Fanny Alger, First Plural Wife?

[Anonymous]

gospeltangents wrote:

I just completed an interview with Brian Hales. Regarding Fanny, Brian said some interesting things.

But I think this is my favorite quote.

Quote:

the people that Joseph Smith told about Fanny Alger as a plural wife, they didn’t believe him. But most of the people that learned it from Fanny did believe which is interesting. Fanny’s family believed. The family that Fanny went to live with was Chauncey Webb and Eliza Jane Webb, they believed that this was an actual marriage, but Joseph is caught with Fanny and they’re in a haymow, they’re in a barn, and we were out there in Kirtland with the John Whitmer Historical Association meeting this last September, and I asked Mark, ‘where is the barn?’ He had no idea. It’s long since been destroyed.

They were discovered by Emma “in the act.” We could assume that was something sexual. Some people want to say it was in the act of getting married by Levi, the ceremony. It’s a bit of a stretch. Maybe he was in the act of something affectionate. Virtually anything affectionate would have been over the line in Emma’s eyes understandably. She caught them, and she’s not accepting Joseph’s explanation at all.

‘This is a plural marriage. God authorized it.’

‘Yeah right. She’s pretty and this isn’t working for me.’

Joseph, according to one of the accounts gets Oliver and says in the middle of the night. ‘Oliver, come help me with this.’ Oliver hears the story and sides with Emma and thinks Joseph is having an adulterous affair. That was his opinion, probably right up until his death, that Joseph was not authorized to marry her. It wasn’t a marriage. He made hints to members of the high council that Joseph had been guilty of adultery. He did not accept any story of a marriage ceremony as being valid, and neither did Emma.

It kills me that Fanny was a more believable witness than Joseph.

Yes, but who, besides perhaps Emma, knew Joseph better than anyone? Probably Oliver. At this time Oliver was still “the second elder of the church” as well as assistant president of the church and a member of the presiding high council. Although it’s pretty clear Oliver was opposed to plural marriage, it seems doubtful Joseph would not have shared with Oliver, although it is possible especially if Joseph already knew about Oliver’s views. My own take on it is that Oliver did know and didn’t believe Joseph (or Fanny) either.

[Anonymous]

There is another possibility besides the duality of whether or not this was a marriage. In my mind it’s entirely plausible (and even most likely) that this started as an affair and Joseph told Fanny it was a God-approved marriage to make either or both of them feel less guilty about it.

So to me it’s irrelevant whether or not Joseph or Fanny thought of it as a marriage. I’m sure eventually both did and would have told others the same.

The important point to me is whether or not God in fact authorized or commanded it. And for me, the most reliable way to analyze is to look at the fruits. I see no positive fruits from that relationship – the hurt to Emma, the accusations and persecutions for adultery charges, the secretive nature, the shaming and harm. In my mind, there is no way God authorized or commanded that relationship. What would be the point? I don’t believe everyday in God anymore, but I certainly don’t believe in a God who would command or authorize this sort of thing that only brought about shame, harm, betrayal, and loss.

I know we don’t have all the information, but to me Joseph was simply wrong in this and used his religious authority to call it something different than what it actually was.

[Anonymous]

As two women commented on Rick’s W&T post about this, they don’t really care what Hales thinks about polygamy. They care that the church still “loves” it (e.g. won’t repudiate it, despite the pain it causes women).

[Anonymous]

Yes, I agree with Hawk. Even if Joseph had no sex with any wives by Emma, Someone on Facebook posted a note saying,

Quote:

Let’s assume Brian is right. For some reason, Joseph married 30+ women and never had sex with any of them. For additional unexplained reasons, he felt too uncomfortable to share any of this with Emma even though he wasn’t being intimate with these women (enter flaming sword, etc.), and God didn’t deem it worthy to send an angel (flaming sword or otherwise) to convince Emma of this divine duty. But let’s put all that aside and believe this is exactly what happened.

Even if all of that is correct, every last word, it is undisputed that for almost 60 years, all of the church leaders and his successors did do all of this. Not only were they intimate with their polygamous wives, some of whom were very young girls, they celebrated those relationships and *condemned* monogamy. Not only were sexual polygamous relationships justified, they were *preferable,* considered the eternal order of marriage, and just like the relationship that God Himself had.

And that’s the best-case, faith-affirming angle Brian is arguing for.

[Anonymous]

The situation is confusing and I believe God was not the author of it.

The Plural Marriage in Kirtland and Nauvoo essay states that “Several Latter-day Saints who had lived in Kirtland reported decades later that Joseph Smith had married Alger….” Did you see that? It was decades later when it was claimed they were married!

Hales admits that “it is obvious Emma did not believe the ceremony was valid and concluded the relationship was adulterous” and that Cowdery “sided with Emma, discounting the validity of the polygamous marriage and later referring to it as a ‘dirty, nasty, filthy scrape.'”

And here is a very damning detail: Hales wrote, “As a consequence of the discovery, Emma immediately ‘turned Fanny out of the house.'” I can’t figure out how it might have been okay for Joseph to marry Fanny and then allow her to be kicked out of the house.

Also, Joseph obviously didn’t follow the rule outlined in D&C 132:61.

[Anonymous]

gospeltangents wrote:

Yes, I agree with Hawk. Even if Joseph had no sex with any wives by Emma, Someone on Facebook posted a note saying,

Quote:

Let’s assume Brian is right. For some reason, Joseph married 30+ women and never had sex with any of them. For additional unexplained reasons, he felt too uncomfortable to share any of this with Emma even though he wasn’t being intimate with these women (enter flaming sword, etc.), and God didn’t deem it worthy to send an angel (flaming sword or otherwise) to convince Emma of this divine duty. But let’s put all that aside and believe this is exactly what happened.

Even if all of that is correct, every last word, it is undisputed that for almost 60 years, all of the church leaders and his successors did do all of this. Not only were they intimate with their polygamous wives, some of whom were very young girls, they celebrated those relationships and *condemned* monogamy. Not only were sexual polygamous relationships justified, they were *preferable,* considered the eternal order of marriage, and just like the relationship that God Himself had.

And that’s the best-case, faith-affirming angle Brian is arguing for.

I think that FB quote is missing one other item that bothers me. Section 132 says the purpose of polygamy is to bring up righteous seed. Umm, doesn’t that mean “kids”, which means if he wasn’t having sex he wasn’t doing what he was supposed to.

This topic is what finally made the light bulb go off in my head – church leaders worship Joseph Smith and feel if he isn’t near perfect everything else might fall apart. The Race essay calmly throws Brigham right under the bus. Some of the essays almost sound to me like they are willing to throw God under the bus to keep Joseph shiny clean.

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