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I think this is a hugely positive thing for the church to do — to seek input on a matter like this I went to the site to try to take the survey and it said the survey was closed because they had met their quota of respondents. But it said I could still post a comment. Not sure if the comment will be looked at, but I did give feedback about the garment. Now, this is the kind of church I can feel engaged with — one that cares about what I think and doesn’t always expect me to bend to its own interests all the time — like the church I’ve grown to “accept” over the last several decades.
Kudos on the survey idea!
I took the survey. I left quite a few lengthy comments regarding my feelings about garments. There was also an option to leave comments on the ceremonial clothing, so I mentioned how utterly demeaning I find it to veil my face in the temple. Not that I think women will stop being forced to veil their faces anytime soon, mind you. But at least the next time I hear someone say “oh, we haven’t heard any complaints about that” I will know for a fact that they are lying. 😈 nibbler wrote:Side question… what in the heck is the flap on men’s underwear for? Presumably to facilitate going to the bathroom, but do people still do that? I ask because the material for the extra support spandex Gs ran hot. Really hot. Doubling up the material in this area made things unbearable.
I personally use the flap to facilitate urination. Not sure how many of us “flap” users there are out there. Although I see the flap as a convenience, I do not feel strongly about it either way.
My impression is that most men do not have too much trouble with garments. I believe this is in part due to the fact that men’s garments are not all that different than other men’s underwear.
I understand that women can have a whole host of problems because the garments are just not a good fit for female physioligical or phychological needs. I would like to see women’s garments designed by women.
I for one don’t want to see women’s garments designed by women because I have seen the axe, and the handle is one of us. The majority of women I’ve encountered at Beehive Clothing are judgmental and nasty (the Beehive Clothing hags as I’ve called them), viewing the garment as a hair shirt: the more uncomfortable and inconvenient it is, the better. The noteworthy exception is the lovely staff at the Cedar City Deseret Book location. They are cheerful, helpful, and 100% concerned about giving you options that will fit and meet your needs. No judgment. No assumption that you are really just trying to adjust it to go whoring in night clubs. I would like to see them designed by Calvin Klein.
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I would like to see them designed by Calvin Klein.Michael Kors or Ralph Lauren, too.
Genuinely seeking input of garment redesign is a good thing in my view. Last month my wife purchased new garments for both of us at the distribution center and the women pointed out that they are longer than they have been in the recent past. She said that the church was moving towards longer garments again. I don’t know whether this person was correct or not, but it really annoyed both me and my wife. My wife’s comments were along the lines of – how exactly am I supposed to find clothes to wear in Arizona? Make my own?
When people ask me about altering the garments I tell them it’s between them and the Lord. I’ve been asked by a construction worker if he could sew the fly permanent shut for protective purposes and by a police officer if he could wear military garments or dye them black for when he works the night shift to be less visible. There are so many individual needs that cannot be accommodated with current garment policy.
The church isn’t moving to longer garments. 
That sort of personal input probably reflects the desire of the type of person Hawk mentioned in her comment about the axes being us.
👿 😈 Old-Timer wrote:The church isn’t moving to longer garments.
That’s too bad. The plan was to buy up all the leftover shorter Gs now and then sell them to people a few years later for twice the price I paid.
😈 Quote:That’s too bad. The plan was to buy up all the leftover shorter Gs now and then sell them to people a few years later for twice the price I paid.
😈 Brilliant!
Roy wrote:My impression is that most men do not have too much trouble with garments. I believe this is in part due to the fact that men’s garments are not all that different than other men’s underwear.
I understand that women can have a whole host of problems because the garments are just not a good fit for female physioligical or phychological needs. I would like to see women’s garments designed by women.
This, however….
Put all-star female designers in a room with all the money and fabrics in the world. You still won’t get something that most women want to wear IF the finished product must be a white navel-to-knee pair of underwear.
👿 There’s no getting around it. I just don’t wear them all the time. I can’t do it anymore.Sorry, my last post on this subject. It’s a sore one.
