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Brian asked that I include a shot bio of my spiritual journey so the community can get to know me a little better. So, here’s me in a nutshell: I was born and raised right in the middle of the Mormon culture here in Utah. My father was the bishop of our ward during a detrimental age of my development and I quickly became the stereotypical “black sheep” bishop’s son. I was turned off at a young age with the hypocritical and judgmental attitudes of many in my ward. In fact, if it weren’t for a young-men’s leader, who didn’t fit the robot mentality of others, who taught me what true charity and Christ-like love was I would have completely written off my faith.
I understand the confusion, frustration, and apathy towards God. I understand the need to break away from the restricting and bias views of the Mormon culture in search of your own voice. I understand the power of agency and the unquenching desire to stretch it to the limits. I understand the need to run before you walk, and the appetite for extremes. I know my way around very well in the dark. It was never the darkness I was afraid of. At 16 I had completely dropped out of school, ran away from home, and was living with my girlfriend. Just before turning 17 I ended up in drug and alcohol rehab where I spent the next 14 months of my life only to further stretch my extremes under the freedom of adulthood. However, in time friends faded away, the excitement that brought me vigor diminished, the newness of experience become passé, and the sweet taste of agency eventually turned to gravel in my mouth. My anxiety ate at me when I sat alone at night with nothing to keep me company except my conscious, and I found myself searching for something that I once took for granted.
I eloped to Vegas at age 21 and began my long journey back to my faith. At first I acted like how I had observed others act here in happy valley. Church, tithing, pray, read, and over, and over, and over, and over off and on for years. This was my routine with no real progress simply a hollow pride of surrendering my will to a misunderstood culture and my pedestal Christ.
In 2009 I was cursed/blessed with the most humbling trial of my life. The business I had given my blood, sweat and tears to for the previous 10 years of my life went under with the housing market crash. As a result, I lost my house, my vehicles, my savings, my business, my mind, and almost my family. My wife and I were separated for two years, and I became a substitute parent with every other weekend and a hefty child support bill. I was living in my parent’s basement working an entry-level job that paid less then I earned when I first entered the job market. It was there in the basement of my parent’s house that the Lord taught me humility. It was there that I learned the true way to pray and the true characteristics of my Savior. It was there at the lowest point of my life when I had nothing to offer anyone that I realized who would be there for me regardless of my poor choices, and it was there I re-prioritized my life and started seeing and understanding spiritual things through spiritual eyes. It was then that the nature of my journey evolved. Over the last 5 years I have learned that my spiritual eyes are the key to everything spiritual. Our physical eyes are unique in the fact that they are our only organ that needs a medium to work namely light. When we sit in complete darkness they will not work, though we have a perfectly good working set, and we’ll have to feel our way around bumping into everything in our path. Our spiritual eyes work the same way (God said let there be light and there was light. And God saw the light, that it was good–this was done on the first day Gen.1:3-5. What was this light? The sun, moon and stars where not created until day 4? This is the light we need to see through our spiritual eyes. The sun, moon and stars are for our physical eyes. Neither set of eyes will work without light) Without this light of Christ we feel our way along our journey trying to understand all the variables without the aid of our eyes.
And that brings me to where I’m currently at. I’m not a textbook of doctrinal knowledge. I’m still a long ways from where I hope to be. I enjoy learning from others and I still feel most comfortable around people who are humble enough to admit their weaknesses and faults. This makes us real, approachable, relatable, and teachable. I hope to learn and grow from this community of honest faith. I’d hope to share my talents and experiences with those who are willing and open to challenging any currant belief they have as I invite others to challenge mine. I believe that truths are universal, and the church is not the only place to discover truths—maybe just the most credible. I do, however, believe that the LDS church is the only church that carries the keys of saving ordinances restored through the prophet Joseph Smith. And these are available to all of us who will accept nothing less than exaltation as our final inheritance.
–Nate
Hi Zeppelinate, Thanks for spending some time to introduce yourself. It’s nice to know some backstory for people. It helps to bring context to comment.
You have an amazing story and you are beyond amazing for having survived it. Thanks for your perspective, it gives me strength and hope. Brian Johnston wrote:Hi Zeppelinate,
Thanks for spending some time to introduce yourself. It’s nice to know some backstory for people. It helps to bring context to comment.
