A Healing Podcast

[Anonymous]

I found some good thoughts in this. I am still processing but it might give up ideas as we move forward, especially as middle-way type people.

http://www.mormonmentalhealth.org/055-the-effects-of-excommunication-on-all-of-us-healing-perspectives/

[Anonymous]

I thought, “Alright, fine, I’ll listen even though it’s not going to help me.” But it did. You have to get past all the tedious podcast-ish introductions and preliminary thoughts, but there were some really interesting ideas further in.

Thanks for posting.

[Anonymous]

I also didn’t have high hopes, but in the end I liked it also. I also don’t feel in any great turmoil. John was clear months and months ago on his stance and where he wouldn’t back down. I know Mormon leadership well enough to know that he was not bowing down the way that the leadership defines humility and that alone can get you in trouble. In my mind I knew months ago it was a foregone conclusion.

[Anonymous]

I’d love to hear anyone’s comments about Joanna Brooks’ cycle included in the notes.

secular/non-LDS

criticism

caricature

antagonism

shaming

I

I

V

LDS base

retrenchment

withdrawl

militancy

“undergrounding” (one story for the outside world when in-group reality is different)

I

I

V

In-group

boundary maintenance

excommunication

shaming

I

I

V

Dissident/stigmatized LDS

appeal to outside world

expose in-group microviolence

Repeat.

She said that the question “on her heart” is whether we’ll always be caught in this cycle. She wondered whether the “old” progressives like Eugene England and Lowell Bennion were better, more gracious navigators of a middle way. On the other hand, she wonders, “What happened?” How did the Mormonism of her youth, which gave her all the courage she has, turn into present Mormonism that isn’t big enough to ignore a critical podcaster.

I’ve undoubtedly got a LOT wrong trying to pack it into a nutshell. And I don’t really understand how LDS Base and In-group are different. (?) But if anyone wants to listen and discuss that would be great. If not, no problemo.

[Anonymous]

I am going to listen to it — I read the introductory notes.

It caused me to reflect on the emotional turmoil my church experience has caused me over the years. Many sleepless nights. It was church experiences that triggered clinical depression in me about five years ago, and the use of temporary meds to help me get out of it now and then.

I had to pay for counseling for my daughter due to church experiences, which was successful, but her LDS experience has been hard on her self-esteem. And the emphasis on eternal family, the social stigma against divorce (I am not divorced) has also been very, very hard on me. Also, the emphasis on marrying in the faith in areas where there isn’t a lot of choice in a marriage partner was very hard on me as well. As John Dehlin said, the LDS church’s truth claims trigger a lot of life decisions, and in some cases, the church influence can be destructive to a person’s mental health.

What makes this hard is the deep commitment that is required from the active member by the church, as well as my personal expectations of the organization to be somehow better than other temporal organizations in which I have served. I don’t expect this in other temporal organizations, or even non-Mormon service organizations. But given the massive claims of our church, its inability to provide the same type of commitment it expects of me, has been a huge source of mental anguish over the years. And at times, it threatened my marriage when I could not bring myself to continue as a fully committed Mormon.

The excommunication of John hasn’t (fortunately) been a source of anguish for me — only disappointment and a reminder of what awaits the person who speaks their mind openly. As well as sadness for the impact it had on John and his Stake Presidents’ families.

[Anonymous]

Ann wrote

Quote:

I don’t really understand how LDS Base and In-group are different.

I think by LDS Base, she is referencing the top leaders/pr team, etc. They set things up and the In-Group kind of embraces it and makes it happen. The In-group would be like local leadership, kind of like in High School when newbies were trying to break in with the popular kids and so would do or say things to give them social cred and get “in” the group.

Also – I think Jennifer mentions this podcast is totally thrown together, off the cuff, first thoughts thing. Joanna may yet share more. Even if her cycle isn’t complete it is an interesting series of actions and reactions.

Ann wrote

Quote:

On the other hand, she wonders, “What happened?” How did the Mormonism of her youth, which gave her all the courage she has, turn into present Mormonism that isn’t big enough to ignore a critical podcaster.

On this matter, I think we have forgotten that most of us were too young when the September 6 were overhauled. Joanna would have been in college and she has said it affected her, but when we are 20 we still believe we can change the world. We can be the Saturday’s Warrior. At mid-life it’s different. I also think the church has changed from our youth. We were a more enthusiastic group. Now we are trying to please everyone and that has us in a strange bend.

My favorite parts were Dan Wotherspoon and Jennifer Finlayson Fife.

[Author]

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