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After my introduction (found here),1. Learn to say no. After I was released as bishop, I’ve said “No” to both bishops and the SP when asked to accept a calling. I just told them it wasn’t something I could do right now. Or if I accepted the called, I put conditions on what I would do.
2. Know how far you can push their buttons. I would die of boredom in SS and HPG if I didn’t say something. So I know how far I can push with my comments, and when I teach in HP. For example:
a. If they bring up the WofW, then I tell them that it wasn’t enforced as we know it until the 1920’s, and that the Q12 used wine in the sacrament in the temple until 1904.
b. If they bring up Polygamy and the 1890 manifesto, I tell them about my GGrandfather taking his 3rd and 4th wife in the 1900’s.
c. If somebody talked about the first vision, then I’ll bring up the multiple versions, and say I learned about them in the Ensign article of years past
Most people enjoy my comments, and I get lots of compliments when I teach HPG. I tell them they are going to learn something new when I teach, and they always do.
3. Stand up for what you know to be true, but be prepared to back it up with “friendly” sources. Once in priesthood meeting, somebody said we need to pay our tithing on Gross. A member of the SP was in attendance, and he said that is what the SP said also. I spoke up and said that was not true, and quoted from a FP letter (which I kept handy in my briefcase) that defined tithing as 10 % of your “increase”. Later than evening the SP counselor called me at home an apologized for his remark, and said I was correct.
Another time I was called into the bishop’s office for teaching in SS that good Mormons could believe in evolution. Somebody had went to the bishop and told him I was teaching false doctrine. I went to the bishop prepared with another FP statement that said the church has no position on evolution, and we could believe what we wanted.
4. Be careful who you share your real feelings with. I’ve not shared with anybody outside the internet my true feelings. Sure, everybody knows I’m different, but nobody knows how different from them I really am.
5. Be nice to other people, and they will be nice to you. Visit the widows, the sick and the shut-ins. What does it matter if the BofM is not historically true, if the poor widow down the street is lonely?
Now, one thing that makes this easier for me is that I still attend the ward I was bishop in. So I’m afforded some respect when I spout off my crazy thoughts. I don’t know how I’d be treated if I was new to a ward and started saying the same things I do now.
Sheldon wrote:5. Be nice to other people, and they will be nice to you. Visit the widows, the sick and the shut-ins. What does it matter if the BofM is not historically true, if the poor widow down the street is lonely? .
That, to me, is everything in a nutshell!
The church and it’s members do some really great things, regardless of the truths or not of the doctrine/history. At a ward level (which is all I know), people care, people want to do good, it is a great welcoming environment. To me, that is what matters right now.
Thank you for sharing your sanity
That is a good description of what I do in church on a regular basis. I also smile a lot and talk and joke with people. It helps a lot not being a grouchy prick.
:thumbup: Sheldon, you’ve done a great job compiling some good tips for success for staying LDS with unorthodox beliefs. I’ve adopted many of your ideas, and have one of my own:
Don’t get too upset when you hear stuff you don’t agree with.As an unorthodox believer, I understand that I’m likely to hear something that I don’t agree with, or even that I think is blatantly false, on any given Sunday. Rather than sit and stew on it, and think “they don’t ‘know’ what they’re saying they ‘know’!”, I try and see if I can pick out how or why this belief brings some solace in their life. I don’t actually believe that Noah gathered two of every animal and built and Ark – but I don’t get upset when people relate this story in Church, because I think there are good lessons and morals that can be learned from the story. Likewise, even if I don’t agree or believe what someone may say, it doesn’t necessarily mean there isn’t some greater truth that can be learned from it. This is, needless to say, not always easy, depending on how crazy the statement is. Like Sheldon mentioned, some things absolutely must be addressed and corrected. But when someone talks about God helping them find their car keys, I try not to fume about it and either mentally skip it, or try and see the comfort this brought to the person. Kumahito wrote:Don’t get too upset when you hear stuff you don’t agree with.As someone whose “shelf crashed” (kinda sick of that phrase) relatively late in life, I realize that I, especially, shouldn’t get that upset when I hear stuff I don’t agree with because I used to say some of the same things.
Learn to straddle. I did a straddle in HP Group a few weeks ago, and it was very well received. This is where you give the administration what they want, but complement it with your own views.