Agreed. There are several people here whose comments I completely frame knowing their backgrounds – it makes a difference.
Welcome. Although we may disagree I look forward to what you have to share and I look forward to sharing with you.
Welcome. We are an interesting mixture of very different people, with very different perspectives, who are trying to work out our own faith in accordance to the dictates of our own consciences.
You have had a unique journey – one which I would not wish on anyone. I am really happy you are where you are now, emotionally and spiritually. Just understand, please, that not everyone will agree with the way you see things, which means you will get some honest push back and different opinions as you participate here. We don’t try to convince others to see things the way we see them; we try to help everyone figure out how they see things and, with that individual vision, move forward in the LDS Church with greater peace and happiness.
I look forward to getting to know you better.
Welcome Zep. I am glad the church worked for you and has helped you find the gods.
Just a side note, as a clarification to a new guy on the stayLDS board, there is one sentence you wrote that makes me wonder if you understand what we are about here.
Quote:I understand the confusion, frustration, and apathy towards God.
There are not many folks here who are apathetic towards
GOD. I don’t know of a SINGLE participantthat even has apathy towards the LDS church. There are very few “Luke Warm” members on this board. Most of us are very passionate towards god and the church. We are burning hot here….this is a group of people who care deeply about the church, their relationship with the gods, and their family relationships within the LDS church. Frustration towards the CHURCH……yeah. That would probably be an accurate statement. But that is big difference than what your original sentence said. Anyway. I hope you will participate and I will try to be patient and civil as i do appreciate a more believing type of perspective to help work through the process of dealing with my frustration towards the church and it’s faithful members.
Good point, cwald. It is specifically how strongly we feel and how badly we want to remain involved with and in the LDS Church that most are here. There certainly isn’t apathy here. zeppelinate wrote:And that brings me to where I’m currently at. I’m not a textbook of doctrinal knowledge. I’m still a long ways from where I hope to be. I enjoy learning from others and I still feel most comfortable around people who are humble enough to admit their weaknesses and faults. This makes us real, approachable, relatable, and teachable. I hope to learn and grow from this community of honest faith.
Hi, zeppelinate – Glad you found StayLDS. Your quote above is why I’m here, too. For me it’s been really important that it’s a community of honest faith
andhonest doubt. I remember Ray saying once that a lot of us come to our crises from a position of relative luxury; your intro reminds me not to take anything for granted. I’m happy that things are looking up for you. Thanks for the warm welcome. I’ve never been part of a forum before, but I like to talk about and learn about gospel principles. I also like to better understand others perspectives and points of view as mine is constantly evolving as I learn new things. If you knew me you’d know I am very open-minded and accepting of just about everyone. I can count on one hand the people I have meet in my life that I couldn’t get along with. I also don’t have the patience to always think through and proofread everything I say, so please don’t take anything personal. I’m very ADD and my mind moves very fast. I have to get things out and move onto other distractions and as a result I often put my foot in my mouth. Thanks for the intro. Sorry you’ve had such a tough time of life. It sounds like you’ve been kicked and kicked again. I’m glad I read this as it gave context to the thread that was quickly locked. Welcome to our group. I really like your story. The Lord does have ways his own ways of humbling us to develop charity. That’s what the true gospel is really all about, even though it may not be emphasized enough at the church. mackay11 wrote:I’m glad I read this as it gave context to the thread that was quickly locked.
You’ve read a brief background of my history. My brother was the opposite of me. He walked the line, went on a mission, married in the temple and like what’s happens to many plateaued. He found a forum like this for support and was exposed to Pandora’s box. An innocent search for encouraging support opened him to a world of doubt, anti-Mormon propaganda and Joseph Smith/prophet bashing under the pretence of lending support.Yes these subjects are real and should to be discussed openly, but they should be addressed delicately. I’m proud of the church for taking a more transparent position moving forward. In the case of my brother, his support forum caused far more damage than good. I don’t know if this is the one he found or not, but I took it upon myself to do a little research on what’s out there and how they function. I’ve read through many posts on this site, and yes I give them credit for keeping contention low, but I’m concerned with all the anti-Mormon propaganda disguised as support. There are a lot of subjects in our church open for interpretation, but some doctrines are plane and simple and serve as the very foundation of our religion. I’m not against open discussions and even challenging doctrine in search of building a personal conviction; I am however, against derogatory disbelief poising the minds of the unstable. People look for support when at their most influancial and impressionable stages of life. I pray they can come here and have a faith building experience, because I know many here have the best intentions.
zeppelinate wrote:.but I’m concerned with all the anti-Mormon propaganda disguised as support. There are a lot of subjects in our church open for interpretation, but some doctrines are plane and simple and serve as the very foundation of our religion. I’m not against open discussions and even challenging doctrine in search of building a personal conviction; I am however, against derogatory disbelief poising…
What does this mean?
