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I really don’t know what to do in these situations. I watch porn that’s really my only issue honestly, but I’m sure there’s countless others. But my Dad had me give me a blessing for the Stake Trek he’s going on tomorrow. He’s the stake president. It’s just me an my parents here at home so no one else can do it. I gave him the blessing, but I just feel so bad that I’m giving him a blessing when I’m not even worthy. Not worthy because you’re not “perfect?” If we need to be perfect to give a blessing then there would never be any blessings. I used to really have issues with feeling worthy. I don’t have much of that problem. I think much of it comes from the constant preaching of perfection. I feel that God deeply loves you and loves when you are trying to help someone.
My advice would be to calm down and chill out over it. I was one of those that would sneak a peak that I had to turn the safe search on every couple of months. It wasn’t until I stopped worrying about it and then I could calm down and actually have a rational discussion in my mind before deciding if I wanted to look at that stuff or not. It is hard to explain. I would focus not on constant begging for forgiveness, but work on feeling in touch with God.
I think you need to filter out what the church leaders say means worthy and what YOU think means worthy. I had a companion who would constantly leer at girls as we drove around town. For example, there was an attractive girl sitting on a bench along the beachfront and he said “I wish she’d stand up”. (so he could see more of her). And it was comments like that all day. Then we would go to a teaching appointment and he would teach with the Spirit.
I think God is more forgiving than we think, although I don’t want to encourage everyone to ignore their conscience, but I share this story to show how this missionary was clearly in the wrong with his thoughts but somehow was capable of teaching with the Spirit.
SilentDawning wrote:I think you need to filter out what the church leaders say means worthy and what YOU think means worthy. I had a companion who would constantly leer at girls as we drove around town. For example, there was an attractive girl sitting on a bench along the beachfront and he said “I wish she’d stand up”. (so he could see more of her). And it was comments like that all day.
Then we would go to a teaching appointment and he would teach with the Spirit.
I think God is more forgiving than we think, although I don’t want to encourage everyone to ignore their conscience, but I share this story to show how this missionary was clearly in the wrong with his thoughts but somehow was capable of teaching with the Spirit.
I think the influence of the Spirit is much less tied to obedience than we’re taught. Most of the time it’s our own feelings of guilt and what not the block the feelings we experience when we “feel the Spirit.” That’s part of the issue with the influence of the Spirit being so related to emotion and we so often can’t tell the difference between emotion and the Spirit anyway. I’m also not advocating ignoring our consciences, and I believe guilt (perhaps better termed “Godly sorrow”) can play a role in repentance. I also think sometimes we’re far harder on ourselves than God is.
willb1993 wrote:I watch porn that’s really my only issue honestly
Perhaps you can do an experiment.
What if you tell yourself that porn doesn’t matter to God.
Then go about your life and look for evidences that God wants you to keep trying to do good, but he accepts you as you are now, and sees the hundreds of things you do that are amazing, and so he is blessing you in so many ways.
Do you see blessings? Do you feel the spirit? Do you feel close to God?
If so…perhaps he loves you and approves of you more than he cares about porn, and wants you to know you are worthy…so keep going with it.
If not…and you feel dead inside and spiritually cut off…then there is another course of action.
But first…try to find out how big of a deal that porn thing is to god…and if your fears about worthiness are just…or if the adversary is trying to fill you with fears to get you to give up.
See what the experiment shows you in your life.
Quote:D&C 50: 40 Behold, ye are little children and ye cannot bear all things now; ye must grow in grace and in the knowledge of the truth
God is patient with us and what we are doing.
I want to add another story. When I was in a strong period of inactivity/semi activity, I did speak in church a few times, and actually ended up teaching Gospel Doctrine as a fill-in a few times. I had annual interviews with the Bishop over my non-Tr, non-tithing status. At one point, at the end of the meeting (where I made no commitments to do better whatsoever) he said “I’m not worried about you, because I ALWAYS feel the Spirit when you speak or teach”. What he didn’t know was that some extraordinary circumstances in my life had put me in a position where I was NOT living a basic commandment he would’ve balked at, if I told him. But he trusted the Spirit. His statement was evidence of his faith in the Spirit and its attendance with people who are worthy.
I knew it was wrong, this thing I was doing, but in spite of it, I felt supported by God, and could teach with the spirit. I am not sure what God’s rules are when it comes to worthiness. I have a feeling they are different than our leaders’ rules, but who can be sure. I don’t know.
Also, I don’t know your personal circumstances that have led you to engage with porn, but if they are extraordinary, or due to your life’s circumstances, I trust God will take that into account.
SilentDawning wrote:I am not sure what God’s rules are when it comes to worthiness. I have a feeling they are different than our leaders’ rules, but who can be sure. I don’t know.
Excellent example, SD. I like how you put this.
I think it helps to separate out church from God in our personal lives. Church is imperfect, with imperfect people trying their best and agreeing to a handbook of instructions to try to be fair to the body of church members. God is perfect and is fair to individuals.
God probably knows the things that bishop of yours had as his sins he needed to work through, and if you knew his sins, would think him unworthy.
We should try to see others like God sees them. We should try to accept ourselves the way God accepts us.
