Chronically confused

[Alice]

I’m so glad I found this board. I’ve been reading for a while and finally decided to join.

Here’s a little back story…

I am a born and raised member. I was a super good kid. Seminary, girls camp, YW class presidencies, etc. I was raised in the Bible belt and had many well-meaning Christian friends try to “save” me all through high school. I was strong and convicted.

I married a convert. Though he didn’t convert “for me” I know I had a lot to do with it. We were married 6 months after he was baptized and sealed a year after his baptism.

He started having some issues with the church about a year into our marriage (it’s been 3 years now). I thought for a long time that he was just working out the issues I had already dealt with, but nothing was ever resolved.

Long story short, during one of our many religious discussions I had a bit of a spiritual epiphany. None of the things I have a REALLY solid testimony of tie me to the LDS church. I have had a few really amazing spiritual experiences that have caused me to know some things, but the things I know are pretty universal to Christianity. I know I have a Heavenly Father that loves me and has a plan for me. I know that it is through Christ that my sins can be forgiven. And that is pretty much it. I love the Book of Mormon. I know that it inspires good, but I don’t know that it is all “truth” or that it was translated from gold plates. I don’t know that priesthood as we recognize it is essential. There is a LOT that I don’t know.

Realizing this shook me up quite a bit. I’ve been studying and praying as much as I can. If it’s true I want to know it. If it isn’t I’m not sure it is worth staying.

I’ve realized it really comes down to Priesthood and Ordinances. They are either required for all or they aren’t and that is what I’m trying to learn. So much of my logical reasoning points to them not being truly required, but I need some sort of spiritual assurance before I can really believe that.

I’m not even sure what answers I want. I LOVE the church. The community the service, etc, but there are so many things that don’t make sense or that even seem wrong and leaving would sure make my personal family life simpler.

Thanks for listening.

[Anonymous]

Sorry for the blunt ending. My baby woke up from his nap.

All this is complicated by my Dad being my current Bishop. For now I’m doing everything I’ve been taught to do. I have a calling in the YW’s program and do my best to fulfill it. It is getting harder to teach things I’m not sure of though.

[Anonymous]

Welcome, Alice.

One thing only for now:

If you’re having a hard time teaching things of which you’re no longer sure, find the principle in each lesson that seems the most important and teach it – using the content simply as a way to illustrate the principle, even if you can’t accept the content as literal. See it as figurative – or as a parable – or as a cautionary tale – or any other way that will work for you.

There are a few threads here that deal with similar things, so look for and read the comments there. There’s one that is on the active topics list written by roadlesstraveled. The link is: (http://forum.staylds.com/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=1734).

[Anonymous]

Welcome Alice! I’m glad you decided to post an intro!

I have had many thoughts similar to what you’ve described here. It is a difficult adjustment, breath deep, be patient. Ultimately for me I came to realize I cannot know other people’s spiritual “truths”, I can only know mine. Once I got past trying to force spirituality into the “universal” bin – meaning what applies to one applies to all – everything became MUCH easier. I decided it’s “true” (spiritually) if you feel that’s the message God gave you. I don’t need to know how God interacts, or even what he communicates to others. I need to understand how He communicates to ME. If priesthood ordinances are valuable to me and my life in some way, that is what matters.

I wouldn’t try to limit God’s knowledge or pupose into a singular road to salvation – as far as the whole of mankind is concerned. I will however, accept that I really have one option in life for my personal and family religious affiliation, and it is really good – the best for ME.

Trying to understand what is right for EVERYONE is too much to bear. Live your life, and have joy.

Best wishes!

[Anonymous]

Welcome Alice!!

When trying to reconcile logical reasoning with spiritual things it can get very tricky, especially within Mormonism. On my journey I found they simply do not follow the same path. Trying to mesh them together as I do I simply had to say to my rational self many aspects of the LDS faith are man made. They does not necessarily make them wrong or bad just not so divine as I once thought.

As far as the priesthood and ordinances go I am going to have to go with not necessary in an eternal soul saving kind of way, but perhaps tehy are important for some people to keep them grounded in the faith. Just not logical to have something so vital to all mankind yet just a minuscule fraction of earth dwellers ever experience it. and to say that work for the dead will take care of everyone I just find that rather bizarre. God would have set up a better system on this earth to get things done if it were so vital.

Just my opinion of course

[Anonymous]

Welcome Alice! What a great symbolic avatar you chose — through the looking glass and straight into wonderland.

It’s a tough road to travel once you have been called up to walk it. But there you are, and the only way through it is forward, no matter what you find. You will be OK. You will figure it out. Just go slow, be patient, and have faith in the heart and mind God gave you.

