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Some religious organizations do demand ten percent. I was reading something by a dubious guru the other day which sounded suspiciously like tithing, Whenever tithing has come up with investigators, I tell them the following:
* The church teaches provident living, and getting away from debt.
* Living the Word of Wisdom actually saves considerable amounts of money (along with the supposed health benefits)
* The tithing is on your INCREASE (so if you have decrease, you don’t have to tithe on it), you don’t tithe on things which have neither increased or decreased either.
I also recommend essentials (i.e. non-luxury items) such as tax, utility bills, mortgage (if you’re already in it) etc have to be paid first. A lot of people disagree with this, but if you default on a mortgage, you’ll not have much of an increase in the near future!
TITHING is an interesting subject and it seems that each of us may view it differently. Over the course of my faith crisis I have come to disassociate my actions from God’s interventions on my behalf and also from His approval of me (i.e. I believe that He always approves of me, never intervenes [see my signature]). As this applies to tithing- The concept of paying tithing for blessings to be received in the next life (Pay to Play) doesn’t bother me quite so much as the paying of tithing for immeadiate earthly rewards. One of the reasons I so enjoyed June’s FPM was the emphasis away from quid pro quo promises and obedience thumping that I feel cause many members to “miss the mark” on paying tithing. Here is a refresher of my main points from June’s FPM: Quote:Rather than say – we pay tithing then get blessings, I find it appropriate to say – we get blessings and we pay tithing. Right or wrong, reframing like this allows us to focus more on the real jewel of the message:
“paying a full tithe in this life prepares us to feel what we need to feel to receive the gift of eternal life.”
Do not miss the mark in zeal of obedience thumping and quid pro quo promises. The blessings that are so often touted are secondary. It is the ways this behavior might affect your heart and spirit that are the critical factors. Tithing, in this context, becomes a necessary schoolmaster to much nobler principles. And what are those principles? According to Pres. Eyring, they are:
1) Gratitude
2) Confidence/Assurance/Peace
3) Love of God and all God’s children
I was therefore doubly disappointed in the Tithing article in this December’s Ensign – Tithing: A Key to Peace in a Troubled World.
In it there were stories from 5 LDS families on the blessings they received from paying tithing. I have made a list of the blessings we can come to expect from paying tithing according to this article:
Help paying bills (3 times)
Fortuitous store sales on essential items
Help buying a house/ Help selling a house
Bishop’s storehouse help
Gifts from relatives
Unexpected refunds
New job (twice)
Mysterious bottomless bank account (twice)
Ability to have children (twice)
Money for food storage
Efficient HVAC system
Schorlarship approved
Insurance coverage
Lost family hierloom found
The article states that the blessings are “obvious” and that “if we keep the law, the reward is sure.”
My complaint is twofold. 1) I believe that having a broken heart and a contrite spirit are requirements of salvation. Tithing payment with the right attitude can contribute to this inward state. Tithing payment with the wrong attitude can become a hinderance to achieving this state. I believe that paying tithing while expecting earthly rewards is the wrong attitude. 2) I believe it to be dishonest – “just pay your tithing and all your financial troubles will mysteriously/miraculously work out” is just not true according to my experience.
If I were to make editorial suggestions for articles of this nature in the future, I would suggest that each of the families highlight a different aspect of “blessings” to be received (i.e. gratitude, family unity, sacrifice, hope, duty, obedience, humility, letting go of earthly possesions, letting go of the illusion of security, etc.) instead of all harping on the material blessings. I am ok with material blessings being referenced and represented (although I would rather not, but to each his own) but this article was ONLY about the material blessings.
My wife and I both agreed that people have degrees from MSU when it comes to tithing blessings. MSU meaning “make stuff up”. I don’t mean to be callous, but we think people invent miracles and connections to ease the dissonance. On the other hand, I don’t deny God’s hand in all things….and his anger when we don’t acknowledge it — but is it really attached to tithing? And is that sale on an item in the store, or that new job worth the equivalent of a couple mortgages over your lifetime?
