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I imagine most of us have experienced it: You are sitting in church listening to a talk or lesson, when the speaker or teacher addresses an issue about which you feel uneasy. Maybe the the trigger is a certain hymn that starts to be sung by the congregation. Soon there is a knot in your stomach and your heart rate rises as you feel anxiety and just want to get out of there. Sometimes you can cope by tuning out and focusing on something else but sometimes you feel like the only emotionally healthy option is to get up and leave. Before my faith crisis I never experienced anything like this at church. Now it occurs on a regular basis (although thankfully I feel like it is getting less and less frequent). The only word I can think of to describe it is trauma.
Why am I experiencing this and will it eventually go away? Does anyone have insight into what is causing such a gut-wrenching reaction?
I think you’re right that most of us have experienced or do experience this, and it can be a talk, testimony, lesson or song. I usually do as you said and distract myself with my tablet and/or phone. This past Sunday we sang “Praise to the Man” as a rest hymn. I know it doesn’t bother some people here, but it bothers me – I took a restroom break. And sometimes the best option for our own sanity is to leave. Quote:Why am I experiencing this and will it eventually go away? Does anyone have insight into what is causing such a gut-wrenching reaction?
I don’t know why we experience it but like you it has gotten better/less frequent over time – but it still happens. If it eventually goes away I’ll let you know. I’m not a psychologist so say I can’t really say what causes it but it probably has to do with the root symptoms of our faith crises – perhaps that we felt deceived or lied to or whatever and even perhaps that we yearn for it to be all better and the way it used to be. I really don’t know, I’ve just learned coping mechanisms.
Yes, I have felt those feelings before. I attribute them to experiencing a moment of cognitive dissonance where you feel that what you believe/know no longer matches what everyone else around you believes/knows AND that if they could read your mind, you would be ousted from the tribe (spear points strictly optional).
I came very close to creating a thread called Nibbler and the Terrible, Horrible, No Good, Very Bad Sunday. I recently posted a thread about when to speak up and when to hold your tongue and last Sunday put me to the test. I still have some very strong triggers; when we attack people for not worshiping leaders and when we attack the “thems,” be they members of other religions, people who have left the church, gay people, etc. Last Sunday we got to do both for two of the three hours. The other hour was (unintentionally) a reenactment of getting up on the Rameumptom.
It was by far the worst block of Sunday meetings that I have attended in years and years. I could give a play by play but I’ll boil it down to one observation:
We criticize people that leave the church because they misplaced their faith in the leaders of the church… and we know they are being led by Satan because they don’t place their faith in the leaders of the church.
We want that cake and we want to eat it too… or we’ll get you coming and going. Not sure which.
In the case of sacrament meeting I got up and left. It was exceptionally bad. Lots of judgement being passed on multiple groups… except the prophets. The joke about how Catholics are taught that the Pope is infallible but no one believes it and Mormons are taught that the prophet is fallible but none of the members believe it was told and it was used as a segue right into the 14 fundamentals that focused on how inerrant the prophets are. Sometimes we’re completely blind to what we’re saying.
SS I did my best to daydream. PH was a continuation of SM’s prophet love-fest.
It was bad enough to elicit an emotional response strong enough to make me never want to go back to church. At this point it probably is best for us to take a break from one another.
No hard feelings against anyone or anything at church. It’s just that the people that enjoy church and make those comments have needs that are
verydifferent than mine. Some people need their trust in a prophet and if they are hurtful it isn’t intentional. We’re all blind to the judgments we pronounce, the no-win scenarios we create for others. I should have spoken up during PH. I did speak up during SM, muttering things under my breath as I walked out.
:angel: The trauma comes, because your perspective of the Church has shifted. You loved the Church, because of what it claimed to be, and the needs it helped fulfill. Now, you recognize that the Church is not entirely what it claimed to be, and it is no longer able to fulfill your needs as it once did. But you remember the way it made you feel, and that hurts. The only way to overcome the trauma is through forgiveness. I’ve had to forgive the Church, Joseph Smith, the Church leaders, my parents, my teachers… I’ve had to forgive myself for being wrong. I’ve had to forgive them all, not only for what has happened, but the mistakes that will continue to be made. We’re all very broken. We need to make peace with that fact.
POTENTIAL PRIMARY RANT WARNING: Church for me this week was my husband vacating the chapel to deal with health issues while I dealt with our 2 daughters (8 years old functioning around 5-6 years old and almost 2 years old respectively) in the chapel. Normally, in this situation, if my husband goes out, we all go out and hang in the nursery. My husband counseled that he wanted us to stay in the chapel even though he could not because he felt there was an extra dose of “spirit” and/or he wanted me to start Sacrament training the girls (not sure). We survived…
After sacrament meeting the Primary President tried to shame me into committing to serve in nursery next week to cover for the nursery leader. I am completely fine with supporting her – and if I can, I will probably let her know via IM Saturday night or Sunday morning. She used the “Well, you are the only parent available..” line – what she meant to say is that out of the 3 moms, the other 2 have other time commitments. I thought about telling her she could ask my husband (because he also qualifies as a parent)… but decided not to (not sure if it is because I love my husband, or because I didn’t want to hear him complain about turning her down). I just currently refuse to commit to a specific time ahead of time when it comes to church right now, and that is not what she wanted to hear. I can even respect that. It was just annoying because she wanted a more formal commitment then I was willing to give and wasn’t taking my level of commitment gracefully. The 7-10 times we have been to church this year, I have covered nursery all but 1x I think. This is part because the branch was in between nursery leaders for part of that.
