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I have written on another thread about blowing up in EQ over the fathers and sons camp out excluding our daughters. I understand that the fathers and sons is a tradition in the church. However, I have to ask are we better than are traditions? I don’t think anyone can find a valid argument for the fathers and sons being doctrinal so it must fall under that category of tradition. Are we obligate to continue traditions that are hurtful, exclusionary or just plain out dated? I can think of other examples of traditions in the church that are wonderful. Like in our ward every fall the youth rake leaves and put up lights for the elderly. So I am not against all tradition. I am only asking do we have to follow something just because it is a tradition or can we be good enough to discard traditions that don’t make sense or are harmful?
The church has a history of moving beyond tradition, like the priesthood ban. I understand that sometimes it takes longer than we would like but, why does it take so long to change tradition? As disciples of Christ should we be better than our traditions?
Quote:why does it take so long to change tradition?
It provides an anchor in a tumultuous world.
Watch “Fiddler on the Roof”.
Seriously, it’s a great treatment of the struggle to hold onto tradition while still adapting.
Any religion or group is going to have traditions that are important to it identity. I do not think this is at all unique to Mormonism. Personally I just do not participate in traditions I deem silly. I have given up on cultural commandments and traditions that cause me angst —- both within the church and with my immediate family. I really am a black sheep. The simple answer is, “it depends on which tradition”. The Church has no problem putting the kabosh on traditions that don’t support current needs…like white water rafting trips outside the stake boundaries…those were good times when I was young, but budget needs changed all that nowadays. I think we can follow the lead the church exemplifies, and embrace traditions that enrich our lives, but let go of traditions of our fathers that don’t.
As SamBee said so well…
SamBee wrote:The simple answer is, “it depends on which tradition”.
‘With all due respect, I don’t think I will look to exemplify the church’s example when it comes to deciding which traditions to keep and which ones to throw out. I think they have done a poor job of it to be honest. I’m not much of guy who puts much merits into traditions – I guess that is why my VERY traditional family has issues with me, and why I have been a complete failure when it comes to mormon orthodoxy.
So, my answer is, YES, I would like to think my family and I are better than our traditions.
I can understand how traditions keep things from changing too fast. That seems like mostly a good thing unless your one of the ones that wishes the tradition would hurry up and change. I can’t speak from experience about Church traditions. In general I feel like traditions in society put huge limits on my life and who I can be. I guess my problem has a lot more to do with gender roles. But gender roles are just another tradition I think. I guess it depends on how broad your definition of tradition is. In the case of Behappy, his problem is with a tradition that excludes one gender. Things like this keep me awake at night hating the world. I don’t like to think of myself as a feminist because some times they seem to go to far the other way. I’m still angry at experiences from my childhood that I can’t get over, but should. Some people think that excluding a few girls from a camping trip is no big deal. I think that when you are young, these small things make a huge impact on who you are as an adult. I had similar things happen to me and I never forgot them. They made a huge impact. The things that changed who I am were tiny moments that would seem insignificant to any adult.
Whenever I see something happening at church I always wonder how is it shaping the children who are watching.
I actually liked father’s and son’s campout as a kid/teen. It was a night to get out and just be a guy. I hear women talk of “girls’ night out” with fondness, so I don’t understand the big deal. Besides if you invite the daughters and make it a father and kid campout, aren’t you excluding the mothers? And then what about people who have no children, can they come? Before long it is just a plain ward campout. As for the main topic, I think we are better than our traditions. We managed to kill polygamy and racism in the priesthood, didn’t we?
If a ward facilitates many different types of activities and the Father’s and Sons happens to be one of many I don’t see an issue with it. If the ward only sponsored activities for the men, well then, I’d REALLY have an issue with it. observant wrote:If a ward facilitates many different types of activities and the Father’s and Sons happens to be one of many I don’t see an issue with it. If the ward only sponsored activities for the men, well then, I’d REALLY have an issue with it.
Yeah, that is kind of how I look at it. I just couldn’t explain myself very well.
observant wrote:If a ward facilitates many different types of activities and the Father’s and Sons happens to be one of many I don’t see an issue with it. If the ward only sponsored activities for the men, well then, I’d REALLY have an issue with it.
Well said, observant.
cwald wrote:‘With all due respect, I don’t think I will look to exemplify the church’s example when it comes to deciding which traditions to keep and which ones to throw out. I think they have done a poor job of it to be honest.
Fair point…I guess I was just making the point that traditions can be stopped, and can be held on to…so if the church can do it, I can do it. But I’d agree with you that the church track record isn’t one to hold up as a shining example for how I should make the decisions…only that we can and should try to be better than our traditions, and let go of the ones which hold us back. I would also include in that, we should be ready to let go of traditions that perhaps the church hasn’t let go of yet.
That goes back to the OP, and challenging having the F/S campouts is a good thing, IMO.
:clap: But if others in the ward don’t agree, create your own tradition with your own family. I still maintain, the church is there to support me and my family, not dictate what I need to be a part of or what traditions I need to teach in my home.Heber13 wrote:…I still maintain, the church is there to support me and my family, not dictate what I need to be a part of or what traditions I need to teach in my home.
Good way to look at it. I think many people, myself included, sometimes feel that the church is responsible for setting the traditions. If everyone could just do their own thing, and do it reasonably well, we wouldn’t even need the church.
cwald wrote:If everyone could just do their own thing, and do it reasonably well, we wouldn’t even need the church.
To me, that is Zion…when our families don’t need the church anymore. But since I don’t seem to be able to do it reasonably well on my own yet, then I find I still need the church…so I choose to stayLDS to help my family be better than it is without it…and if the church stops helping my family, then I’m Seacrest-Out.Wow, I’m not sure I’ve ever thought of that before, that if we could do it on our own we wouldn’t need the church. Very insightful.
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