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I have been lurking here, without posting but reading about all sorts of crisis on the truth, scriptures, JS, ward problems, ect.. The more I read, the more I feel sad for those who lost their faith. I had my own crisis too, but I have found peace with my immediate family. God has given me what I have prayed for, a peaceful house where my Wife and I can raise our family. God DID answer my prayer for peace and have given me a new outlook on our future. For over seven years, I tried, prayed and cried over my family’s unwillingness to join the LDS faith. I desperately wanted to do everything that I heard on Sundays including going to the Temple. I spent many of evenings in the Bishop’s office trying to come up with ideas on how to get my family to join and to clean up my own sins. Everyday for years, I asked Heavenly Father to help me but nothing ever changed. My Wife was just not interested and that was that! I was offered Temple blessings without paying a full tithe because my Wife didn’t allow me to pay. A still, small voice told me to that I should not partake in it. Even though I had the okay from the SP, I did NOT take them up on the offer. I believe that there was a reason why I wasn’t supposed to have those blessings, my path is going to be different.
I asked The Lord another question that I never asked before. I asked how could our family worship together? How could our house be whole again to benefit our kids and my relationship with my Wife? I got a feeling that I was going about this the wrong way. It was time to find another Church. When I told my Wife that I wanted to try another Church, she got very surprised and happy. She said that she has been praying for the same thing and this was an answer to her.
I communicated with a few Churches in the area but it was difficult to accept that I would have to leave my testimony of Joseph Smith and the Book of Mormon behind. How could I attend another Church without those important scriptures and the great man that Joseph Smith is? I have a lot in common of Joseph, imperfect and don’t always listen to the Lord, but faithful and want to serve.
I decided that the Community of Christ (formerly RLDS) may be a good option to try. I talked to the Pastor and came to a service. Their numbers are smaller, but the spirit is huge. We were welcomed with open arms by everyone in the congregation. My kids are the only kids there, but they have a pioneer spirit to be there despite that. My oldest will be playing the piano at a future service “What Wondrous Love Is This”. Once I find a good arrangement, she will be playing “The Spirit of God” there as well. My Wife looks forward to going each Sunday and loves the Sisters in the Ward. Their smaller numbers isn’t so daunting and she thinks the people there are real. My family life has never been better, my Wife and I have the best relationship we ever had, my kids ask me all sorts of questions and I may have an opportunity to bring my in-laws into the faith as well. Life is GOOD and I have PEACE.
I have a testimony of the restoration of the gospel, started by a young man who saw the Lord after asking which church to join. I believe in the Book of Mormon as scripture and the Lord divinely spoke to the early Saints to set forth a chain of events that started His church back on the earth again. I do believe that the Lord can dwell in more than one church, which means I believe in “true churches”. No one has the monopoly on faith, there is plenty of it to go around. We have great leaders in many churches that serve the Lord in the way He sees fit. Modern revelation inspires our leaders to teach and inspire us to be better people, serve mankind and to accept others who are different (some differences takes a little getting used to).
To those who have problems with JS, history and the Book of Mormon, keep in mind that faith can’t always be explained. I am not one who accepts things at face value or because it was taught to me for years and years. I have had the Lord personally testify to me that the Book of Mormon is true. Trying to explain it by science and ancient history will only create heartache and headaches.
If you find that after careful prayer and thought that you can’t accept any part of the church, I totally understand and love you as a brother with all sincerity. I know Heavenly Father loves us and has setup a plan for us all. As much as the LDS faith wants to put us all on the same plan, I don’t believe that is the case. Fell comfort in knowing that He knows you and will call on you again. I found you can’t hide from Him, He knows our address.
I hope this made sense. Peace be with us all.