In this case, the lesson was a tired, worn-out lesson on why we do home teaching. Everyone had heard the story a buzillion times and a heavy canopy of disengagement fell on the room. When they finally asked why people don’t do it, I responded that:
a) We measure success wrong,. The gold standard of a visit in the home depends on HTeacher agency and HTeachee family agency. I can’t achieve the gold standard unless the family I home teach exercises their agency to receive visits, And they don’t always, so I never feel I can be fully successful as a home teacher. And that’s what I have to look forward to for the next 30 years I’m on the planet.
b) Give the stake the gold standard measure they want in report, but also report letters, requests to see families — essentially, provide a best-efforts measure as a percentage as well. Report both to the quorum and stake, and help HTeachers realize they can be successful when they do all they can do.
All the old timers and people who thought they knew everything (ex-Bishops) spun off the comment and agreed.
**********
I agree with the idea of saying No. I feel much better going to church realizing:
a) I don’t have to move people anymore, often simply saving them the cost of a mover they can afford. And sometimes damaging my aging body, as I did with a piano move that broke my ribs years ago.
b) I can say “no” to callings in spite of Packer’s Unwritten Order of Things
c) I build conditions for release turn around time into callings I accept (as I did with my HP Teaching calling). If they wont’ agree, then I don’t accept the calling.
d) I give a lot of time to a non-profit and use that as my reason for not serving much in the church now. Service doesn’t always have to be about the church.
e) That my priesthood leaders are my friend when I am serving as they think I should, but should not be trusted with any of my unorthodox ideas,. This is because they quickly put you on the black list if you do not serve the way they want. And it can happen fast, nullifying years or dedicated service.
f) That the world needs dedicated volunteers, and you can have a huge impact in the non-profit world that is very hard to achieve in the LDS Church.
***********
SilentDawning wrote:Learn to straddle.
I did a straddle in HP Group a few weeks ago, and it was very well received. This is where you give the administration what they want, but complement it with your own views.
In this case, the lesson was a tired, worn-out lesson on why we do home teaching. Everyone had heard the story a buzillion times and a heavy canopy of disengagement fell on the room. When they finally asked why people don’t do it, I responded that:
a) We measure success wrong,. The gold standard of a visit in the home depends on HTeacher agency and HTeachee family agency. I can’t achieve the gold standard unless the family I home teach exercises their agency to receive visits, And they don’t always, so I never feel I can be fully successful as a home teacher. And that’s what I have to look forward to for the next 30 years I’m on the planet.
b) Give the stake the gold standard measure they want in report, but also report letters, requests to see families — essentially, provide a best-efforts measure as a percentage as well. Report both to the quorum and stake, and help HTeachers realize they can be successful when they do all they can do.
All the old timers and people who thought they knew everything (ex-Bishops) spun off the comment and agreed.
**********
I agree with the idea of saying No. I feel much better going to church realizing:
a) I don’t have to move people anymore, often simply saving them the cost of a mover they can afford. And sometimes damaging my aging body, as I did with a piano move that broke my ribs years ago.
b) I can say “no” to callings in spite of Packer’s Unwritten Order of Things
c) I build conditions for release turn around time into callings I accept (as I did with my HP Teaching calling). If they wont’ agree, then I don’t accept the calling.
d) I give a lot of time to a non-profit and use that as my reason for not serving much in the church now. Service doesn’t always have to be about the church.
e) That my priesthood leaders are my friend when I am serving as they think I should, but should not be trusted with any of my unorthodox ideas,. This is because they quickly put you on the black list if you do not serve the way they want. And it can happen fast, nullifying years or dedicated service.
f) That the world needs dedicated volunteers, and you can have a huge impact in the non-profit world that is very hard to achieve in the LDS Church.
***********
A should know there limits, some people have a problem saying no to please others, some have a problem saying yes to others from trust. Learning your personal limits and settings those boundaries are important for sustainability.
It’s not a race in life, success comes from knowing your pace just like a marathon.
SilentDawning wrote:Learn to straddle.
I did a straddle in HP Group a few weeks ago, and it was very well received. This is where you give the administration what they want, but complement it with your own views.