Longer garments; maybe, maybe not. My son in law bought some T-shirts a year or so ago, the same size he bought before and the sleeves were longer. They showed beneath his outer shirt. This guy is pretty TBM and he was pretty unhappy about it.
Ann and Hawkgrll are correct. It would not matter if garments are designed by women. “Navel to knee underwear ” (more like collar bone to knee underwear) is not physically functional for women. Most modern women do not wear dresses or skirts 24/7 as when garments were first introduced. At least with a dress or skirt even if almost to the floor air flow could reach the needed areas that today’s pants wearing women have restricted. Knee length underwear causes such moisture problems for women wearing pants. Then add extra layers on top of the garments themselves in order to wear menstaual pads or post delivery pads etc.. Also the pain and discomfort IS worn and seen as a badge of faithfulness by many lds women. I have heard it said many times in RS that garments are a sacrifice “modern women make as we are not asked to practice polygamy at this time.” “That it shows at least we are willing to submit our will to do all the Lord asks of us just like our early sisters.” Uhhh I have to walk out when that train gets rolling along with the,” we must teach our daughters to dress as if in garments at all ages in order to protect the men from impure thoughts.” It’s always interesting to me that garments ALWAYS end up being about policing the modesty of women!! Otherwise why do we not have sleeveless garments? Sleeveless would remove an extra heat inducing layer of clothing and there are no marks to justify them in the first place. Old-Timer wrote:
That sort of personal input probably reflects the desire of the type of person Hawk mentioned in her comment about the axes being us.👿 😈 Yes, I think Hawk and Ray are correct as usual. My anecdote for the day – last summer I found myself arguing with the stake young women’s president about whether the girls could wear shorts or two piece bathing suits. She was a proponent of no shorts, no capris, no 2 pieces, no exceptions. I was telling her these girls hadn’t covenanted to wear garments yet. It felt vaguely awkward for a man to argue for less covering and a women to argue for more covering. I gave up.
I don’t know who’s the handle and who’s the axe but we could use a little less chopping.
Nothing irks me more than men’s garment tops. I am rather athletic and have large arms, and all of my shirts have varying widths of arm sleeves on short sleeve shirts. When I put on a polo shirt and the garment sleeve is so wide that it bunches a number of inches I get instantly pissed off (for lack of a better word). I have to plan my garment and shirt combos to accommodate the terrible sleeve design on the garments. Even on all of my dress shirts, I wear a slim/tailored fit so I am not swimming in fabric. I have to have my wife help straighten out the sleeve, because I can’t get in there to make it look decent. I cannot tell you how mad I get at my garments specifically for this reason. Give me a tighter fitting garment top that isn’t made of the same material as the extra support bottoms, those things are so HOT! Or is that immodest? /End Rant anarcy21 wrote:Give me a tighter fitting garment top that isn’t made of the same material as the extra support bottoms, those things are so HOT!
Yes! I’ve bemoaned many times the tremendous heat the extra support bottoms generate. Winter? 20 degrees out? Better grab some knee length shorts because it’s going to be a
. Slap on some extra support bottoms and an extra support top, hook a turbine up to yourself, and power your house. You could even make money selling energy back to the grid. There’s always the old mesh tops. I don’t know if they still make those. Cons: they make you sweat and there’s no place for the sweat to go. Pros: They might as well be sleeveless. The sleeves make a mad dash to hide in your armpit, like a roach when the lights go on. Seriously when I wore those it was a constant struggle to pull the sleeves down again and again and again.
When I filled out the survey I suggested that it might be a good idea to explore making garments out of sweat wicking material. I’m not sure how that might work out as an undershirt but when I was out and about exercising those shirts did wonders. The shirt felt dry against my skin but of course it was sopping wet. Maybe that wouldn’t work out so well with another shirt on top.
:I’ve heard it suggested on this site before that perhaps a nice alternative for people in hotter climates might be to make garments using bamboo fabric. I’ve never experienced bamboo fabric but it sounds kinda cool (pun).
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