Before someone deletes my post, keep in mind that my testimony is not a commercial for Community of Christ. It is simply the answer that I got, in prayer by the Lord Himself. Your prayers and path may vary. I actually advocate working out your differences with your current faith. Just keep this in mind before someone makes a hasty decision to remove my testimony. That would make me very sad. :problem: We almost never delete posts without discussion and letting everyone know why it is being deleted (only in extreme situations – really, almost never). We just don’t operate the same way lots of other places do. Thank you for posting this. I personally appreciate the expression of acceptance of others figuring our their own faiths. The CofC definitely is “family” – cousins, if you will. I am happy you found a place of peace for yourself and your family.
Heavy_Laden wrote:… but I don’t believe that we are supposed to be perfect.
If we think carefully about this I think we can agree that a world full of perfect humans would throw a big wrench into the plan of learning by experience.
Hi Heavy_Laden, Thank you for your testimony and I’m glad you found a place that is loving and accepting. And I certainly believe Ray won’t deleted it.
For myself, I know there is a God. I have seen one of these beings and so I have no doubt. It is not belief in my case. And as a result, I have hope that the scriptures are true, that what JS said has a basis in fact, and that there is a life after this.
As far as which Church you belong to, I really don’t think it matters. None of the churches on this world is the one and only true Church of God. I would recommend that you instead remember that the Lord said, “Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you.” Those who live peaceably and seek the Lord and to do his will all belong to his kingdom and church.
As for myself, I attend the LDS Church. And I don’t think it is superior to the CoC at all. While I believe Mormonism at its heart is based on fact and certain statements from God, over time human-beings being weak and error-prone as we are, have distorted things and gotten off course. However, it is my belief that it isn’t hard to get back on course and see the truth underneath. All one must do is seek the truth and it will set you free. I believe ultimately that truth is seeking, SEEING, and speaking with God yourself and he will set you on the correct path. And I believe that is the real message of Mormonism – that we each need to do that and come to know the Lord. That is the path I am on and I often lay awake meditating and leaving myself open the tender mercies of the Lord. I hope to one-day see him again as I have some questions for him. But I understand that all things are done on the Lord’s time-table and I will patiently wait till the Lord feels it is time.
Best Regards,
Tobin
Heavy_Laden wrote:I asked The Lord another question that I never asked before. I asked how could our family worship together?How could our house be whole again to benefit our kids and my relationship with my Wife? I got a feeling that I was going about this the wrong way. It was time to find another Church. When I told my Wife that I wanted to try another Church, she got very surprised and happy. She said that she has been praying for the same thing and this was an answer to her. Hi, Heavy-Laden – Thanks for your post and for the reminder that I could be more creative, sincere and constructive in my questions when I pray.
Thanks for sharing Heavy_Laden. Ray called the CoC a “cousin” and I had never really thought of it that way. I am comfortable with that description, however, and I have found truth and understanding in some of our other “cousin” LDS-based faiths. I recall as a young and fairly new convert visiting church sites in Missouri. I visited the Church of Christ (Temple Lot) and recall being very offended, and even angry, at their portrayal of JS as a fallen prophet and picking and choosing which parts of the D&C were true and which weren’t. Many years later, I wish I could have another discussion with that gentleman – he may have been more correct than my limted vision and closed mind allowed me to see at that point. Our cousins can understand our questions because they have them, too, and they have some answers. I truly believe that the vast majority of those that followed other LDS-based faiths after the death of JS did so believing that what they were doing was right and did so following the dictates of their own hearts and faith. I don’t believe that God faults anyone who is following his or her own conscience. While the CoC is not the answer for my family (my family would not be open to that idea at all), I’m gald you have found the peace and happiness that works for your family. Hi HL :wave: ,From your description it sounds like your wife believes in God, possibly is Christian, but didn’t like the LDS way of doing things. Would she have gone to almost any church besides the LDS? Was it you that suggested the CoC? With so many similarities between LDS and CoC – what was the difference that made it work for your family (theological, social, etc). Sounds like there was a deal breaker with the LDS church and I’m trying to figure out what that was.
