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I have a leadership calling in my ward. I went totally inactive and then went back to church to do this calling. I thought I should try one more time. I am really struggling with the way people in the ward treat each other. The Bishop will walk up to people in the ward and get after them. He can’t figure out why people aren’t coming to church. I am thinking of getting out of my calling because not a whole lot gets done because people don’t get along. We would love to move but can’t move at this time. I know if I quit my calling I will never go back to that ward. They haven’t been very welcoming since I returned to church. I have a hard time going to a ward that has so much contention. I have a very hard decision to make do I continue to go church or going inactive. Church should be about Christ and love. Thank you for letting me vent.
If you are ready for solutions, I have a few suggestions. I was in a similar situation a few years ago when Young Women put duct tape over my daughter’s mouth and tried to forcibly bind her hands and feet, and then confine her in a bedroom. She broke free, but it left a kind of emotional scar that made her refuse to go to our Ward. Simultaneously, we had a really bad bishop. Sacrament meeting fell to 40 people from over 100. SP were too proud to do anything about it. And finally, I had my own struggles with a long, nasty note sent by a Ward leader full of personal attacks distributed to the entire Ward leadership. And that went unchecked by our Bprice. Talk about contention and unChristlike behavior!!! As a possible solution — go to a different Ward. You have to make up an excuse to do this, but find one that you like. We used the “we are moving into the Ward as soon as my work finalizes my position in [insert city]” — which was partly true. While there, be willing to help out at activities, or in other ways. They can’t give you a calling (which is kind of nice, actually), but you can serve in many ways that are meaningful like taking meals, social activities, maybe even mailing letters to less actives, or something to help out. We did this for 3 years until our situation in our home Ward resolved. There always seemed to be things to do if we wanted.
Everyone is active again, except my son, who never really was active anyway.
Unfortunately, the top-down structure of our church prevents anyone from voicing their concerns about deficiencies in the ward — to the one you hop to, or in the current Ward. So they shoot themselves in the foot on that count. It makes them impervious to constructive criticism and improvement.
So, given their lack of humility on this count, you have to do a work around. This is the best one I can think of. And by the way, it is just reward for the Ward. If they aren’t righteous, if they aren’t unified, then the scriptures say the blessings decrease. One such natural blessing is the commitment of people like yourself is no longer available to them.
And by the way, I also aligned myself around community service with a non-profit after I left our home Ward. That was (and continues to be) WAY more fun than church service was in recent years because after a while church service gets old. Think of waking up every day excited about the service hours you are putting in!!! Think about massive, accelerated personal growth and no regrets whatsoever in your new service context, while keeping your options open at church at the same time by attending what I call the “bootleg” ward…
SD
Hi Donna, My family also attended another ward that was much more welcoming to us. At the time we told people that due to my work schedule it was the only time slot that would allow us to attend SM as a family. That excuse bought us a year long reprieve. At the end of the year you could appeal to the enduring relationships that you have built over the last year.
I currently am the bear cub scout leader. This has been a good way for me to stay connected to the ward but not needing to be neck deep in the ward. Perhaps you could ask to be released but suggest a less demanding calling as a way for you to keep your metaphorical foot in the door. It doesn’t have to be “all in” or “all out”.
Just my thoughts.
Do you know a stake leader of some kind (even a High Councilor) with whom you could speak privately about the way the Bishop talks to people – someone who might be able to talk with him privately about it? Attending another ward is discouraged, but it always is an option, especially if you don’t mind not having a calling.
SilentDawning wrote:I was in a similar situation a few years ago when Young Women put duct tape over my daughter’s mouth and tried to forcibly bind her hands and feet, and then confine her in a bedroom. She broke free, but it left a kind of emotional scar that made her refuse to go to our Ward.
SD
😮 What?!!! Seriously?! SD, I know you’ve talked about your daughter having a hard time with the YW, but that is insane!! What a horrible experience. I can’t believe you didn’t get any support from leadership with that! Sorry your family had to go through that!
It’s incredible the difference a ward makes. I have to roll my eyes whenever people start talking about how our current church is set up the same way that Christ set up the church in his day. Sorry, but I don’t see any evidence of Christ going around setting up wards and stakes. It seems like he was pushing away from the strict organized style of religion that the pharisees and saduccees were enforcing. In my opinion, the organized church should simply be a tool to help us stay focused on our personal relationship with God, and to provide opportunities to serve others. Outside of that, I see everything at church as secondary and mostly unnecessary. The gospel should be simple and focused on love. Unfortunately, some wards really get wrapped up in the dogma and treat the Handbook of Instructions as if it takes precedent over all other scripture.