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cwald wrote:zeppelinate wrote:.but I’m concerned with all the anti-Mormon propaganda disguised as support. There are a lot of subjects in our church open for interpretation, but some doctrines are plane and simple and serve as the very foundation of our religion. I’m not against open discussions and even challenging doctrine in search of building a personal conviction; I am however, against derogatory disbelief poising…
What does this mean?
Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk
Good question, I’m wondering about this, too. I agree some doctrines are plain and simple, and the gospel itself is plain and simple (doctrine and the gospel are not necessarily one-in-the same). I honestly don’t see anything here as anit-Mormon, disguised or not. I do see people who have questions and I see people who have found some answers to their questions in finding their own ways, and I see people with some similarities in experiences while at the same time having vast differences in experiences. My experiences are mine, your are yours and they will never be exactly the same for any two people on any subject.
Just as an example – and I am not attacking anyone’s belief in any way – you obviously have a testimony of prayer. That’s great and I am happy for you and your experiences, even though the experiences themselves may not have been all that pleasant. My experiences with prayer have been very, very different from your and it is clearly not a matter of recognizing (or not recognizing) the answers. My view, based on my experiences, is that some prayers are answered and there seems to be a difference whether (and how) prayers are answered for different people, and I see things attributed to answers to prayers that probably really aren’t IMO (else why the same outcome for atheist who didn’t pray about the same thing?). If prayer is a doctrine and I believe not all prayers are answered am I anti-Mormon? Isn’t it possible we both could be right and our answers are simply based on experience and point of view? Does everyone in the church have to believe all prayers are answered? After all, it’s not a temple recommend question and it’s not part of the Articles of Faith. It’s quite easy for someone who perceives that his or her own prayers have always been answered to say that all prayers are answered, it’s quite different for those who have not had the same experiences and who hold a different perspective.
zeppelinate wrote:mackay11 wrote:I’m glad I read this as it gave context to the thread that was quickly locked.
You’ve read a brief background of my history. My brother was the opposite of me. He walked the line, went on a mission, married in the temple and like what’s happens to many plateaued. He found a forum like this for support and was exposed to Pandora’s box. An innocent search for encouraging support opened him to a world of doubt, anti-Mormon propaganda and Joseph Smith/prophet bashing under the pretence of lending support.Yes these subjects are real and should to be discussed openly, but they should be addressed delicately. I’m proud of the church for taking a more transparent position moving forward. In the case of my brother, his support forum caused far more damage than good. I don’t know if this is the one he found or not, but I took it upon myself to do a little research on what’s out there and how they function. I’ve read through many posts on this site, and yes I give them credit for keeping contention low, but I’m concerned with all the anti-Mormon propaganda disguised as support. There are a lot of subjects in our church open for interpretation, but some doctrines are plane and simple and serve as the very foundation of our religion. I’m not against open discussions and even challenging doctrine in search of building a personal conviction; I am however, against derogatory disbelief poising the minds of the unstable. People look for support when at their most influancial and impressionable stages of life. I pray they can come here and have a faith building experience, because I know many here have the best intentions.
I’m glad you feel people here have the best intentions. You’re right. We do. There are no wolves in sheep’s clothing here.
Could you give some specific examples of the “all the anti-Mormon propaganda disguised as support”? Maybe be some links to threads/posts? There are certainly a range of views here, but anyone overtly anti usually moves on or is asked to.
That’s asked sincerely. I’m very interested to know what discussions are considered “anti-Mormon propaganda.”
If ldsreddit AMA drives more participants next week, it would be good to know what stuff might cause a “red-flag.”
We try to self-moderate, but perhaps we become desensitised to it because we’re so used to it.
E.g.s would help.
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