I have visited Nauvoo several times and I believe the CoC has much better tour guides (more history and less faith promotion). I remember one line specifically from their video presentation, “While the Nauvoo period represents the church at its most influential, it also arguably represents the church at its least Christ-like self.”
Thanks for sharing your testimony. We like a diversity of voices. We even had a fundamentalist Mormon posting here for a long time. As long as everyone is respectful, there doesn’t seem to be a problem.
I’m glad your home has been blessed with peace.
:angel: Roy, Yes, my Wife was raised as a Presbyterian but was mostly a social member. She has some ideas of the nature of Jesus Christ, but they aren’t very deep. There were a few things that my Wife didn’t care for. She is an extremely shy and private person, but very nice to be with once you get to know her.
Here are a few things that she didn’t care for or were too different for her to accept:
– Three hour blocks were way too long for her to sit.
– Members constantly asking her to attend functions and convert her.
– The differences between men and women in the church. She felt that men and women should worship together.
– TBMs can be overwhelming.
– In-Laws were in the same Ward
– Home teaching and having me be away from the family
– Mistakes I made trying to get her to go early on
Community of Christ has some key differences (in order) in a few of the above:
– We only go for an hour in service but there is a light lunch or potluck (!) after.
– Our church is so small; we don’t have too many functions.
– Women have the Priesthood! LDS is missing out on that
– No TBMs, people are allowed to draw their own conclusions. For example, there are many LDS principles that I will always believe in. They accept that and if I wanted to, I could go in front of the congregation and tell everyone that is my belief. My kid could play “Come Come Ye Saints” on the piano and they would be happy to hear it (I really miss singing that song).
– Home teaching tasks are handled by Aaronic Priesthood but there is no formal program in place that I know of.
Community of Christ promotes joy, hope, love and peace in Christ’s mission. They also believe in the worth of all people and their gifts that Heavenly Father gave. There are many kinds of people in the church, some don’t look or act like me. They are ahead of the curve in many social issues that the LDS church currently does not care for. I believe that there will be change in that arena to focus on larger problems that mankind faces, CofC is already there.
We believe in the Book of Mormon and the D&C (well, most of it!). Joseph Smith’s family is a big part of our church. We have many similarities, but a key difference makes us unique to each other. I could describe it as two brothers, born of the same parents having their differences.
My Wife loves the church and the congregation that welcomed us with open arms. She doesn’t have a testimony of JS yet, but I believe she will. God is with me and I have benefited from his love for me and my family.
There are other things I want to write for others who posted. I will respond to it tonight
Thanks HL, I worried that I might have been too nosy in my questions but it doesn’t seem from your response that you were bothered.
So it seems like her dislike of the LDS church is mostly cultural and social (in addition to her not buying into JS).
If I understand you correctly, the CoC would let your wife join even if she never developed a testimony of JS. That sounds pretty cool. On one hand I think it most be so liberating to have different beliefs accepted. On the other hand, I can imagine that it would be difficult for the church to craft an identity and message with so much diversity.
One other bit of nosiness. You mentioned that you “may have an opportunity to bring my in-laws into the faith as well” and then later you mentioned that “In-Laws were in the same Ward.” I am assuming that you are saying that there may be opportunity to bring your wife’s semi-Presbyterian parents to the CoC and that it is your parents that are in the LDS ward. Is that correct? If so, how do your parents feel about your attendance at the CoC?
We participate in several other churches and we have drawn the distinction on the word “participate.” We attend the LDS church where we are members. We participate in many churches. Not everyone has been so keen on our distinction but there doesn’t seem to be anything they can do about it. However one bishop did seem to indicate that “attending” another church would bring consequences.
Anyway, it is nice to hear of your experience and perspectives.
No, you aren’t bothering me with questions. My Wife has no opinion of JS because she hasn’t been exposed to his teachings directly. She never had the discussions, so the only way she heard about him is sacrament meeting (she may have attended 25 times or so over the years). Your correct, her reasons were mainly social, not doctrine based but she never got into the weeds with the LDS faith. It is possible to go to CofC without a testimony of JS, Book of Mormon or whatever else. No one faults you or pressures you at all. It is refreshing that we could all simply fellowship, service and worship together without debates.
