- This topic is empty.
-
Posts
-
Kipper wrote:
I tried to take notes during conference this weekend but most of what I wrote down were things that stuck out and bothered me. I get very little out of conference any more. I mean, am I supposed to be so moved by all personal the miracles of the GA’s that I cry and go out to find my own? I guess I could if I accepted them all without wondering. I can’t get over it when I hear from 4 out of five speakers who warn us not to let “_______” (fill in the blank with “ambitions,” “goals,” “activities,” “hobbies” etc) be distractions to your activity in the church. The message I get is that we should be spending 90% of our time reading, preaching, being missionaries, doing genealogy, attending to the sick and poor, doing temple work, magnifying our callings and basically being at church every day. Life on earth has much to offer and my life has changed so much that I don’t recognize myself. Be soft, pale, slightly overweight and I’ll fit in. Evidence that I don’t take time to go to the gym (last conference that was actually mentioned as a distraction) or participate in any activity that would take commitment outside the church.
I’m there with you: I see a lot of repetition of concepts like church activity, faithfulness, obedience, even service, that seem stripped of real meaning to me. Obedience has become one of my least favorites, because it can easily become a way for people to get on power trips, policing their fellows for any perceived infraction of rules at the expense of the weightier matters. From what the Holy Ghost has showed me, I would expect that if the membership of the Church were really to start taking their covenants seriously it would lead to a radical change in the fundamental structures of society, but nobody has the nerve to go against the really powerful norms of the world: the way things are just done. So what we get is this that you’re describing: attention on the busy-ness of the church trappings as they grow out of an unexamined complacent conformity to worldly norms. As long as we’re not drinking, smoking, looking at porn etc. we can just keep pushing the engine of the world along its self-destructive course, provided that we do enough individual little kindnesses to make us feel good about ourselves, like throwing snowballs into a furnace.
I guess even a 50% increase of actually attending to the sick and poor instead of talking about it would greatly mitigate a lot of the suffering that we don’t want to face, because it would require us to let go of our self-righteousness in looking like the right kind of respectable people.
I wanted to enjoy Priesthood Session, but mostly I just let my thoughts wander. There were some good thoughts about being compassionate, seeing people for who they might become etc. . . . but then the closing hymn with its belligerent imagery completely went against that for me, and I thought: this is going to lead how many to go home feeling they should go out and enact some warrior fantasy, watching for foes to put down instead of fellow children of God to lift up?
I feel I am getting off track and standing on a slippery slope. Question is how to stop the slide. During one of the talks I heard myself let out a snicker at one of the comments. My wife heard it too (insert wedge a little farther) but said nothing. Why don’t I get it or feel it anymore? sounds like you could be suffering from church involvement burnout. lds culture encourages making church life and attendance central. i have experienced this myself. when i experienced my faith crisis years ago and wanted to take a break from church i felt trapped and smothered by church. i had to stop going for my own sanity. one of the reasons i felt trapped and smothered was because i had reasoned in my own mind that if i stopped going i wasn’t “enduring unto the end”. i just came to realize that that was just silly to believe and i stopped going for a while anyway. it did help but even after re-attending i still needed healing and time away from the church for a while to try to make sense of what i believed and why i believed what i believed.
BeLikeChrist wrote:trapped or smothered ?
BLC
WORD
Kipper, Elder Wirthlin said in “Concern for the One” that some members stop attending because they feel different, some because they are tired and some because they have strayed. Importantly, he didn’t chastise those who leave for any reason – and he also made it clear that the first two reasons are not the fault of “the one”. Fwiw, it’s hard enough to stay when one of those applies, but when at least two of them apply . . .
For the first (feeling different), I only can recommend accepting your differences and the very fact that you are different. I saw a sign once in a high school that said, “You were (created) as an original. Don’t become a copy.” I really like that as a motto – changing the “you were” to “I was” and the “don’t” to “I won’t”. It becomes,
Quote:“I was created as an original. I won’t become a copy.”
For the second, all I can recommend is that you cut back somehow to re-energize. There are multiple ways to do that – from complete breaks occasionally to sitting in the foyer during a meeting now and then with a good book to sleeping in once in a while when church is in the morning and attending only the final meeting those days to many other options. If you can’t miss church any given week, find something else to do during church occasionally (or for a few straight weeks) that is focused on service.
If you like being with children, volunteer to help in the library or Primary. Spend some time in the foyer helping keep track of a toddler or crawling child so the parent can attend a meeting now and then. Sit in the back of the class and talk quietly with the crazy member who annoys everyone else.
My point is that there are options for you even in church, but you have to look for them and find what works for you.