🙄 Quote:Unfortunately, some wards really get wrapped up in the dogma and treat the Handbook of Instructions as if it takes precedent over all other scripture.
Which is especially unfortunately, since it isn’t scripture in any sense of the word.
SilentlyDawning, It is terrible what they did to your daughter. I am so sorry. I can’t believe how the church leaders just pretend things didn’t happened. I like you idea. I am still working on getting released. I do feel a big relief just knowing I am making the right decision. I am looking forward to finding something to do other than church service.
Thank you so much for your support. I am glad that things are better for you and your family.
Ray, I like your idea. I think we need to go to another ward. It would be nice to meet some new people and take a much needed break. I am glad that you are enjoying your calling in the scouts.
I think it is important to go to church even if it is not in your own ward.
I appreciate your support.
Donna, do you have a friendly relationship with the Bishop or other members of the Bishopric? I believe in a direct approach to anyone I’m having a problem with. (Maybe because I’m old.)
It hasn’t always been that way. You should be Non-confrontational and Non-threatening.
If I were in a similar position, I would say to the Bishop:
Quote:Every leader has his own style of leadership.
How would you as the Bishop of our congregation describe your style? I’ve listened to you as you approach
various members of the ward & this is how I interpret what you’re saying or asking members to do.
You have to do it in your own words & style. If he’s smart, he would listen to you & will want feedback.Most leaders in the church want to succeed. Most of them have had very little experience really leading others.
If he takes offence, you know he won’t change on his own. Then you make a decision to go farther up the
organization. It has been my experience that SP’s always support the local Bishops.
If that happens, you know you have to go somewhere else or put up with the problem.
In time all Bishops move on or out.
Minyan Man, I talked to the Bishop. I really don’t know any one in the Bishopric well. They are young and fairly new.
I too believe in the direct approach. I was careful what I said but the Bishop is not willing to release me.
I am not surprised. He is running out of people to serve in the ward.
Thank you support and taking the time to share your thoughts with me.
You do realize you can tell the bishop, “I am sorry, but I am no longer going to do the calling at the end of the year”. You can even do that via an email or a text and just draw the boundary. If it just really isn’t working for you it might be better than pushing for months until you are so burned out you leave in a fit of rage. It isn’t your issue if SLC and the local stake has drawn the ward too small. By quitting you may be moving closer to allowing the stake to see an issue and adjust some ward boundaries. I know I have had that happen both for growth and for a ward getting to small probably about once every 5 years that I have been in the church.
He sounds like a Bishop I had once. He didn’t last very long. Maybe 2 yrs. Leadership in the LDS church is completely different than any organization I’ve worked with.
What other organization chooses its leadership based on inspiration from God?
(I don’t believe it happens that way. That’s the way it is presented to the rank & file.)
A lot of times, it seems that Bishops are chosen based on how hard they work in their previous callings.
(Or, family ties.)
I agree with LookingHard.
Donna wrote:SilentlyDawning,
It is terrible what they did to your daughter. I am so sorry. I can’t believe how the church leaders just pretend things didn’t happened. I like you idea. I am still working on getting released. I do feel a big relief just knowing I am making the right decision. I am looking forward to finding something to do other than church service.
Thank you so much for your support. I am glad that things are better for you and your family.
To you and Holy Cow — we did talk to the leaders about the problem, and they were apologetic, spoke to the women involved, etcetera. I didn’t mean to imply they did nothing. They were concerned about it, even our bad Bishop. A YW leader even talked to my daughter about it and asked her how she was feeling and gave support. So it was well-handled.
However, this had happened over and over again in lesser bullying contexts — in the past, and in the future. And even later, one of the young women, as she passed my daughter in the hall, put her hand on my daughter’s ear and threw my daughter’s head really hard into the wall. Yet another threatened to get a gun and “blow her brains out”. So, that was why we left, among other things. It was the attitude of the girls, not the handling by the leaders.
To Donna — regarding Ray’s proactive approach. You will have to be careful how you word any concerns you express to the leadership. We had a problem with a bad Bishop and when people spoke out about it, it led to lectures about “supporting local leaders” in sacrament meeting. I do think these things have a place — eventually, a new SP took over and his counselors knew about the bad BP and replaced him immediately. So, it can encourage longer term change if there are enough people who express the same concern.
