but I am just not wired that way and there are many others that don’t have that gift. Our goal is to become a Zion people, meaning a people of one heart and not a people with only one way to think, feel and believe.

It gets a little tricky when it comes to getting every one into this big tent we call Mormonism. There are some that don’t want everyone in the tent and will not accept other unless they conform to a certain way of being. For now I am not going to worry about them because they might not be willing to change or feel the need to, maybe they are wired that way and I can accept that. There are other that are true apostates and that are fighting against the leaders and the church and I honestly believe that they need a tent of their own because the truth is, it will not be good for either group. That leaves the rest of us. So how do we support and uplift each other, both the doubter and the believer without becoming infected with doubts for the believers or untrue beliefs for the doubters. Let me give you a one example of what the doubter or more liberal thinker might worry about when I say untrue beliefs. Back in November there was a campaign to have women wear pants to church. It wasn’t a big issue and mostly done on facebook but there were some strong opinions on both sides, with some people declaring in very bold words that it was wrong to do so and against God’s will. About a week before the Sunday which was set aside to have the women that wanted to wear pants to church, the church released a statement basically saying that women can wear pants if they want and doing so was not a sin or wrong in the eyes of the church. To many of you that might sound silly, but to many of the younger women of the church it was important. I believe the key to this balance of embracing and supporting all those that want and need to be part of the church is to be loving and respectful, patient and kind and above all do as Christ taught and love our neighbor as we love ourselves. The atonement applies to all of us so we need allow it to do so. I pray that we truly can become a Zion people, a people of one heart. In the name of Jesus Christ, Amen.

Wow. Awesome! :thumbup: