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February 28, 2021 at 4:42 pm #213020
Anonymous
GuestThe following is a Wikipedia link to the Japanese concept of kintsugi – repairing cracked or broken pottery by welding it back together with gold threads. Kintsugi does not seek to hide or cover the cracks of a broken vessel; rather, it highlights those cracks by using gold. It takes the “brokenness” and makes it “valuable”. A broken pot that is “recreated” using kintsugi is more valuable than before it was broken.
I wish we could be more open about our own cracks and scars. I believe the concept of repentance (simply “change”) is not meant to hide or cover our “brokenness” but rather to highlight it in such a way that everyone can “value” the repair work. I believe if we can be open about being healed, others will be able to embrace and accept their own brokenness and also seek healing – rather than judgment and condemnation.
Scars are sacred. Scars are valuable. Scars are redeeming. Scars don’t need to be removed or hidden; they are the proof we showed up and persevered through our own battles.
February 28, 2021 at 5:17 pm #340849Anonymous
GuestThanks for sharing this Old-Timer. I love the concept and agree I wish we could be more open about being healed. I think this concept id very similar to what Fiona and Terryl Givens have been teaching in their more recent works ( The Christ Who Healsand All Things New) with the idea of “woundedness.” That is that Christ heals us from our woundedness as opposed to saves us from the wrath of God for our offensive sins (healer as opposed to savior, although I don’t think it’s necessarily all either/or, rather it’s probably and). I think that being healed from wounds would also imply that there are scars. February 28, 2021 at 10:45 pm #340850Anonymous
GuestOld-Timer wrote:
I wish we could be more open about our own cracks and scars. I believe the concept of repentance (simply “change”) is not meant to hide or cover our “brokenness” but rather to highlight it in such a way that everyone can “value” the repair work. I believe if we can be open about being healed, others will be able to embrace and accept their own brokenness and also seek healing – rather than judgment and condemnation.
I wish this is what we took “confession” to mean. Where “confessing” means simply admitting that you struggle at times and have problems, like everyone else. So everyone knows they’re not alone in their imperfection and can support each other. The way things currently are there’s a stigma around repentance, like people having to go into the bishop’s office or very publicly not being allowed to take the sacrament. It’s like we think shame is a necessary part of repentance (though we like to call it “godly sorrow” sometimes).
March 1, 2021 at 1:25 pm #340851Anonymous
GuestArrakeen wrote:
Old-Timer wrote:
I wish we could be more open about our own cracks and scars. I believe the concept of repentance (simply “change”) is not meant to hide or cover our “brokenness” but rather to highlight it in such a way that everyone can “value” the repair work. I believe if we can be open about being healed, others will be able to embrace and accept their own brokenness and also seek healing – rather than judgment and condemnation.
I wish this is what we took “confession” to mean. Where “confessing” means simply admitting that you struggle at times and have problems, like everyone else. So everyone knows they’re not alone in their imperfection and can support each other. The way things currently are there’s a stigma around repentance, like people having to go into the bishop’s office or very publicly not being allowed to take the sacrament. It’s like we think shame is a necessary part of repentance (though we like to call it “godly sorrow” sometimes).
I think what often happens, perhaps as an evolution of Catholic/Protestant theology and creeds creeping into Church theology, is that many members conflate “repentance” with “penance.” Repentance (change) is part of our theology, penance is not. Yet, there are policies which would seem to indicate otherwise, setting time limits and certain restrictions on “worthiness.” The problem is that some us understand that we’re all worthy of God’s love always and there is no worthiness associated with it.
I think there are a few great talks over the years that sort of illustrate the general misunderstanding.
Elder Nelson April 2007:
https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/general-conference/2007/04/repentance-and-conversion?lang=eng ” class=”bbcode_url”> https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/general-conference/2007/04/repentance-and-conversion?lang=eng Theodore Burton (Seventy) at BYU 1985:
https://speeches.byu.edu/talks/theodore-m-burton/meaning-repentance/ ” class=”bbcode_url”> https://speeches.byu.edu/talks/theodore-m-burton/meaning-repentance/ And My hero DFU, Oct. 2016:
https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/general-conference/2016/10/o-how-great-the-plan-of-our-god?lang=eng ” class=”bbcode_url”> https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/general-conference/2016/10/o-how-great-the-plan-of-our-god?lang=eng March 3, 2021 at 11:32 pm #340852Anonymous
GuestI’ve seen some examples of this in museums. It is beautiful. I suppose it arises out of the fact Japan is very earthquake prone. Regarding penance, I think it depends what it is for. Catholic friends tell me it is pretty basic if the sin is minor. I think with major issues, it is natural to expect another person to demonstrate their regret visibly. There are certain things which I have done in my past I wish I could atone for. It is hard when you no longer know a person you have wromged. With some of the uglier or crueller things I have done I feel I need to do penance for them for my own peace of mind.
