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DarkJedi wrote:
The only thing I can say I think God wants all of us to learn is that we need to love one another. How that happens is bound to be different for all of us.
Funilly enough, that’s the second half to the Mt Fuji quote:
Morihei Ueshiba wrote:There are many paths leading to the top of Mount Fuji, but there is only one summit – love.
ydeve wrote:
DarkJedi wrote:
The only thing I can say I think God wants all of us to learn is that we need to love one another. How that happens is bound to be different for all of us.
Funilly enough, that’s the second half to the Mt Fuji quote:
Morihei Ueshiba wrote:There are many paths leading to the top of Mount Fuji, but there is only one summit – love.
That fits. The reason I think the one thing God wants us to learn is love is because it seems to be common across all religions and belief systems.
What great questions and great sincerity. My husband joined the lds church on an intellectual testimony. It was a rational theology to him. He figured the spiritual witness promised at the end of the BofM would come later. So after joining and re-reading the BofM he began fasting and praying to get the spiritual witness promised by Moroni. It never came. Bishops told him just to accept callings ( like ward missionary) and when the time came to testify, the spirit would witness to him. It never happened. For a long time he relied on Paul H. Dunn’s testimony because he really liked him. When his fabrications came out, that was the final straw and he realized JS could have fabricated his story. So without his own person witness he could no longer go on in the lds church. He did speak to a GA about it once and this GA told him that some never do get this witness and he had no answer as to why. Eventually, he stopped knocking on that door and found peace outside the lds church. It does seem that God does not want everyone in the lds church as he led us to a different church. I respect those who stay in the lds church and believe but when it comes right down to it, we each must follow our own impressions and see where they lead.
Fwiw, Bridget, Moroni never promises a “spiritual witness”. That is a mistake we make institutionally, but it isn’t in the words themselves. All Moroni says is that God will manifest the truthfulness of the record to people by the power of the Holy Ghost. Just because Oliver Cowdery was told he would receive a burning in his bosom, we collectively have codified that personal witness as THE ONE TRUE witness method. It’s a shame – and one of my pet peeves, since it derails so many people. Your husband’s situation is a perfect example. The teachings made sense to his mind – and that is one way God could “manifest the truthfulness of it unto (him)”.
Great post, Syme! My bishop (who I’ve opened up to about my FC) sent me a text recently, quoting scripture in D&C 46 about earnestly seeking spiritual gifts and recommending that I ask specifically to know that the Lord has restored his gospel through Joseph Smith, and promised me that if I would sincerely ask in faith, God would give me this gift.
I know his intentions were good and sincere, but this really bothered me. I don’t think this is one of my spiritual gifts (and I told him so). I’ve sincerely sought this gift in the past, but nothing but doubt has come.
Far more important to me now than whether Joseph Smith restored God’s church on earth is how I can find beauty and goodness in my life now, and share beauty and goodness with others. I find beauty and goodness in the life and teachings of Christ (at least mostly), and I can find it in my local ward too. And I can find beauty and goodness in many things outside of the Church too!
FaithfulSkeptic wrote:
Great post, Syme!My bishop (who I’ve opened up to about my FC) sent me a text recently, quoting scripture in D&C 46 about earnestly seeking spiritual gifts and recommending that I ask specifically to know that the Lord has restored his gospel through Joseph Smith, and promised me that if I would sincerely ask in faith, God would give me this gift.
I know his intentions were good and sincere, but this really bothered me. I don’t think this is one of my spiritual gifts (and I told him so). I’ve sincerely sought this gift in the past, but nothing but doubt has come.
Far more important to me now than whether Joseph Smith restored God’s church on earth is how I can find beauty and goodness in my life now, and share beauty and goodness with others. I find beauty and goodness in the life and teachings of Christ (at least mostly), and I can find it in my local ward too. And I can find beauty and goodness in many things outside of the Church too!
Good to hear from you. I will mention that being released as HPGL and then moving into Primary has helped. I give a few minutes (moments) of the lesson to a great group of 10 year olds, but I start going into history and all kinds of subjects that I can relate to the topic of the lesson. for one example, the lesson mentioned that the Smith’s gathered maple sap and made syrup. I have been to new hampsire where it is maple country and seen just how hard it is to make that stuff. So I talked for 15 minutes about maple syrup – how it is gathered, how you have to gather a gallon of sap to make 1/2 cup, how you have to slowly cook it for hours – not to hot (it burns) and too slow and it will take days to get the water out of it. I do really feel for how hard it was to keep alive back in JS’s time, but I just don’t dwell on what the lesson is talking about. I think the kids just enjoy having some variety from an excited, happy, loving teacher. I always just end saying, “the most important thing I want you to each remember is that God deeply loves each of you.”Anyway – sorry to hear things are not really improving with the wife. My wife doesn’t want to talk about it, but I know she is thinking about it. I accepted for our family to talk on “being as a child” and she was surprised that I accepted. I did tell her I had to hear the topic first.
But I kind of felt that I dropped a bombshell on her and I needed to give her just a bit of space/time to adjust a bit. I do know I will need to say, “I am not going to try and de-convert you, but there are a few things we need to talk about and compromise”
Best of luck.
I may be in St. G for a few days this summer. Maybe we could catch a breakfast or something for just a few minutes.
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