Have you considered telling the Bishop directly? I know this is a bit uncomfortable, but there is a saying that conflicts should be resolved at the lowest level possible in the organization.
You could get ideas about how to say it here on STayLDS, but as a leader, I personally would want the feedback if I was doing something glaringly wrong like ordering people around…or getting after people in the hall….and that it was making someone who had just come out of semi-activity want to quit.
And I understand how the culture of the church can breed those attitudes in leaders. At one time, I was probably among the worst. Judgmental of people who refused the callings we offered them, negative about “half milers” as I called them — people who wouldn’t show the level of commitment I expected. We tend to set expectations of commitment from the members, to the point the church can seem like a business with employees. And leaders can sometimes forget that we are volunteers, and treat others like employees. They need to be reminded, and be thankful for the work people DO put forward.
A sensitive conversation with the Bishop, carefully worded, with affirmation for his good points, but also sharing the impact the way people are treating each other on your own commitment, might have an impact.
And by the way — you are a leader. You are one of the tone setters in the Ward. You are in a position to influence how people treat each other in your own stewardship.
I have a belief, and that is that leaders are responsible for creating a culture in their organizations. And when people are unkind to each other, it is my job to neutralize that unkind [or whatever bad value the behavior exemplifies] culture.
I had a situation once where to HP started fighting in the parking lot. The one HP came after the other HP as he drove away in his car, beating his automobile with his fists.
I could have just let it go, but I was concerned about the culture and damage to our unity. I met with both of the people individually, heard their perspectives separately. I even drove to the victim’s house right after I saw it happen to simply tell him I cared about it and listened to both of them. Afterwards, the guy who was the victim in the case, I shared my belief that it shouldn’t have happened, and that it was something I would talk to the other person about. That I hoped he didn’t think this was a pattern in our Ward. The other person, I listened to him and made a soft suggestion and gave impressions. I encouraged both to apologize if they felt they could. And then was sensitive to their respective situations as we planned events and worked together.
Contrast that with a Bishop I reported to who saw open hate in a letter distributed about me personally to the entire leadership. He did nothing to curb the unkind behavior and it was a major trigger for my lack of commitment today. THAT creates a culture. In this case, it was one of avoidance and lack of implied appreciation for the many hours I put into serving our Ward.
Leaders need to deal with these interpersonal faux pas. So, if you feel you can provide the bishop with honest feedback, and share the impact his behavior has on you, in a kind, affirmative way, that could help you contribute to a better experience for others in the ward.
I would consider, if appropriate, talking to the people in the hall the Bishop called out (privately, individually) if you feel you know them or are comfortable with it. Just indicate you heard it and wanted to indicate empathy for how it might have made them feel, and let them know how much you appreciate their service in the Ward. You don’t have to diss the Bishop, but you can show affirmation for the person who was chewed out in the hall and try to neutralize the culture this Bishop is inadvertently creating. You may find it even rolled off the back of the person who bore the brunt of it, or it may have bothered them, in which case your reaching out might be meaningful. I would consider this based on how well I knew the person, the extent to which I felt it bothered them, etcetera, but it is something I might consider doing. There would be a lot of factors to consider as it’s an art to handle these things diplomatically when it involves a leader to whom you report.
Good luck with this…it’s at the heart of the gospel in my view.
SilentlyDawning, I appreciate your advice. You are very wise.I have been there for people who have been called out in the hall. I hope I made them feel better. The Bishop gave a talk about being rebellious and not wanting to be at church. I think the Bishop totally missed what I was trying to tell him about how people need feel they are loved and respected at church. He still hasn’t released me. I was told not to come to church or I would get embarrassed.I took that as a warning. I don’t think the my hard work in my calling was appreciated. I was very surprised when I was told not to attend.People really do make or break a ward, work place and organizations.
I have not been back since.I really have no desire to attend my ward any more. It is time to find another place to attend church. I am starting to understand why attendance is so low in my ward. I really don’t think everyone who is misses church is rebellious. Some people work on Sunday, have to help elderly parents who live out of town, etc. I do think if people don’t feel comfortable some where they are less likely to go.
I feel at peace with my decision to quit my calling. I have realized that doing what is best for yourself isn’t always easy.
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