March 4, 2021 at 12:40 pm #340853Anonymous
GuestSamBee wrote:
I’ve seen some examples of this in museums. It is beautiful. I suppose it arises out of the fact Japan is very earthquake prone.Regarding penance, I think it depends what it is for. Catholic friends tell me it is pretty basic if the sin is minor. I think with major issues, it is natural to expect another person to demonstrate their regret visibly. There are certain things which I have done in my past I wish I could atone for. It is hard when you no longer know a person you have wromged. With some of the uglier or crueller things I have done I feel I need to do penance for them for my own peace of mind.
Without derailing too much, I guess my question is where in the NT did Jesus Christ ask for anyone to do any penance? Penance does seem to have been part of the Jewish tradition (sackcloth and ashes, for example) but I think it’s one of those things that was done away with Christ. He has already at-oned for everything. Jesus freely and immediately forgave everyone who asked Him without condition. That’s what God’s love is like. God’s love is not dependent on our obedience. That’s not to say I don’t believe in the power of apology or trying to make things right with other humans, and that’s probably different than penance. I think part of this penance idea comes from the abominable creeds and a misunderstanding of what sin is. Sin is a mistake, a misstep, things we all do – sin is not an offense against a wrathful God. For further understanding on this I highly recommend
All Things New. It’s a fairly short read, and that particular chapter is mind blowing. March 9, 2021 at 4:04 am #340854Anonymous
GuestOld-Timer wrote:
I wish we could be more open about our own cracks and scars. I believe the concept of repentance (simply “change”) is not meant to hide or cover our “brokenness” but rather to highlight it in such a way that everyone can “value” the repair work. I believe if we can be open about being healed, others will be able to embrace and accept their own brokenness and also seek healing – rather than judgment and condemnation.
I think the way to start this is to be willing to be vulnerable yourself with your own brokenness. I frequently talk about mine in Relief Society and Sunday School. I talk about how I have dealt with depression, anxiety, the struggle I had when my daughter left the church and came out as pan-sexual. I have talked to the youth about the 20 years I stayed away from the temple due to anxiety, didn’t have a temple recommend, didn’t pay tithing, but eventually made it back and became an ordinance worker.
I can’t count the number of people who have thanked me for my willingness to share. The more open we are, the more open others will be when they realize they aren’t the only ones.
March 9, 2021 at 10:49 am #340855Anonymous
GuestMaumasaurus wrote:I think the way to start this is to be willing to be vulnerable yourself with your own brokenness. I frequently talk about mine in Relief Society and Sunday School. I talk about how I have dealt with depression, anxiety, the struggle I had when my daughter left the church and came out as pan-sexual. I have talked to the youth about the 20 years I stayed away from the temple due to anxiety, didn’t have a temple recommend, didn’t pay tithing, but eventually made it back and became an ordinance worker.
I can’t count the number of people who have thanked me for my willingness to share. The more open we are, the more open others will be when they realize they aren’t the only ones.
We have a member who openly admits to being a recovering alcoholic, and a member of the AA and ARP. He has done a lot of good.
I think the flipside of this is that there is a time and place to discuss these things. I once told a missionary about my struggles with depression and he dismissed them and told me that none of his friends or family had mental illness. I replied that they did – it’s just a matter of pure statistics – but that if he kept up that kind of attitude none of them would ever tell him about it. I also reminded him that dentistry, which he was going into after he returned, was one of the professions with the highest suicide rates. This elder said all this when he was my home too, which made it even more uncomfortable and I refused to let any other missionaries in there for months because of him. Part of me felt like physically throwing him out of my home, but I never acted on it.
I hope he is a bit wiser some years later. I could have reported him for this, and some nasty comments he made when he thought I was out of earshot but I never did. In his leaving speech at our chapel, he boasted about how his father had told him to “Return with Honor”, and that he would. His arrogance was actually pretty repulsive, but a few words from this crazy guy to his mission president etc could have derailed that “honor” and put him in hot water. Luckily for him, the crazy guy showed him more compassion than he ever showed me.
I don’t think I’ve fully forgiven him, but life moves on. He has never come back to visit the ward and I can’t even remember his name. I have met many good missionaries but he just left a bad taste in my mouth.
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