A few suggestions to add to the others:

-Perhaps try to pray and consider individual ideas one at a time, taking it piecemeal. It might be hard to get an answer to your prayers when you ask “Is it ALL true or is it ALL false?” How does God really answer that? You are really talking about your perception and assumptions of the Gospel, as you understand it.

-Instead of trying to figure out what is “true,” perhaps focus on what is good and useful, what is valuable to you, what inspires you and uplifts you in the LDS Church. See? Those are all much easier things to figure out The greatest minds in the world since the beginning of time have struggled to define what is “true,” and haven’t really nailed it down yet. Be kind to yourself. But it’s pretty easy to figure out what makes you happy, and what helps make you a good person, someone you want to be.

And if some things really don’t resonate with you, you might consider dropping them or putting them up on a mental “shelf” for a while. You don’t have to sort it all out by next week.

So glad to have you here for part of the journey.

[Anonymous]

Thanks for all the replies.

Teaching will be okay. I can deal with focusing on principles. It just has some frustrating moments.

I think I’m starting to figure out how I feel about it all. It’s just been a long hard road. I love the church. It made me happy for a very long time. I think that it could make me happy again once I sort out my feelings on a few things, but I’m not sure that it is the best way for me to be happy anymore.

My inner conflicts arise from my family. My parents and siblings are for the most part TBM’s (Dad’s my Bishop). They of course would be devastated if I found another path. My convert husband doesn’t hate the church, he currently attends (though he skips out on priesthood) and holds a music calling. He just doesn’t really believe a bit of it and he doesn’t have a life time of positive experiences to tie him to it like I do. Honestly I think the church has been more damaging to his personal relationship with God that good for it.

I don’t know where I want to be. A part of me wants so much for the church to feel like home again and a part of me wants to be able to make a break. I’m not sure what I want for my kids. The standards and expectations of the youth kept me from making some pretty awful mistakes, but I’ve seen the restrictions backfire way to many times. I also don’t know how I feel about my kids learning things that I don’t really believe (at least not in the way they will be taught). I don’t want to confuse them. On the other hand, leaving would be soooooooo complicated. I definitely want my kids to have a church experience and if it isn’t with the LDS church I have no idea where it would be. Thankfully we only have one child now and he’s not even in nursery. I have a little time to figure it out.

[Anonymous]

Quote:

My inner conflicts arise from my family. My parents and siblings are for the most part TBM’s (Dad’s my Bishop). They of course would be devastated

I would recommend you read the website’s feature article if you have not already done so. “How to Stay LDS After a Trial of your Faith” And the article/podcast dealing with Fowlers stages of faith. Both VERY good resources that will help you, and help you talk with your husband about your and his concerns. Also you may find that discussing Fowler with your husband, that you have more in common on your spiritual journey than either of you thought (that is what happened in my case)

A couple of points from the article:

*It’s doesn’t have to be all true or all false – truth comes in many shades of gray and color.

*There are other pathways within the church. You don’t have to choose to be TBM or “an apostate.”

*You can choose what to believe and accept as doctrine and essential, and leave the rest (buffet mormon)

*Be careful who you confide in. Your extended family (including the bishop) may not be the best people to discuss your concerns and doubts. (I’ve learned this the hard way). Many times it will do nothing but damage the relationship and possibly others testimonies, and one can never put the cat back in the bag once it’s out.

Best of luck

[Anonymous]

Thanks again.

I think at this point I believe that while the church isn’t all that it claims to be, it is still good and valuable.

I just trying to figure out what I want my relationship and my children’s relationship to be with it.

An endless list of pros and cons.

[Anonymous]

That’s a good attitude to have Alice. And don’t think you have to be locked into any situation permanently, let things flow as they feel right. I think once we get past the need to have things figured out and settled, new possibilities open up.

I also wanted to comment on “what the church claims to be.” More recently I like to make the distinction that people make claims, the organization itself is like an empty shell. That’s how I like to think about it anyway, I know it can be argued differently. What this does for me is separate what individuals think from what I feel some obligation to go along with as an active church member. I will freely say the church does not live up to all my youthful impressions. I had expectations that have proven to be unrealistic. Whether or not the disconnect should be attributed to me personally, the subset of Mormon society/culture that I was raised in, or the church in general is up for debate. I see today that there are other members who grew up with slightly different models, different expectations. We can point to leaders as speaking somewhat for the church, but we can find leaders that say some very different things at times.

I guess I’m just trying to say I find value in leaving things more open ended, very few things are definite. It can be an uncomfortable approach when you’re not used to it, but I think the value of it can be discovered with a little exploration.

[Author]

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