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After hearing conference, and feeling very uplifted by the talk of President U., I felt like “I can stay.” President Holland’s talk also spoke to me. Then Sunday rolls around, and Dallin Oaks just sent me into a sad place. On the one hand I hear that I can have doubts and questions, and differences of opinion, and that I am still valuable in the church, and on the other hand I hear very strong messages about how I am supposed to feel about Same Sex Marriage, etc., and I realize that the church’s stance on this issue is not going to change, and I’m kind of down again and wondering if there is a place for me. The church has helped me in many ways for many years, but now it seems to be a source of angst most of the time.
One talk fills me with hope and acceptance, and others just bum me out. I’d appreciate any input you have to give.
Harmony, I do NOT like some of the messages I heard in General Conference, but I do like that the top leadership actually has the type of diversity that Pres. Uchtdorf says the Church as a whole needs to embrace. It’s a fascinating paradox in some ways – that we can’t ask to be accepted for who we are without being hypocrites unless we are willing to accept those with whom we disagree for who they are, even as we wish they weren’t the way they are in some respects. If I wasn’t hearing Pres. Uchtdorf and Elder Holland and Elder Dube and Elder Cousse and Pres. Monson and others, I might not be able to hear Elder Oaks (lots of times) and Elder Bednar (sometimes) and Pres. Packer (when he obsesses over sexual things) and others.
I actually want that type of diversity and not just an echo chamber in which I can feel comfortable, even as I don’t want to hear some of the messages that result from that diversity.
Thanks Ray, I too liked President Monson’s talk, and Brother Dube, but I feel like I’m holding my breath half the time when watching conference, and then of course the hard line talk by D. Oaks was the only one my inactive child was present for, and I ended up turning it off before it went further. I decided to read your synopsis of the talks and then watch what I thought would be uplifting for me and skip the rest.
While it was very gratifying to hear President U. (I don’t want to misspell his name) talk about mistakes that were made in the past and imperfect leaders, I wonder how much of what is spoken now is correct or not. I’m just in a hard place given my family’s circumstances.
I’m looking for ways and reasons to stay. I’m not looking for reasons to leave, but it seems I’m finding it hard to reconcile my feelings with statements of some leaders. Leaving would be terribly hard and sad, but staying also seems a hard choice.
I understand how you feel Harmony. Ray has a great perspective on this. We can only hope that the more positive messages are being heard and implemented on the local level, and by staying you could be a part of that. Either choice is hard, leaving or staying. They each have unique positives and negatives for you as an individual. I don’t have any magical advice. I’m still winding my way through things, even though I feel like I’ve made my decision about my future with the church. Just remember to look for the good in every situation and weigh the positives and negatives fairly. There were lots of great things said in conference. Like you, I didn’t watch all of it, but I read summaries and heard about the not so great things that were said as well. Take the good and leave the bad, if you can. Best of luck. Thanks Mayb. I think that you and Ray both have good advice. For the time being I will keep on trying. There were many good and uplifting things said. With a child who has SSA, and is not “out”, I have very few people I can share my struggles with. I do think this website may have been an answer to prayer for me, though. It has helped so much to hear others have struggles similar to my own. Wishing you all good things in your future with regards to your family’s decisions.
Quote:With a child who has SSA, and is not “out”
God bless you in your effort. That is not an easy situation – not at all.
Thanks for your understanding. I wonder what could be God’s plan in all of this for our family. But I will keep on trying to figure that out. Maybe to help someone else going through the same thing? I guess time will tell. I know love in the answer to many problems, and our family has an abundance of love for each other so in that respect I am doing well. Harmony, (I just remembered I need to send you a PM.)
E Oaks and E Packer
haveto stick to their guns on SSM, it’s been their pet issue for the past two decades. SSM will be a reality in most places within the next decade, so they’re gonna have to find a way not to have a conniption about it. It is ironic to me that E Oaks chose to remarry after the passage of his first wife, presumably not to be alone, and yet the advice to gay people is to find some way to make living alone work out for the rest of their natural lives (sorry if that is snarky). I just think that the Church’s current “solutions” for gay people are unworkable. I know. I tried to make them work for the past twenty years, and all it has gotten me is a major depressive disorder, SSRI pills, and talking with shrinks for the rest of my life. But I digress… I hate to say this…but if I were in your situation, I’d avoid listening to conference live. Wait for a few days, and find out what the most nurturing talks are, and only listen to/read those. Forget about the others. I understand that E Packer, E Oaks, E Bednar and others represent diversity in a positive way; however, their messages are simply too damaging for some people at certain stages in their spiritual journey. Take nourishment from what you need and cut out the rest. For now. Maybe later, you’ll feel strong enough to endure ultra-conservative talk without being wounded. I’ve been trying this strategy for the past year or so, and it seems to work fairly well. BTW, I had decided not to listen to any of conference this time, but ended up hearing the first session, and I’m glad I did.
