Sunday, lists, and delight

Before I add my ideas – I find your old guard observations very keen. I believe Elder Nelson’s talk and LDS.org kind of conflated the “we won’t make the list for you” thing. In my own Stake we are not as broad minded as yours. Yes they say the words of not making the list, but every talk has been an arm twisting lesson in adherence to the days of the list, things like staying home in your Sunday clothes, reading scriptures, etc. But instead of saying that they’ve chosen to say, “before you turn that game on – think of who’s day this is?” or “a boy in our former ward named Bobby went for a bike ride, he fell and broke his arm. Now we aren’t saying bike riding is bad, but where was Bobby’s heart?” If that doesn’t whisper subtle list I don’t know what does.

For me – I actually go to the driving range with my husband. Our course is gorgeous and it’s a great way to unwind. :shh:

I also like taking hikes or more nature filled walks. We live by water ways and lakes. Nothing strenuous but nice.

For years we have hosted neighborhood BBQ’s on Sunday, and I have often mentioned this in RS or SS, in my neighborhood that is usually the best day to get the most neighbors.

We enjoy bike rides, trips to the dog park, and on certain weekends the beach. On beach weekends I don’t do church.

I do like just hanging out on it.

On the flip side of the new instruction is that I can say Elder Nelson said, “no lists.”

I do like giving other people a day off from work. The Adventists in our area are diligent about closing their businesses on Saturday. I like it, I would be glad to see other’s close theirs on Sunday.

Sorry about the ramble, I am texting while typing – Beware.

I no longer needed lists of dos and don’ts. When I had to make a decision whether or not an activity was appropriate for the Sabbath, I simply asked myself, “What sign do I want to give to God?” That question made my choices about the Sabbath day crystal clear.

I’m not saying Sunday should be a free for all, and I do believe keeping the Sabbath is a commandment.

Free for all is my vote. It gives a sign to my god that we want to be a happy family. I agree with Elder Nelson that I can figure out for my family what is meaningful…not live by fear what other people will think we should or shouldn’t do.

I currently don’t see anything I do in my life that isn’t “holy”. Taking my son to a movie together is a wonderful experience. Fishing and hiking together as a family is wonderful. Playing wiffleball in the back yard is memories for my kids. Watching football is one of the best restful things I enjoy.

Can someone explain to me why I shouldn’t go out to dinner or go shopping on Sunday? I used to think we were making others work and therefore not letting them keep the sabbath holy. That’s just plain weak of an argument, I think.

I keep asking myself what the real reasons are for why I was taught not to do some things on Sunday, and I don’t find any answers, and as part of my journey, if there are things I don’t feel strong about or don’t make sense to me, I shed them as traditions and not as important gospel principles. So…we will make the sabbath a delight to our god. And enjoy the day as a family. We go to church. We visit and home teach others. We talk about YW personal progress and family goals. We read the scriptures. We ride motorcycles. We take naps. We go to baseball games. My son had one of his best varsity high school volleyball games on a Sunday and we cheered him as a family.

We show a sign to God that we are about doing good and positive things, and call it holy.

I’m interested if others think there are specific things that are wrong to do on Sunday and why. (Also…your answer has to be more than “because you’ll be blessed”. Because when I feel I’m already being blessed…the answer needs to be more than “because you’ll be MORE blessed”).

Seriously…what makes Sunday a delight more than being together as a family doing marvelous things and enjoying our day without school and work?

Seriously…what makes Sunday a delight more than being together as a family doing marvelous things and enjoying our day without school and work?

To me the day of the week is immaterial, we’ve monkeyed with the calendar far too much for me to have confidence that we’ve adhered to the same day throughout history. On September 2, 1752 people went to bed that night and woke up with the next sunrise… on September 14, 1752. Boy I sure hope they made Sunday fall on the right “day.” I wonder if that one was just a shift in number alone or if they advanced the day of the week as well. Probably just the numbers, still it’s enough to question, is Sunday Sunday or is it only Sunday because everyone says it’s Sunday.

What’s more important, finding at least one day out of seven where we can enjoy time with family without work and school or making sure that day falls on a Sunday? It’s just easier to do on the weekend. Personally I think our family enjoys Saturdays a little more than Sundays. Saturday is only day of the week were everyone doesn’t have to get out of bed early, there’s no list of rules (real or imagined) governing our day’s festivities, just time and a guilt free conscious that gets to decide how that time will be wasted. Then comes Sunday and it’s back to the grind.

Maybe the Sabbath day didn’t change from Saturday to Sunday after all. :angel:

I do agree there is a difference in Sunday, the Sabbath, and the Lord’s Day. For the sake of argument, let’s agree that we are referring to our day of worship, whatever we it can be called. I actually prefer not to call it the Sabbath in deference to our Jewish brothers and sisters for whom I have great respect in their Sabbath worship. The Lord’s Day is probably more appropriate and we certainly do not celebrate a Jewish Sabbath. I concluded long ago that God probably doesn’t really care which day we rest as long as we rest one of them (I was essentially called a heretic as a missionary when I shared that idea with a companion).