In this case, the lesson was a tired, worn-out lesson on why we do home teaching. Everyone had heard the story a buzillion times and a heavy canopy of disengagement fell on the room. When they finally asked why people don’t do it, I responded that:
a) We measure success wrong,. The gold standard of a visit in the home depends on HTeacher agency and HTeachee family agency. I can’t achieve the gold standard unless the family I home teach exercises their agency to receive visits, And they don’t always, so I never feel I can be fully successful as a home teacher. And that’s what I have to look forward to for the next 30 years I’m on the planet.
b) Give the stake the gold standard measure they want in report, but also report letters, requests to see families — essentially, provide a best-efforts measure as a percentage as well. Report both to the quorum and stake, and help HTeachers realize they can be successful when they do all they can do.
All the old timers and people who thought they knew everything (ex-Bishops) spun off the comment and agreed.
**********
I agree with the idea of saying No. I feel much better going to church realizing:
a) I don’t have to move people anymore, often simply saving them the cost of a mover they can afford. And sometimes damaging my aging body, as I did with a piano move that broke my ribs years ago.
b) I can say “no” to callings in spite of Packer’s Unwritten Order of Things
c) I build conditions for release turn around time into callings I accept (as I did with my HP Teaching calling). If they wont’ agree, then I don’t accept the calling.
d) I give a lot of time to a non-profit and use that as my reason for not serving much in the church now. Service doesn’t always have to be about the church.
e)
That my priesthood leaders are my friend when I am serving as they think I should, but should not be trusted with any of my unorthodox ideas,. This is because they quickly put you on the black list if you do not serve the way they want. And it can happen fast, nullifying years or dedicated service.f)
That the world needs dedicated volunteers, and you can have a huge impact in the non-profit world that is very hard to achieve in the LDS Church.***********
These two really hit home lately. I am trying to figure this out. I have been surprised how fast people will turn on you when you don’t agree on church stuff. the old saying about religion and politics is so true. I thinking about doing volunteer work with military vets. I brought home a volunteer package today.I recommend it. First, there are usually not a lot of layers of bureaucracy, or rules to follow. Second, many volunteer organizations are desperate for volunteers and they deeply appreciate your work (that has been my experience). And I find its much easier and impactful to do a project, have an impact, and then move on to the next one. I am also finding that service in the community can boost your career like church work can’t. I tried to use church leadership in a job interview a while ago (a management position). I commented on my “parallel career” with coaching from the senior managers from industry with whom I served. No one cared.
On teh other hand, being on the Board of Directors for a business-related non-profit (my own service now) seems to have a much bigger impact and credibility.
I say get involved and do it, and let the “priesthood” power redirect to the community…and enjoy the engagement you feel from serving mankind as much or more than the organization alone.
To re-phrase my oldest daughter: Quote:“There are lots of people who will focus on building up the kingdom of God on earth. More people need to focus on establishing Zion.”
So, work to establish Zion.
I have a few of these myself: 1 – don’t swing at every pitch.
2 – when you’re explaining, you’re losing.
3 – the person with the most awareness in the situation has the most responsibility for how the relationship is going.
4 – people generally see the church through the lens of their political views.
5 – most people don’t have much self-awareness and have a limited ability to deal with something they haven’t considered before.
6 – people are more important than rules.
7 – some people should not be allowed to talk to non-Mormons or disaffected Mormons. Don’t cast your pearls before swine. Don’t open your kimono except in front of a doctor or perhaps a geisha.
8 – don’t fight other people’s battles.
9 – beware the first person who wants to be your friend.
I am absolutely loving all these comments. I have been lurking more than commenting lately, but Silent Dawning and I line up on so many perspectives! I truly believe the world needs us to serve as much as the church needs the inner callings filled. When callings are being made up to engage people and make sure they have a calling, it’s pretty clear to me that our talents can certainly be used elsewhere without guilt. And as we move into the community to serve, we are in the position to “make friends for the church”. I read that in a column years ago about the military man who defended Joseph although he never joined the church. The point of the column was that it is okay to make friends for the church and not feel guilty if every person we run across does not join our church. Community service has certainly enriched my life, as well as many others that I know. I take the “anxiously engaged in good causes” phrase to mean permission to do just that. Thanks everyone! Hawk if you care to expand on the following items, I’d be interested in your perspective: hawkgrrrl wrote:I have a few of these myself:
2 – when you’re explaining, you’re losing.
9 – beware the first person who wants to be your friend.
I’m not sure what context you are making these or what they mean. That’s not your fault, it’s my lack of experiences on which to hang the statements. They are intriguing.
following. Where’s the popcorn? I sent a PM by mistake to all users, sorry for the mess up. Please forgive!!
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