Roy wrote:Kipper wrote:What this specific event brings up for me it the fact that I will need to be the one to ordain and confirm the priesthood on him very soon at a time when I am having difficulty with other things.
I understand that this is difficult. For me it is invaluable that my priesthood line of authority goes through my dad. I wish that it also included my G-pa but he was not a member. It does not matter that this priesthood may be just mental concepts. They are mental concepts that are imbued with empowerment and responsibility and are passed down from father to son and have meaning and importance all their own (independent for any “power of God” attribution).
Maybe this isn’t important to you but that doesn’t preclude it being important to your son (either now or in the future). I would not let this opportunity go by… you can always soul search about what this moment means to you later…but it only happens once.
+1
I could not agree more. Whether worthy/ true or not – this only comes once. Do not pass it up. This might mean something to your son or other family members later on.
I was able to confirm and ordain my son as an elder yesterday after stake conference. It was a sweet spiritual experience. During stake conference yesterday the first counselor to the stake pres while talking about some of the misconceptions people have about the church said that no professor, anthropologist, archeologist, religious leader (etc…) has ever been able to successfully contradict, question or disprove any aspects of the BofM… I wanted to raise my hand and ask about the Facsimiles or the Laminate descendents of Israel. Aren’t there a few things about the BoM that cannot be supported? I can live with that knowledge better than I can live with the denial. Kipper wrote:During stake conference yesterday the first counselor to the stake pres while talking about some of the misconceptions people have about the church said that no professor, anthropologist, archeologist, religious leader (etc…) has ever been able to successfully contradict, question or disprove any aspects of the BofM… I wanted to raise my hand and ask about the Facsimiles or the Laminate descendents of Israel. Aren’t there a few things about the BoM that cannot be supported? I can live with that knowledge better than I can live with the denial.
no professor, anthropologist, archeologist, religious leader (etc…) has ever been able to successfully contradict, question or disprove any aspects of the existence of a china teapot floating in space between earth and mars.Your counselor in the SP has been reading too much of FAIR and FARMS. It’s worse than heroin.
kipper, thanks for sharing your experience ordaining your son. It’s easy to focus on the difficult things and, sometimes, lose sight of the sweetness of Mormon life.
Old-Timer wrote:kipper, thanks for sharing your experience ordaining your son.
It’s easy to focus on the difficult things and, sometimes, lose sight of the sweetness of Mormon life.
:thumbup: Golf is a frustrating game, hard to understand but every once in awhile I hit a ball that feels so good it keeps me coming back for more of the experience.Kipper wrote::thumbup: Golf is a frustrating game, hard to understand but every once in awhile I hit a ball that feels so good it keeps me coming back for more of the experience.
Well said. A nice drive reminds me I can hit it straight…reality reminds me it doesn’t happen very often or consistently yet.The last four weeks of fulfilling my callings as 2nd counselor in YM Presidency and Assistant Scoutmaster have been particularly difficult and time consuming compounded by my 3 hr/day RT commute for work. As I should, I approach each campout, each outing, each planning meeting, each leadership meeting, each lesson preparation etc. cheerfully and with the YM/YW & Scouts growth and enjoyment in mind. There is nothing I regret about guiding and influencing young people to stay on the right path. But I heard something about changes coming and found myself feeling internally overwhelmed with anticipation and joy that this could be over. Didn’t expect that but I am also overwhelmed with a feeling that when/if changes are made and I am relieved I will go into hiding for the remainder of my church membership. Some might rightly be thinking selfish (re. Elder Oaks “Unselfish Service”). I could list my sacrifices but it would look like a lot of whining. I don’t know if this is what Father in Heaven intended for me. I don’t know why this specific image came to mind, but it did – so here it is: Riding a pendulum can be rough.
I don’t know how else to say it, but try to slow the swing enough to make a rational choice about how fast and high it should swing. Simply jumping off works sometimes (and sometimes is the only option), but it also can lead to a really long, hard (and often unnecessary) fall – and it can be really hard to get back on later if it’s still swinging the same speed and height. Try adjusting the speed and height of the swing before jumping off. You might still jump at some point; you might not; but, at the very least, the ride will be smoother and more enjoyable in the meantime.
I’ll think about that and try to fit it in. It’s very hard to fit years of growing and disappointments into on thread. Here’s a few more thoughts…I had been emotionally abused and controlled until mid life and it taught me to recognize when people work to manipulate me with emotions and guilt. I developed some very tough defense mechanisms for a time but I think I let those down because that’s how the church works. I am now in a situation where I can be controled again and be taken advantage of under the guise of “…we prayed and your name kept coming up…”. I just don’t buy that any more. Have I just not given my life to Christ or is it – as I understand – that the Church wants my life?
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.