Following that debacle, the Primary managed to “lose” my daughter from her Senior Sharing Time to hanging out in nursery with me. As near as I can tell, the teachers did not ensure she transitioned from her classroom to Sharing Time (at all), the leaders did not double-check to find her (or if they saw her through the nursery glass – did not knock or say anything) and/or allowed my daughter to leave to come and find me in the nursery without following up with us about it. (Still sore about that one). I counted 18 children total that would be roughly divided between 2 sharing times – how is this even possible?
Mr. Sneelock wrote:
Soon there is a knot in your stomach and yourheart rate rises as you feel anxiety and just want to get out of there. Sometimes you can cope by tuning out and focusing on something else but sometimes you feel like the only emotionally healthy option is to get up and leave. […]
Why am I experiencing this and will it eventually go away? Does anyone have insight into what is causing such a gut-wrenching reaction?
Yeah, that’s a fight-or-flight response to a perceived threat. I think AmyJ got it right. It’s probably good old cognitive dissonance.
Last week, just to see if I could, I tried to make myself believe that the next time it rained, the grass would stay dry while everything else got soaked. I imagined it in detail and tried to convince myself that that’s how rain always works. I managed it for 15 seconds, during which the evidence of always seeing the grass get wet when it rains pulled hard against the false belief. My heart rate, respiratory rate, and discomfort rose quickly. By the time I let go of the belief, I was in full fight-or-flight mode, alternating between afraid and angry. While I calmed down, I experienced mild dissociation and vertigo. I didn’t like thinking about grass for the next couple of days.
Cognitive dissonance is legit.
(I’m running a poll about this on another site. Nobody has been able to keep up the false belief for a whole minute.)
Here’s my theory about uncomfortable church stuff. We’re social creatures. One aspect of this is that we adopt the beliefs of the groups we belong to unless we consciously resist them. I think that beliefs we recently had pull on our minds more strongly than novel beliefs. Our evidence and motivation for rejecting those beliefs pull in the opposite direction, so we experience cognitive dissonance.
Take this with a grain of salt, though. I’m just an armchair psychologist.
I do know that being made to experience cognitive dissonance repeatedly isn’t good for your mental health. Your good options are to leave or distract yourself. Your bad options are to fight somehow or ride it out.
I’ve found sitting near the door to be a good strategy. And yes, it does mostly go away, eventually. At 1.5 years after my faith crisis, I get triggered by a lot less than I used to. It seems more likely to happen if I’m having a stressful day.
Mr. Sneelock wrote:I imagine most of us have experienced it: You are sitting in church listening to a talk or lesson, when the speaker or teacher addresses an issue about which you feel uneasy. Maybe the the trigger is a certain hymn that starts to be sung by the congregation.
How about the most common one: Father’s Day.
Just soon enough after Mother’s Day that we get to remember the glowing praise heaped upon every mother, which just makes it worse that every mention is how fathers should be trying harder.
Bad enough being a noncustodial parent with an ex who makes sure that the full days I’m supposed to have them for my birthday and Father’s Day never happen. Piling on a series of lectures on what crappy parents we all are is too much.
For me, “Families are Forever” is irritating. I have no living family I am close to. I am unmarried. I’ve never experienced anything this bad at church. In non-church contexts but not in church.
As I read the postings I’ve asked myself “is traumatized” the right description for what I feel at church? Traumatized to me means: injury to the body, mind or spirit. Examples may include: victim of a violent act.
There are situations at church where I feel VERY uncomfortable. There are ways I try to cope.
a. there are a core group of members I feel comfortable with. They are my main social contacts.
b. there are a select meetings I go to. Gospel Doctrine is a big NO. I stay busy during this hour with Family History, social contacts, etc.
c. never attend leadership meetings or accept leadership positions.
d. I apologize when I’ve shot my mouth off. (this happens more then I like.)
In all situations, I try to relax as much as possible & focus on the basic core of my beliefs.
When that doesn’t happen, I zone out.
Minyan Man wrote:
As I read the postings I’ve asked myself “is traumatized” the right description for what I feel at church?
