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I was wondering what you thought of this — do we have a “serve where placed model” in the church? A model where you serve where asked to serve with very little choice in the matter, other than to refuse the calling (sometimes, at the loss of personal reputation)? I would like to know your thoughts on this. Obviously, I believe this is probably truer than many of us would like, but I don’t want to assume that. What do you think?
Absolutely. Yes! Serve where assigned model. I also feel that we are discouraged from taking complete ownership of the calling in the sense that we think outside the box.
Use the manual and the scriptures, don’t use outside sources, follow the lesson outline.
I realize that this varies depending on local leadership but overall I think tradition is more highly prized than innovation.
Ray, you are the exception that proves the rule and I love your class!
I had a TBM recently explain their take like this in an email (listed below, followed by my thoughts.) Quote:Church callings keep us serving. They give us a reason to be there. It is not that it is an unwritten law, but it is a necessary one for most of us.
In our church, we don’t have paid professionals. We have real people doing the best they can do to teach and preach and keep things running.
- 1. What if I don’t feel like I need the church constantly telling me who’s deserving of my service? Is my service really best spent crunching the church financials for free, or scheduling meetings, or cleaning the toilets? Why can’t I make that call based on my own intuition? It could be my elderly neighbor who sits on her porch for hours hoping someone will stop and talk. It could be my own family that I’ve been neglecting in my efforts to “build up the kingdom.” It could be the people at the local shelter…and on and on.
2. If I need a calling to get my butt to church I’m probably not getting much out of it anyway. I don’t think meaningful communion with God can be compelled.
3. Sometimes I have a hard time knowing exactly what it is I’m trying to keep running. Often it feels like just another earthly organization to me. Father Richard Rohr of the Catholic faith made an interesting observation about his own church that applies to most organized religions. To paraphrase, he says when you think about the church organization as an entity, it needs you to need it! (this can be even more so with paid clergy, obviously) If the church didn’t make people feel like they needed it, they wouldn’t participate and it would shrivel up and cease to exist. He then goes on to say, very humbly I might add, that when someone is in touch with God (which is what he tries to help people do), they don’t need the church with all its candlesticks and creeds. The trouble is, he says, that the church is actually one of the best tools for helping people get to that point. Intriguing stuff in my opinion.
Yes. Even one of the speakers in General Conference mentioned that sometimes we volunteer and sometimes we are volunteered.
Having said that, it doesn’t have to be that way all the time. We also are told not to be commanded in all things and to do much of our own free will and choice. Most people, however, default to the idea that they are doing enough if they are doing what they are asked to do – which, I believe, is one reason the counsel I just quoted is in our scriptures.
Church = yes … same as everyone above has said. Me = Hell No! I accept and deny callings as I see fit. When I accept them, I follow the rules that are written. If it ain’t written, it ain’t a rule. For example: The 11-yr old scouts has a rule regarding 3 camp outs a year. Most interpret that to 3 campouts in the boys’ year. What do I say – nope, 3 campouts in a year. So if I plan the campouts right, I can get 4-5 for each boy before they are 12. Some only get 3, but most will get the 4-5. I figure out what “my year” is going to be by looking at the boys in/out dates. Then I plan the campouts so that there are only “3 in that year” for that boy. 2013 will only have 3 campouts, and 2014 will have 3 campouts for that boy. Make sense? It is within the “rules”, but also gets the boys out camping. That is generally what they want to do anyway.
So I’ll repeat that “serve where placed” is a no go for me personally.
I cussed – so if it shouldn’t be there, please remove. I can’t remember the rule … sorry! Do you think this “serve where placed” model creates more good in terms of personal growth and acheiving the church’s mission simultenaously than an approach that provides more choice on the part of the callee? (I realize we have a choice to say Yes or no, but I think most would agree it creates a stigma if you say “no” too often or at all for certain callings. I’m talking about more choice about where to be called before a call is extended). SilentDawning wrote:Do you think this “serve where placed” model creates more good in terms of personal growth and acheiving the church’s mission simultenaously than an approach that provides more choice on the part of the callee? (I realize we have a choice to say Yes or no, but I think most would agree it creates a stigma if you say “no” too often or at all for certain callings. I’m talking about more choice about where to be called before a call is extended).
Oh, I see. I’m not sure how much “choice” we have in being offered a calling. That is up to the leadership.I do think you can influence it. I have by stating very clearly that I will only work with the Boy Scouts (Pack, Troop, Crew, Team). This helps them to know what calling I will accept and to not even think about others.
In another thread it is talking about “inspiration”… Well – I “inspire” them to the calling that I will serve.
For those who are unquestioning or those who question but hide it to avoid making waves, we have more of a “Serve where placed model of servitude.” [Addition]: Law of consecration feeds into this.
Quote:Do you think this “serve where placed” model creates more good in terms of personal growth and achieving the church’s mission simultaneously than an approach that provides more choice on the part of the callee?
Honestly, I think it goes both ways, depending on the person and the calling(s). (I can’t imagine that comment shocks anyone.
I think there are a whole lot of members for whom it works wonderfully, since it gives them opportunities to learn and grow in ways they wouldn’t choose if callings were filled completely by request or desire. I think it works badly for a whole lot of members in particular callings that simply aren’t a good fit.
