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  • #268627
    Anonymous
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    I watched a MS podcast the other day where something was brought up, to the effect of the church leadership are all very different in their opinions, and if you get all of them together inparticular the 12, they’ll all think different things. John Dehlin said he got this after a visit with one of the GA’s. Therefore, we should remember we can be different from one another. We don’t all have to enjoy the temple, even though it’s drilled into us. We don’t have to wear the garments if you don’t feel right. They are needed if you want a TR, but since you don’t care to go, don’t. And have a talk with your mom, tell her what’s in your heart. I remember a neighbor from years ago, who wouldn’t go to the temple. She was worthy in every way. All her children married in the temple. Her husband was in the bishopric at the time and when it was temple night she wouldn’t go. I never heard why not, but it was accepted that Merry didn’t go to the temple. So like her you could fess up on that and just shine where you are comfortable, you can in every way be Christlike or charitable, loving, everything the first two commandments mention without going to the temple. Your family will see that the world won’t cave in if you don’t go. My nephew is getting married next month in the temple, and my TR has expired. I don’t know what to do and most of my family don’t know I’m struggling so much with the faith. So do I get a TR or not? So I know what you’re going through. It’s not everyone’s cup of tea.

    #268628
    Anonymous
    Guest

    HSAB: I am thinking about the things you’ve said. There are a few different things at play psychologically that are coming through.

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    I cannot feel good about myself and wear garments-plus I actually do not believe in them.

    I don’t know what it means to “believe in them.” Nobody believes in them. They are only a reminder of other beliefs. What is it that you do believe in?

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    I can see that they may be a nice reminder for some people, but I do not view them as anything necessary or good. I think they hurt a lot of people.

    Garments can neither hurt nor help people. People with BDD are prone to being hurt by their disorder and garments may add to their anxiety, but they are just clothing. I can honestly say I don’t like them. But your description is so vehement, it seems to me that more is at play here. The garments are not the source of your feelings. Perhaps to you they symbolize the sexism you see in the church. I think it’s important to get to the source of your feelings on these things.

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    Despite that belief, I still have to worry about what I wear every single day or people will know that I am not a good mormon anymore.

    You don’t have to worry about it, but clearly you do. What’s the worst thing that could happen? That they can see the real you and not like you? That’s no worse than them seeing a false you and approving.

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    I haven’t been to church in a month and half of it is because I stress so much about what I am going to wear. The other half of it is because I feel like I have to pretend the whole time I’m there.

    Quit stressing and quit pretending. Give yourself permission to quit worrying about what other people think.

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    I only believe in half of what I hear there.

    Given that we are hearing people’s opinions the whole time we are at church, agreeing with half is fairly high.

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    The other half makes me upset.

    Why do other people’s opinions make you upset? They are no threat to you. Let other people be wrong. What’s the harm to you if they are wrong? Only the harm you do yourself by getting upset. It’s not necessary. When people feel upset by other people’s opinions, it usually seems to be because they assume those other people (who may be confident) are allowed / approved in thinking that way. What if instead of looking for approval from nodding heads of dumb people at church, you follow your conscience, you get clear about what you personally believe, you have your own spiritual confidence in your opinions. That makes church a whole ‘nother ball game.

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    I haven’t been to relief society in about six months (maybe I’ve been twice since I got married) because they reinforce all the gender roles that I don’t believe in.

    I don’t believe in them either, but when those things come up, there are several women in our ward who freely express how our own spiritual experiences have differed and why we live our lives the way we do. Sharing that we were inspired to do the things we have done makes it acceptable in Mormon culture. I don’t feel like I have to hide the fact that I’m not a SAHM and never wanted to be one. I don’t feel like I need to apologize for not liking garments. There isn’t a person in the entire church who doesn’t find authenticity refreshing. They can’t argue with who you are.

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    But now that I only believe in parts of it I feel like I have to pretend in order to be involved at all.

    Welcome to adulthood. EVERY single person in the church only believes in parts of it. They misunderstand other parts. They confuse their political views with the gospel. They conflate their life experiences with what God’s will is. They probably lack the self-awareness in many cases to identify their own beliefs. That’s why this is a church of personal revelation. We don’t have to all be identical. That’s not “the plan” anyway.

    Quote:

    I still don’t even drink coffee

    Coffee is overrated and expensive. IMO, it’s not some huge evil, but it’s like donuts. If you could go your whole life without eating donuts, you’d be better off. Same with coffee.

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    between that and having to keep all my real opinions to myself I am left feeling so unauthentic that I feel terrible

    You don’t have to keep all your real opinions to yourself.

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    I just wish there was some way to be true to myself and not have everyone worry about me or think that I am bad and selfish.

    That’s on them if they do. Guess what? When you are your authentic self, some people will not like you. They want you to fit whatever their mold is. That’s on them, not you. You cannot live your life that way. It doesn’t end well.

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    The whole time I was silently crying because the endowment session make me feel so depressed and unloved as a woman.

    The endowment sucks for women. Sorry to say it so bluntly, but there it is. It is definitely sexist and outdated in its views of women. The last time I attended a session I had a prayer in my heart that I would feel the truth as I went through. When the sexist parts happened, I had a feeling of comfort, and a nearly audible voice that said “This is not of me. This is of men.” It was comforting for the first time in a long time. Guess what, though. I still don’t love it. It’s not some awesome place that makes me feel closer to God than anywhere else. It’s like seeing the most boring movie ever over and over.

    Quote:

    It breaks my hurt to think of hurting my parents, but it is killing me inside to pretend to be something that I am not.

    You are pretending to be a person who doesn’t have her own feelings and thoughts that differ from the herd. Here’s one thing I will caution you. Most people (even parents sometimes I’m afraid) don’t really want to know the real you. They don’t care about the things you care about. They are happy to imagine you are whatever they want to see in you. That is their loss.

    My last question for you is how this is going with your husband. Is he concerned about the same things? Is his family an issue or just yours?

    #268629
    Anonymous
    Guest

    Sorry but I had one more thought to add. I think that when we are at church and painfully aware of being unique, we assume a lot. We assume that when one person says something and nobody contradicts it that every other person agrees with what was said or thinks the same way. Try the opposite assumption, and you’ll probably be closer to the truth. Assume that ONLY the person who said it thinks it, and that they may not have even expressed their feelings correctly or thought about it or maybe they are just repeating something they heard. Then you’ll get closer to the truth. The people who haven’t said anything, like you, have their own – different – opinions on the matter. Every single one of them.

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