I think to the people who attach significant heavenly blessings, that is so. For people with testimony issues, less-so.
SilentDawning wrote:My wife and I both agreed that people have degrees from MSU when it comes to tithing blessings. MSU meaning “make stuff up”. I don’t mean to be callous, but we think people invent miracles and connections to ease the dissonance.
On the other hand, I don’t deny God’s hand in all things….and his anger when we don’t acknowledge it — but is it really attached to tithing? And is that sale on an item in the store, or that new job worth the equivalent of a couple mortgages over your lifetime?
I think to the people who attach significant heavenly blessings, that is so. For people with testimony issues, less-so.
Stuff? I like the acronym, but I don’t think MSU means “Make stuff up”…
OK — I think it was that people have an MBU degree — Make Blessings Up — is that better? I didn’t think anyone knew the real meaning of that acronym!!! And that I could get away with it. SilentDawning wrote:OK — I think it was that people have an MBU degree — Make Blessings Up — is that better? I didn’t think anyone knew the real meaning of that acronym!!! And that I could get away with it.
Not better – stick with MSU — it will be our llittle secret, and of course everyone elses…wayfarer wrote:Tithing, improperly administered, in my impression, takes away my ability to address these weightier matters, and when it does so, I’m not living the law.
Roy wrote:I believe that having a broken heart and a contrite spirit are requirements of salvation. Tithing payment with the right attitude can contribute to this inward state. Tithing payment with the wrong attitude can become a hindrance to achieving this state. I believe that paying tithing while expecting earthly rewards is the wrong attitude.
What obligation do the editors of the Ensign magazine have to avoid teaching tithing in such a way as to take “away my ability to address these weightier matters”? When we have objections to the way things are presented in the Ensign, what is our recourse? There doesn’t seem to be a letters to the editor section. Is it possible that people who pay tithing for the wrong reasons and therefore “miss the mark” will be eternally handicapped due to their failure?
(My cynical self wonders if the Ensign editors are already aware of this but are just resigned to use the tactics that bring results. A quote I found while reading a book on the great apostasy was this, “Love makes the best converts, but fear makes the most numerous.”)
I’ve never seen any blessings from tithing yet. I better have a huge mansion on my own planet in the next life time. Arwen wrote:I’ve never seen any blessings from tithing yet. I better have a huge mansion on my own planet in the next life time.
I hear your point Arwen, and I have thought similar at many times. More lately I wonder if my blessings from tithing are actually more in line with curbing my desires. If I have learned the lesson of tithing and more importantly fast offerings and other types of giving – maybe that means I desire to give my “mansion” in heaven to those who have been less fortunate than myself. Maybe its all about gaining true happiness through the loss of selfishness.
As I follow this line of thought I start to wonder why we talk about mansions in heaven at all. Isn’t it a sign of our lingering selfishness?
or of mansions that have to be huge in order to house all the people who will be living in them I like that image, but I know introverts for whom that would seem like Hell.
That’s the main reason I’m OK with whatever vision of Heaven works for people – with some exceptions, like getting lots of virgins in some cultures.
(I love the comedy routine that says, “If we get to choose multiple people to live with in the next life, why would we choose virgins? Wouldn’t it be better to have people who know what they’re doing and are really good at it?”
😆 😆 😆 )SilentDawning wrote:Make Blessings Up
Perhaps the most frustrating for me is the mysterious bottomless bank account: “each month as we drew up our budget, we could not see how we could make it….Though we couldn’t explain it, we found we had more money in our bank account than we had thought. We were truly blessed by paying tithing….To this day, I have not figured out where the extra money came from”
So let me get this straight, You sat down to see if you could stretch the family budget to make ends meet through the rest of the month and NOBODY thought to check how much money you had in the bank?!?!?
:wtf: Luke 14:28 reads
Quote:For which of you, intending to build a tower, sitteth not down first, and counteth the cost, whether he have sufficient to finish it?
Is there somehow an alternate version that says, “unless you pay tithing, in which case don’t count the cost but rather sit back and watch the miracle. Your tower is assured!”
:crazy:
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