I agree that
traumais a severe word to use and by using it I would never want to minimize the real trauma that others suffer because of horrible experiences. I am just trying to understand why I experience such intense feelings at church. I can sit through a professional training and disagree completely with what the presenter is saying with no negative emotional reaction. I think all of your responses have truth to them; I’m probably experiencing a mixture of cognitive dissonance, feelings of betrayal, and a major loss of identity. I also think I experienced a very real emotional trauma when my bishop yanked my temple recommend a year and half ago and those feelings still get stirred up.
I appreciate having others here who relate to what I am experiencing. This faith journey is painful and lonely at times but I always find some peace and healing when I visit this forum.
Traumatized may not actually be what everyone feels but I don’t think the word is inappropriate in this context. At least some truly are traumatized. I work in an agency where every one of our clients has been traumatized in some way and some of them have been severely traumatized (especially by abuse). These people live with this trauma every day of their lives and it is part of how they interact with the world and with others. I recognize that what one person might recognize as abuse might be different from what I recognize as abuse – that doesn’t mean the person actually experiencing the abuse is not abused. The same is true for trauma. I had a traumatic experience in the stillbirth of our third child. That is in no way the fault of the church. I did however have an unrealistic expectation of living a semi-charmed life based in part on LDS teachings.
I liken this to being told that a particular road was completely safe for worthy church members – by divine protection. One day you get beaten and mugged – maybe your loved one was killed – on this same road. You struggle with feelings of failure because perhaps the divine protection was lacking because of some personal failing on your part. After much soul searching and meeting with priesthood leaders you come to understand that “Life” happens to the good and the bad. Random chance exists in God’s universe. Also that a fair number of assurances of divine protection were not really doctrine at all – they were anecdotal stories, faith promoting rumors, personal testimonies, and other words to describe the tendency of the imperfect membership to preach the prosperity gospel above and beyond what is justified by scripture.
Unfortunately in subsequent church meetings many examples of the prosperity gospel continue to be taught. Sometimes you speak up, sometimes you do not. sometimes after you speak another individual will approach you after class in gratitude, sometimes they do not. But almost always the elements of the prosperity gospel seem to be more accepted, more welcome, and more consistent with the message of the lesson. Everyone seems eager to proclaim that a particular road is completely safe for worthy church members – by divined protection.
To be much more concise, I feel that the messages that I hear at church diminish, minimize, downplays, devalues, and ignores my lived experience.
Mr. Sneelock wrote:
Why am I experiencing this
I feel like it has to do with seeing our old selves standing there and delivering a similar message which we now see as misguided, false, demeaning, etc. Since we usually feel that the old thinking was wrong and have moved on from it, it can be very uncomfortable to be shown evidence that we were once like that.Mr. Sneelock wrote:
and will it eventually go away?
‘Yes’ mostly, ‘no’ entirely.I think the key is in accepting that other people are just that… other people. And they have every right to believe what they believe and to express their beliefs. I find LDS Church-goers to be wonderful people and I allow them to have their beliefs without getting worked up about it.
However, there are still times when I can’t quite do it. Although I am mostly at-peace with myself, my life, and the Church, I left SM on Mother’s Day when the Bishop got up to give his high praise to women and the important “role” they have. I just couldn’t take it and left. I know he meant well and I take no offense from that view point, but I just didn’t want to listen to it.
Mr. Sneelock wrote:
Before my faith crisis I never experienced anything like this at church. Now it occurs on a regular basis (although thankfully I feel like it is getting less and less frequent). The only word I can think of to describe it is trauma.Why am I experiencing this and will it eventually go away? Does anyone have insight into what is causing such a gut-wrenching reaction?
For me it was a quiet sadness and disconnectedness from everything going on around me. It was like I was observing the people around me like an alien, or a visitor from another planet. What seemed familiar, was no longer familiar. Principles and ways of doing things I formerly took for granted were all up for evaluation. And then, there was this accompanying sadness that I’d lost my community. When I would talk to people who formerly, were among the small group of people in the world who understood my values, they were people who had to be “managed” and around whom I had to be careful what I say lest I offend them. Or they run to the Bishop screaming apostasy.
At times I felt angry at how they suck you dry in our church, take you for granted, and then are disloyal behind your back in leadership meetings. When they should be meeting with you to listen to you, and try to make amends. But I think that came BEFORE the sadness and feeling of being disconnected. It was the trigger that made me accept less flattering interpretations of the church, and then led to the sadness and feeling of disconnectedness.
I continue to compare it to eating from the tree of knowledge. I found myself in the lone and dreary world where things didn’t look nearly as flattering as they did in the TBM garden of eden.
It goes away — for me, the sadness went away when I found new communities. New projects, new service, and realized I didn’t need the church as badly as they said. I didn’t lose my job, my family didn’t disintegrate, and overall, I was happier. As far as disconnectedness goes — yes, I am still disconnected, but I feel this sense of triumph that in spite of losing my place in the community, I am happier with the other projects I have going.
So, you have to be proactive and seeking happiness through extra-curricular service, learning to accept the TBM’s and the church they way they are, minimizing their ability to bring angst into your life, and getting on your own clock/conscience.
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