Wonderful comment, t. Excellent advice. Thanks Turinturambar. I will try to keep those ideas in mind. Harmony wrote:After hearing conference, and feeling very uplifted by the talk of President U., I felt like “I can stay.” President Holland’s talk also spoke to me. Then Sunday rolls around, and Dallin Oaks just sent me into a sad place. On the one hand I hear that I can have doubts and questions, and differences of opinion, and that I am still valuable in the church, and on the other hand I hear very strong messages about how I am supposed to feel about Same Sex Marriage, etc., and I realize that the church’s stance on this issue is not going to change, and I’m kind of down again and wondering if there is a place for me.
The church has helped me in many ways for many years, but now it seems to be a source of angst most of the time.
One talk fills me with hope and acceptance, and others just bum me out. I’d appreciate any input you have to give.
I agree with you that a lot of the Sunday talks did not resonate with me.
If we want the church to become a ‘broad tent’ then we have to accept that the people all the way over on the other side of the tent need space made for them too. I’m quite glad that they’re all the way over the other side… but they still need their champions.
I realise that at the moment the tent seems to be dominated by people all the way over the other side. But… I hear stories of units where (straight) unmarried-cohabiting active members were not excommunicated/disfellowshipped. Or another unit where a gay young adult (who was not always single/celibate) was still administering the sacrament and given a home teaching assignment. These are very few and very far between. I’ve heard of a few more but don’t know enough about them to know if they’re apocryphal or not. They usually go way under the radar.
This may evolve into one of those ‘turn a blind eye’ things for certain pockets. Like in the UK, 70mph is the speed limit but a policeman told me he would never book someone doing 80-85 on ‘motorway’ (3 lane freeway). On the other hand the official government speed cameras would (could can’t build in official lenience).
Eventually there may be a cultural change in attitude first and then some change or lenience accepted (officiall or not).
Please do stay. It’s the influence of people like you that give me the hope that there is the impetus for change.
turinturambar wrote:
I hate to say this…but if I were in your situation, I’d avoid listening to conference live. Wait for a few days, and find out what the most nurturing talks are, and only listen to/read those. Forget about the others. I understand that E Packer, E Oaks, E Bednar and others represent diversity in a positive way; however, their messages are simply too damaging for some people at certain stages in their spiritual journey. Take nourishment from what you need and cut out the rest. For now. Maybe later, you’ll feel strong enough to endure ultra-conservative talk without being wounded. I’ve been trying this strategy for the past year or so, and it seems to work fairly well. BTW, I had decided not to listen to any of conference this time, but ended up hearing the first session, and I’m glad I did.This is exactly what I do. I feel that it helps me the best. I can’t handle some talks and immediately begin to develop bad feelings for the church as I hear them. I don’t like having those feelings so I’d rather avoid those talks altogether.
I tried to do in conference what many of you suggested I try when I return to SM. Basically what I got from my fine friends here at StayLDS is that if there is something I’m hearing that I don’t quite agree with, concentrate on something else for the time being – like scripture reading. I wanted to practice, and I had some success and some failure, but it was good for me. I did end up leaving the room for a few talks, but others I was able to redirect my thoughts around and more or less ignore. The gems made it worth it. FWIW, I just became Pres. Uchtdorf’s greatest fan. Quote:Mackay 11 said: If we want the church to become a ‘broad tent’ then we have to accept that the people all the way over on the other side of the tent need space made for them too. I’m quite glad that they’re all the way over the other side… but they still need their champions
I guess this is something I need to remember. Sometimes it seems like there are way too many people on the other side of the tent in comparison to the number over on my side. But then there was President Uchtdorf’s comment “If you could see into our hearts, you would probably find that you fit in better than you suppose.” I can only hope that is true.
President Uchtdorf is definately my favorite speaker. It just seems like he gets what is important and what people are going through.
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