I grew up in the church, so my parents still live in the same Ward I grew up in. Her parents are semi-Presbyterian, they haven’t been to church in a decade.
My Dad knows of my change of church, he is a cultural Mormon. He said that he supports my decision because it was good for the family. My Mom, as far as I know, is not aware of the change. She is a recent TBM, but she wasn’t for decades before that. She just got her Temple card and has been going there. I want to make sure this is going to work before I tell her. I don’t think she will be that mad because she knew I was struggling with the church as a family. I am aware that I might get “in trouble” if I go to CofC, but what do they expect me to do? Is it better for me to not go to chruch anywhere? I could renounce my membership but I don’t see a reason because I am not apostatizing, on the contrary, I am saying that the LDS faith is a true church. I am an unendowed member, which I guess makes life easier.
Ask all the questions you want!
Quote:However one bishop did seem to indicate that “attending” another church would bring consequences.
He would be WAY out of bounds if he meant formal consequences. As long as you are attending LDS services, there is NO authorized justification for any formal discipline just for attending / participating in other church services, as well. Period.
If a Bishop of mine said that to me, I would smile and say something like:
Quote:I didn’t realize that. I’d like to see where it says that in the CHI, so I can share it with others whenever they ask.
Of course, he wouldn’t be able to find it, so I would have made my point without having to challenge him directly on it – and, if he was that type of Bishop, he probably wouldn’t bother following up with me and admitting it isn’t appropriate. I find it more effective to allow them to discover they are wrong on their own than to make it a challenge and put them on the defensive.
Old-Timer wrote:Quote:However one bishop did seem to indicate that “attending” another church would bring consequences.
He would be WAY out of bounds if he meant formal consequences. As long as you are attending LDS services, there is NO authorized justification for any formal discipline just for attending / participating in other church services, as well. Period.
If a Bishop of mine said that to me, I would smile and say something like:
Quote:I didn’t realize that. I’d like to see where it says that in the CHI, so I can share it with others whenever they ask.
Of course, he wouldn’t be able to find it, so I would have made my point without having to challenge him directly on it – and, if he was that type of Bishop, he probably wouldn’t bother following up with me and admitting it isn’t appropriate. I find it more effective to allow them to discover they are wrong on their own than to make it a challenge and put them on the defensive.
The older version of the GHI did spell it out in the section on church discipline. IIRC, it said something very similar to “attending another church is not reason for discipline” (paraphrased but very close, I think). I recall this because I sat on a disciplinary council where this was in issue (not the only issue, just one) and we decided he couldn’t be “charged” with that. I don’t see a reason why that would change in the newer edition.
I’m starting this post and looking at the time … why am I up so late…. As regards to the church handbook, it changes all the time. It is now published, for the majority parts anyway, online at the lds.org website.
I have been unable to find anywhere it says you are not to attend other services. I did when I was on my two-year torture (mission), so why can’t anyone?
Quote:My wife does, periodically. I don’t, because if I’m missing church, then I ain’t goin’ to another one, I’m going shooting (exploding targets and all).
The only requirement for attending church is to get a temple recommend, and that is to periodically (I think once a month???) attend sacrament meeting.
My 2-cents regarding attending another church.
Side Note:There may be some confusion with the temple recommend questions. There are 2, at least, that ask about affiliating with sites or groups that are against the church (or something like that). This may be were some people are getting confused on where it says you “can’t attend another church”. If someone knows the exact questions, it would be nice to post them so that people can understand what the questions really ask. Jazernorth, there are threads in our archives where we talked about each question and how we interpret them. I’ll find the one about affiliation and provide a link to it for you. Here it is:
http://forum.staylds.com/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=3378&hilit=affiliate If you want to search our archives for the other questions, look under “TR Question Survey”. You will get all of the threads that way.
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