Here’s my thing about lists:

How do we become true disciples of Jesus Christ? The Savior Himself provided the answer with this profound declaration: “If ye love me, keep my commandments.” This is the essence of what it means to be a true disciple: those who receive Christ Jesus walk with Him. But this may present a problem for some because there are so many “shoulds” and “should nots” that merely keeping track of them can be a challenge. Sometimes, well-meaning amplifications of divine principles—many coming from uninspired sources—complicate matters further, diluting the purity of divine truth with man-made addenda. One person’s good idea—something that may work for him or her—takes root and becomes an expectation. And gradually, eternal principles can get lost within the labyrinth of “good ideas.”

(Dieter F. Uchtdorf, Oct. 2009)

I think this applies to all things, not just Sunday. Wearing Sunday clothes all day in a show of reverence? Good idea. Doing indexing on Sunday because you don’t have time during the rest of the week to do so? Good idea. No TV or electronics, no playing outside or playing with friends? Good ideas. Having ward council on Sunday because everybody is available and coming anyway? Good idea. And we already have a labyrinth.

For me the key is that what might be restful or worshipful to you may be just the opposite to me. I do not find meetings a delight, and three hours of them are already way too many without ward council, PEC, BYC, etc. Linger longer? I can’t stand it. It’s not that I don’t like socializing with people in my ward but – and not to be repetitive – three hours is lingering long enough. Is going on a walk with my wife when we have little time to talk during the week not restful or worshipful? Not taking a long nap is on the list in the article. My wife and I both like naps – sometimes long ones – on Sunday. What can be more restful than a nap? For the guy who works 70 hours a week, is it not good to play catch with his son on the only day he has at home?

Sorry, I’m not meaning to rant. I am perhaps venting. I had such high hopes for this training, and in my ward and stake I still do – we did conclude at the stake level that people do need to decide for themselves what is and is no appropriate and not worry about what anyone else decides is appropriate for them. But there is no question that there are lots of Sister Danielsons in my stake who will not let go and will expect others to do the same.

Our stake has undergone the Sabbath training that I think we’re all supposed to get. The wards have begun the training, so it hasn’t all trickled down yet.

I’m really trying not to be cynical about this, but, hey, you started the thread. 🙂 I don’t understand where this is all coming from. Is it a “safe” topic to focus everyone’s attention on as all the strange ones swirl around us? Is there a Sabbath-keeping emergency in progress? If so, hang up and call 911? It just feels weird to me. Is it because Elder Nelson addressed it in conference and we’re preparing to look to him as prophet?

That said, I love the Sabbath day. I’m okay with calling it that, because I try to keep it in as Jewish a fashion as I can. I think I love it because I grew up loving it. We never talked about what we were and weren’t going to do; everything seemed to flow. It was one of the few things that come naturally to our family. Very occasionally we missed church, or attended ticketed concerts, or bought gas, or changed clothes, or whatever, but taken as a whole I was left with good memories. When things were clicking well, it had an almost-Christmas feel to it.

I do push on Saturday to “get the work done” and recreate the same feeling I had growing up. As a general rule, it’s not a TV or shopping day. We talk together more, play music. We get in touch with friends and family. And, of course, nap.

I’m really trying not to be cynical about this, but, hey, you started the thread. 🙂 I don’t understand where this is all coming from. Is it a “safe” topic to focus everyone’s attention on as all the strange ones swirl around us? Is there a Sabbath-keeping emergency in progress? If so, hang up and call 911? It just feels weird to me. Is it because Elder Nelson addressed it in conference and we’re preparing to look to him as prophet?

Honestly I think it’s an extension to what started with “hasten the work” a few years back. In our area we had about a year where the theme was missionary work. That was followed by “hasten the work… of salvation” meaning we’ve got to get more ordinances done in the temple. I think they’re just following along the threefold (or is it fourfold now?) mission of the church. Missionary work, temple work, and now perfecting the saints in the form of Sabbath day adherence.

Obviously I feel the theme selection was more to complete a pattern than to address a pressing need.

I don’t know, Ann and Nibbler. I think you’re both right to some extent. I don’t think it came about because of Elder Nelson’s talk because the training was given to general and area authorities at conference – Nelson’s talk was sort of part of it. I agree that if Nelson becomes president his focus will be the Sabbath. They all need to focus on something, right? I don’t remember which apostle it was in the training but he said the Brethren spent a great deal of time fasting and praying about this and are united in believing keeping the Sabbath will fix some of he problems in the church (paraphrased, of course). I think the main problem they are concerned with is loss of membership, at least to inactivity. I really did like the training, I liked the part about improving Sabbath worship at church better than the other part about keeping the Sabbath at home – but in the training there is nothing like the referenced article (except local discussion can and will surely go there). The church part talked about focusing more on the sacrament and Christ – and I do agree there are problems there. My SP came right out and said we don’t “talk of Christ, rejoice in Christ, preach or Christ” enough.

I’m all for improving Sabbath worship, especially at church. I don’t think there’s anything wrong with individuals and families examining their own Sabbath – and deciding for themselves how to come closer to God. Please do not call me a heretic or anti – but I don;t believe this is going to do what the Brethren want it to do despite their confidence.

It just feels like a “church” thing to me. Taught as good ideas to honor and respect God…but like I said, that can be done other ways.

This is about being at church and being committed to callings and meetings (church stuff). The church is trying to get greater commitment from people to the church. Our ward has been talking about people being lax and going and doing things during the summer and needing to not do that so they can be at church.

I get that. That is their need.

I just don’t make it out to be more than it is.

My response: Thanks for the reminders. Our family is doing fine with what we choose to do on Sundays.