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I was hoping for such an outcome. Sounds like you have a Branch President with the right kind of vision — one that balances the needs of the individual with the aims of the organization. These two values often conflict. I’m glad that helping you feel welcome and showing respect for the instrinsic cWald appears to have been on your BP’s mind. And by the way, could someone change the spelling of development in the subject line of this thread?
Hi all. Thank you for your kind words. Myself and jwald appreciate it. As far as being sent out to pasture – I am fine with it and it is actually a huge relief to me. I feel like DB over at NOM talked about last week – just a big burden has been lifted off me. The only thing that sucks about it is the way it happened, and the whole getting “turned in” by family members because of my middle way rhetoric, and my “questioning certain beliefs of the church.”
Here is what I know. I got another phone call this morning from BP. He talked with the SP again this morning. The SP would like to talk to me – and the BP said it was just a standard visit that SPs do when they release someone from a stake calling (EQP). Also, he said that there will be no discipline at this time and that I am to keep my mouth shut and my opinion to myself, and that if there are no further “reports” than he considers the matter closed.
The BP asked me to lay low until the water clears and mentioned that I should be VERY VERY careful about what I write or say on online forums and emails to family, and that there is no doubt that I am being “monitored” and the SP is in contact with someone about my online activities, and suggested that perhaps I discontinue association with whatever online groups I am involved in, at least until things cool down.
From my brothers email yesterday, he pretty well describe the StayLDS website as anti-mormon and apostate, and that he and my SP brother has read some of the stuff that I have written on the forums. So pretty well I am being monitored by family and that they consider my activities on the web as apostate, AND obviously –
they are going to report my activities to my SP, as they have demonstrated this week. NOM website was never mentioned, but….. There is a very good chance they are reading this post right now.
So, my friends, I appreciate it, and I will probably lay low and do a little more lurking and less participating for awhile. I will certainly keep you up-to-date with my situation, and if I hear anymore news coming out of Cache Valley in regards to “the Middle Way” movement.
Thanks all. Be careful with your rhetoric, especially if you are active in the church and you live in the cache valley area. Out.
10-4, Comrade Cwald. I will instruct Communications personnel to put out an APB to the outpost chapters of the Movement to implement Strategy 12 worldwide. I knew the day would come that we would need Strategy 12; I just didn’t know it would come so soon. Out. Tom Haws wrote:10-4, Comrade Cwald. I will instruct Communications personnel to put out an APB to the outpost chapters of the Movement to implement Strategy 12 worldwide. I knew the day would come that we would need Strategy 12; I just didn’t know it would come so soon. Out.
🙂 Thanks Tom.Wow. Cwald, Jwald, you are in my prayers. For the benefit of any lurkers, I’m posting one of my favorite quotes from Elder Maxwell:
Quote:There is a real risk that members of the Church—particularly the young—may perceive the concept of the straight and narrow way too narrowly.
Variations of the concept of the straight and narrow path appear many times in the scriptures, but it is really a description of a clearly marked corridor to salvation and exaltation—a path of high adventure for the brave, not the intolerant; it is not an ecclesiastical “country club” situated on a narrow theological terrace.
The way is as wide as infinity in terms of its requirements of love and truth; it confines us only in marking those peril points along the path of life.
God bless you and your family, cwald!
… Cwald, I have followed this message thread and I feel bad for what you have had to endure Cwald. It looks like you have been betrayed by an over-zealous family member. Reminds me somewhat of what I had to endure years ago when I became an object of gossip years ago in one ward I use to be a member of. I felt people were making a mountain out of a molehill. Eventually I became inactive because I couldn’t take the psychological and social turmoil anymore.
BeLikeChrist
Well, I’m glad we got some kind of a resolution here. I’m saddened about the impact on your family. I think they might have shown more respect and love for the intrinsic cwald. If they felt THIS strongly about it, they might have at least warned you they would consider contacting someone in an official capacity and given you a chance to at least rethink what you say to family members before they pulled out the big guns. cwald wrote:a great comment is when I told him that I don’t really feel welcome, he said that he doesn’t really care if I am a “middle way – non-tithe paying mormon” and don’t have temple recommend or not, I am still welcome as long as he is the BP.
I can respect that.
You’re lucky to have a great guy on your side. That was an inspired comment, in my opinion. Evidence that there are some people at church that really are trying to live a Christ-like life. That must have been comforting to you, cwald. You need to feel like you can be you, as long as you are sincerely trying to do your best, and be accepted for that. God bless you and your family during this difficult time!
cwald wrote:From my brothers email yesterday, he pretty well describe the StayLDS website as anti-mormon and apostate
For what it is worth, I’ve had family members jump to this conclusion about this site as well…sometimes if it is not sanctioned by the church, some think it is anti- or nothing of value that can be trusted. It is just a reality of life, when uninformed opinions are developed, I’m sure I do it too about things I don’t know that much about.
But those that take time to read here and understand us, will not see it as such. That is where more info helps others to see, that from my point of view, it is simply christ-like support, in a way I was unable to find at church. It is about learning coping skills to navigate through life, when reality doesn’t match up with mormon idealism.