I love the idea of everyone having a responsibility of some sort, in theory and usually in practice, but I also recognize that the org chart doesn’t allow everyone to do only what they want or would choose to do without leaving gaping holes within each local organization. I also understand that people who refuse to do anything often are a huge part of the problem with others who are overwhelmed by multiple callings.
This is one where I have no easy answers, and I’ve thought a lot about it over my decades in the Church. The only real “solution” I see is everyone being asked where they would like to serve in an ideal world, while being willing to do some things they wouldn’t choose to do but also being able to retain the right to say no to things that they believe they simply can’t or shouldn’t do, for whatever reason. It’s close to the actual system we have, minus the solicitation of ideal desires, but people tend to gravitate toward the extremes in this area, as well.
My first post, so I promise to do a proper introduction on the right board! I am a little conflicted about this topic, because I gave a talk in sacrament a few years ago about callings…one example I shared was that, obviously, I wouldn’t be called to be a pianist because I don’t play the instrument. So talents and fit for the calling have a role.
On the other hand, I served in the bishopric for several years until my recent release and very rarely did I feel that the callings were inspired. It was “this person is available and the PH/aux president requested them.” Yes, we prayed, but I almost never got any real prompt that it was right or wrong. I got the feeling from the other members of the bishopric that they didn’t have any real inspiration one way or the other, either.
Sometimes, especially with the Primary President, it was clear that she didn’t give any thought to whether the person was “right” for the calling OR that she sought inspiration. The bishop said he asked her on a couple occasions if she had done either, and the answer was “no.”
Also: We sometimes talk about callings and also “assignments,” which is a different bird. I hear some in PH leadership talk about them like it’s not an option to say no. Of course one can decline an assignment, but somehow it’s supposed to be different.
In Elder Eyring’s talk on Sunday, he spoke about how to have a happy marriage. Out of nowhere he throws in, “Accept all of the callings you receive.” It sounded out of place. While I don’t doubt he believes it, I’ve seen too many members accept the calling despite reservations and be unhappy or have it affect the happiness of their families. Maybe it comes down to faith and one’s attitude, I don’t know.
Alex
While Bishop, I would ask new members of the ward what calling they would like to do, and then try to accommodate them. People do a better job if it is a calling they like and want! But of course nobody is going to say “I want to be the RS Pres” (or Primary, Elders or HPGL) . Those I just looked for somebody with organizational skills and that got along with others. I never felt any “burning of the bosom” when deciding who to call, I just picked somebody, and called them if it felt right. I made mistakes, and some people told me “no”, but it wasn’t a big deal, I just found somebody else. We have local congregations. There are local needs. Callings are to get things done by people who can help get it done. Where we are (largely populated Mormon communities or sparsely populated areas) plays greatly on the opportunities for us to serve in different capacities. I think wherever we are, we can get involved. When I have moved across country, I found the opportunities changed drastically.
Because revelation involves reason and studying it out in a leader’s mind, how you conduct yourself leads to how well they trust you can do what needs to be done. It also means there will be some things you will be asked to do things you wish you didn’t have to do. How we handle ourselves leads to opportunities to serve others and opportunities to show others we want to be part of the tribe, or not.
I think you can say no to a calling. It just depends how you say it and what else you do.
Here is my gut response to this question (not necessarily how I feel and think currently): Elder Packer’s unwritten order of things seems to loom largely over the culture and teachings around this topic. Obedience to authority figures is hugely important. So if an authority figure comes to you with calling, you serve where you are asked to serve. Doing so indicates your submission to the will of the Lord, and demonstrates your loyalty to the institution. And you serve only within the bounds of your calling – do what you’re asked, follow the rules, and don’t make waves. At least, this is how I was taught and how I was brought up.
I’ve heard the idea that callings are often extended in desperation, rather than in inspiration. So the best fit for each person isn’t necessarily what happens. There are a number of callings that are necessary in order for a ward to operate. However, there are scores of other little callings that seem to exist in order to give people something to do. And someone has to be found to fill the calling, even if it’s not quite the right person for the job, or the right job for the person. Once you have all of these callings going on a ward becomes this bureaucratic beast that must continually be fed. So instead of following the spirit and looking for opportunities for service, we become busy busy busy. Unfortunately, this busyness takes up so much of our time and energy that we often don’t have the space to follow the spirit and look for people to serve.
I am currently struggling with an assignment that I have been given by my elders quorum president. (I am his first counselor). We have been tasked to come up with callings that can be given to a number of new members of the ward. It wasn’t said this way, but essentially we have been asked to “make up” callings for everyone. The idea seems to be that unless everyone has a calling, they won’t come to church. I think that people will come to church and stay active if they have good relationships there and if they have a quality worship experience. I’m afraid to say that the “program” of the church seems to have become an end in itself– kind of a tail wagging the dog situation. I wish that we could have less bureaucracy, and multiplicity of callings, and more relationships and quality worship, along with an admonition to serve one another and others outside freely and regularly, and spontaneously. But maybe this is all just a pipe dream…
- 1. What if I don’t feel like I need the church constantly telling me who’s deserving of my service? Is my service really best spent crunching the church financials for free, or scheduling meetings, or cleaning the toilets? Why can’t I make that call based on my own intuition? It could be my elderly neighbor who sits on her porch for hours hoping someone will stop and talk. It could be my own family that I’ve been neglecting in my efforts to “build up the kingdom.” It could be the people at the local shelter…and on and on.
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