How does this not drive some of you away

It doesn’t drive me away because human needs are limitless. I couldn’t possibly do something about every problem in this world, and still be useful to my immediate family — the people I have been charged to care for first and foremost. Even if I am single someday, with kids out of the house, I couldn’t possibly help every single person in need.

Second, regarding the church’s stance — I do believe their approach toward gays contributes to the suicides. Ultimately, people choose to take their own life, but I acknowledge that the church’s position consigns gay people to a life of second-class citizenship in the church, loneliness, and lack of fulfilment. There is a perception that they are abnormal which I am sure doesn’t help when they consider taking their own lives.

There is one gay man in SLC I read about here on StayLDS. He told his Bishop he had gotten into a same sex relationship. He recognized this would lead to excommunication, and embraced the disciplinary council. At the same time, he continued participating as an excommunicated member in a SS relationship. He sang in the choir, did service projects, went to socials and attended his Sunday meetings. Anything an excommunicated member could do, he did. His partner was not interested in the church, so he did these things alone.

I am not recommending that we flagrantly violate our conscience or church policy, but in this case, this man did what he felt he had to do in order to remain active in the church. Perhaps it was an alternative to taking his own life? At least this way he could have a fulfilling relationship while still serving humanity and experiencing as much of the gospel as he could. He put limits on what he would allow the church to extract from him, in terms of happiness. And reached a compromise. He didn’t put the church in a position where the leaders would have to compromise their values either. This is a sad compromise, unfortunately, but that was one man’s approach to the problem.

As far as how we can ease our own consciences — I have no compunction about telling people that I am unorthodox, and that I don’t believe everything the church teaches literally. That to any outsider, my beliefs should remain a mystery until I state them explicitly. I don’t mind saying that I think the current policy is aggressive, while I agree with every religion being able to worship according to their own conscience. I would even go so far as to say I am not proud of my church in their stance on the SSA issue.

I would also do my best to help people who are gay feel welcome in the church, to listen to them, and help them as much as I could.

Leave the church over it? Unlikely because my resignation would be a drop in the bucket. WE have a far away church with central command. Local leaders, to whom such a resignation would have the most impact, can’t change policy. Further, they are stubborn about policies they feel are derived from inspiration. And then, there are the issues of familial expectations, the strength of my marriage, etcetera to weight against the benefits of resignation. Resignation or even complete inactivity on this issue falls short on all these counts.

Thanks so much for the responses.

I agree 100% that the church isn’t 100% (or even the majority) the reason some are committing suicide. I am just frustrated the church isn’t doing more (or even admitting there is any issue at all). I agree that I am frustrated by hawkgrrrl’s last paragraph and my nice polite nudging of the status quo seems to be just getting me looked down by TBM’s in my ward. I don’t need their acceptance, but I don’t see my efforts helping them to be any more accepting.

I have heard and understand the “I stay to help” and part of me really wants to, but as I have thought about this I think I must be reaching a point where for my own emotional health it hurts me too much to stay.

I agree with OON on getting professional help for those in pain. I am not now, but have been depressed in the past (probably more on the mild side – no suicide thoughts) and that was hell enough.

Thanks again. It has been a tough day with several other painful issues to deal with. In the end I have to make my decisions. I appreciate having such a great sounding board with some very accepting folks to give me feedback and not just an echo chamber.

I stay, in this regard, because I refuse to abandon my tribe to the other voice.

I understand completely why some people need to leave, but I stay to be the “opposition in all things” that “must needs be”.

OON said what I was feeling when I read your initial post although he said it better than I could so I won’t try to expound on it.

I’m not really in a place right now to feel like I can make a difference or share my opinion in church but I’d stay for that reason and for the reasons that OON said concerning suicide. That can’t really be placed on the shoulders of the church. It’s far more complex than that.

How do those of you that continue attending and participating deal with this? Or am I just an overly-empathetic? I feel I am very near being unable to attend.

I know exactly what you are saying and I feel exactly the same way. You are not, in my opinion, being overly-empathetic. Or, I guess, if you are, so am I. But now, as to your other question, I stay because if all of the people who feel like we do stopped participating, who would be left in the Church? Jesus Christ’s Church needs a few people in it who are willing to at least try to love like He did. Those of us who feel this way need to stay, not leave; that’s the only way things will ever change.

How are you feeling today, LH?

I learn a lot from your posts. I appreciate your views.

Just wondered how you have been processing things.

I think this issue has driven many people away by degrees. Someone could be attending and active at church and still be disheartened by these things, not fully on board, and you’d never know.

Pre faith crisis I remember teaching a lesson during PH. I can’t remember the subject but I do remember fixating on this sentence from the proclamation:

We call upon responsible citizens and officers of government everywhere to promote those measures designed to maintain and strengthen the family as the fundamental unit of society.

I think my point was being politically active in the fight against gay marriage. Unbeknownst to me at the time, there was a new elder in our quorum that was gay, right there on the front row. I’ve since changed, dramatically so, but I worry that my comments during that lesson have lived on in his mind.

Now if I’m asked to give a lesson I can make sure that nothing like what I said in the past is said during my turn at the mic. It’s like when I was WML, people might have gotten the message from others but they never heard me say “hasten the work.” That could be a reason to not just be at church but active in church. If it’s my turn there’s a whole third of the 3 hour block where anti-gay teachings won’t get taught.

More recently (comparatively recent at least) we had one of those SMs that ventured into the realm of politics and gay marriage. It wasn’t a positive message. I knew from facebook that one of DW’s friends that went to our ward supported gay marriage and I knew the meeting must have been equally rough for them. I didn’t know the person at all and I’ve got some social anxiety going on but I broke protocol to talk to them after the meeting. Come to find out that person has a gay family member and yes, the talks had been difficult for them. They also said they “never would have guessed” that I held the opinions that I held about gay marriage. Maybe that person felt alone, maybe pushing myself to make contact helped make that particular Sunday a little easier for them. I don’t know. If it did, that’s another reason to stay.

There are going to be gay people in church, that much is a given. Who will be there to help them not feel alone? I hope some of you all will because I tend to be mousy around strangers.