I wonder, cwald, how you might have handled this same situation prior to having worked through some of your issues over time on this site and elsewhere? Because it seems you handled yourself well, and did not have to cut ties with the church entirely as a result of this unfortunate turn of events and misunderstandings and judgments.
God bless you, friend. I’m really glad you are going to be able to remain actively involved in the Church, even if you are released from your calling. Yes, I don’t know how Ray and Brian feel about this, but I think many TBM would consider people who frequent this site, like myself, as totally apostate. I have one close friend in a different state in whom I confided about my conversations here on StayLDS. I trust him profusely and he cares about the intrinsic SilentDawning. He took a gander at this site and told me, for the first time in 12 years, that he thinks I am now officially apostate, even though at the time I could answers all the TR questions with integrity, and probably could do so now.
The one I would get caught on, he suggested would be “do you associate with any groups or individuals that teach ideas contrary to the Church” (paraphrased). Some of our ideas are more liberal than what you find in the mainstream at Church; even the StayLDS article advocates ways that are less than what the Church would like to see. So, in the hand of a militant priesthood leader who puts the organization way ahead of individuals, you might find a temple recommend denial forthcoming if that TR question exposed one’s involvement here.
As a result of sharing my involvement here, he flatly told me I was apostate, and even called me to explain what led to my apostasy so he could use it in a talk on preventing apostasy. So, my experience tells me there are some who see little value attached to what we do here. In fact, they may even see it as a deleterious influence.
Quote:Do you support, affiliate with, or agree with any group or individual whose teachings or practices are contrary to or oppose those accepted by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints?
I’m pretty sure that is the direct question.
Like most things, if taken on the surface some people assume this means only one thing and jump to conclusions about things. With more info and thought…one can see there is no danger to be found here at this site that challenges this temple recommend question. I’m still fine with answering “No” to this question and remaining involved with this group. I feel no opposition to the church here. Yes, there are opposing views some have at some time about some things … but there is no opposition to the church here. If there is…then I must go on my way…but I’m convinced there is not.
On this site, I am striving to understand and apply teachings and practices accepted by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints, based on my experiences in this life. Just because others at church don’t agree with me doesn’t mean I am opposing the church…only that we don’t agree on some things as fellow citizens of the church.
That’s my take. I do not have trials of faith as a result of visiting this site. I visit this site as a result of my trials I was having as a fully devoted TBM.
People generally see what their eyesight and/or glasses allow them to see – and that’s as true of everyone here as it is of anyone not here. I’m not surprised that some might see this site as a gathering of apostates – but I certainly don’t see it that way. Yeah, I understand why others might be concerned if they haven’t read and looked deeply into what we do here – or if it just is their natural tendency to reject anything that is not consistent with their own worldview. I really do get that – and I don’t condemn or mock or belittle them for it. It’s “faithful” for them, just as my approach is “faithful” for me. I’m a firmly believing, active, calling serving, deeply dedicated LDS member. I’m genetically Mormon. I am positive I will die an active member of the LDS Church. I believe strongly in honoring and supporting and sustaining the leaders of the Church – at all levels. I just don’t think any of us are infallible – and that includes me. I admit freely I might be wrong about a lot of things – but I’m doing my best to understand and live according to my understanding. I actually am a church geek – meaning I really enjoy church and worship and fellowship, even when I am frustrated at things and disagree with what might be said from the pulpit or in a class.
I don’t consider myself any “kind” of Mormon; I’m Mormon. Period. Full stop.
We don’t violate the temple recommend question in any way here. Period. Full stop.
I wouldn’t be involved if that happened here. Period. Full stop.
I ran across this quote and thought of cwald (and most of us, too): John Taylor, JD 9:14:
Quote:Suppose there are some who do not do exactly right in some places, what of that? There are many things that are not right. Never mind; everything that is wrong will in due time be righted. Permit me to bring a figure before you. A year ago last winter there was a very severe frost, and it injured the fruit trees. Some who professed to be judges thought it best to cut down the peach trees; some thought that if left alone they would still grow, and therefore they left them alone to see how many would live. There was quite a difference of opinion upon the subject, and some adopted one plan, and some another. The general impression was, I believe, that it would be best to cut off those limbs that were frost-bitten and that did not appear to have much sap in them.
Now, my doctrine is, Prune the trees, or, in other words, the branches of the great tree to which we are connected, just at the time when it will do the least injury. It requires great wisdom, however, to prune and regulate the Church of Christ. There were a great many of our people got frost-bitten—a kind of dead in their spirits, and some were for going right to work and pruning; but hold on. Said Jesus, “The wheat and tares must grow together until harvest.” Perhaps you would pull up the wheat with the tares, if you were to do it when you think best. If there is nothing good in a man, he will by-and-by develop the evil that is in him, and then everybody will agree that the pruning ought to be done, and the branch ought to be cut off; but if the good preponderates, it would be wrong, because of prejudice or ignorance, to destroy the good. It is best to leave it to the husbandman, and then all the congregation will say Amen.
HJ
I’m a HERETICnot an apostate. Sheeesh! They need to get their pejoratives correct 🙄 get it right…I am also a Mormon. I like what Ray said. I’m a Mormon, not a hyphenated Mormon. I’m on the same team. We are on the same team here.
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