God cannot look upon sin with the least degree of allowance…any sin…for everyone in the whole world. We are all unworthy. That is our faith for the need for the Atonement to help us overcome our unworthiness, and to serve with an eye single to the glory of God…while we are imperfect.
Heber13 wrote:God cannot look upon sin with the least degree of allowance…
yet, I feel he does give us lots of blessings and room when we are sinning, and even unrepentent.
I like the story BKP told about a missionary who came to the mission field disfigured. A plastic surgeon in his ward gave him free plastic surgery to fix the disfigurement.
Immediately after the missionary healed up from the surgery, the mission president got calls from Ward members indicating the missionary was flirting with other young adult women in his Ward. And guess what, the mission president did NOTHING. He realized that after a lifetime of being somewhat hideous looking, the YM was finally given a new face and perspective, and was enjoying what it was like to look normal, and have girls pay normal attention to him. The mission president let it go for a reasonable time, after which the missionary stopped flirting.
I think God looks at us with this kind of long-term wisdom. I am not sure at what point he looks upon sin without much “allowance”, but I feel that time may well be off in the future. I am not even sure what it means to “look upon” — does it mean to allow it in the final heaven? Does it mean to view it directly, rather than through a report from the angels who report to him? I do not know what it means.
About blessings specifically: As a kid, our stake patriarch was excommunicated for adultery. He had a long ongoing affair with someone at work. My sister had received her PB a few weeks before he was found out, released, and eventual ex-excommunicated. My parents asked if the PB was still valid. They were told yes. His authority and priesthood were completely separate from his sin.
About porn .. Honestly .. I don’t think God cares that much. It’s a habit of lonely and socially isolated people. Just get out a little more. I cannot imagine God being okay with violent crimes, maimings, torture and horrific birth defects to exist .. But not porn. There are worse things in the world than porn.
We aren’t supposed to be perfect but we are supposed to be kind .. To ourselves as well as to others.
amateurparent wrote:About blessings specifically:
As a kid, our stake patriarch was excommunicated for adultery. He had a long ongoing affair with someone at work. My sister had received her PB a few weeks before he was found out, released, and eventual ex-excommunicated. My parents asked if the PB was still valid. They were told yes. His authority and priesthood were completely separate from his sin.
Interesting. The same thing happened to my convert parents.amateurparent wrote:About porn .. Honestly .. I don’t think God cares that much. It’s a habit of lonely and socially isolated people. Just get out a little more. I cannot imagine God being okay with violent crimes, maimings, torture and horrific birth defects to exist .. But not porn. There are worse things in the world than porn.
I don’t assume every women in the porn industry is a total victime, but I think God is orders of magnitude more worried about the women forced into the porn industry or sex trade than some guy looking at a screen. Compare who is the bigger “slave” out of the two. It doesn’t even seem fair to compare as it seems insulting to the real victims.If watching porn is your only issue, you can give a blessing. The victim aspect of porn is the worst aspect of porn, and it is real and far too pervasive. The porn industry, as a whole, is evil – but you are okay giving a blessing if that is your only issue.
SilentDawning wrote:yet, I feel he does give us lots of blessings and room when we are sinning, and even unrepentent.
I agree.I don’t think God disapproving means he withholds all blessings and thinks a person can’t give blessings or do good things. One can say “God cannot look upon sin with the least degree of allowance…” and also recognize his long-term wisdom knows there is a way it will be ok. Since all are sinners, he has shown he moves ahead blessing people anyway. My point is to mesh the teachings in the scriptures and at church with common sense that there is not fire and brimstone.
I think we are saying the same thing. Not excusing sin or saying things like porn don’t matter (they do and aren’t great for our souls), but saying our sins don’t become extreme show stoppers where unworthiness excludes a sinner from all things.
In some ways, people are going to be better off giving blessings and staying involved doing good things in their life and knowing it feels good to make good choices and the sins they have become lessened to where they just don’t want to do those anymore…and that can be better than constantly focusing on the things you shouldn’t do but have a hard time not doing while focusing on that.
Focus on filling life with good instead of trying to stop the bad.
As I was thinking about this “not looking on sin with the least degree of allowance”, it reminded me of situations I have faced in various leadership positions. There are usually rules in place. Some rules are extremely important, while others are less important. Many of the rules of lesser importance are broken now and then. As a leader, if I know they are broken right in front of me, I normally have to say something disapproving about the infraction, or I am giving tacit approval for the people in my “stewardship” to break them again. However, if I don’t know they are being broken, or their non-observance is not flaunted in my face, I will do nothing about them provided the other fundamentals are observed, and people are getting results and doing what they are supposed to do.
Therefore, I can’t look upon sin with the least degree of allowance when it is flaunted in my face, or I am asked directly to interpret a certain rule. Otherwise, I am approving of it. Perhaps that is what the scripture means about “looking upon sin”. Humankind is so imperfect that I think God would not be able to do very much through us imperfect people if he withdrew blessings for every single thing. But if you asked him directly, particularly in front of other people, he has to rule out EVERYTHING sinful as unacceptable. Because of who he is…and his leadership position/precedent-setting role.
SilentDawning wrote:There are usually rules in place. Some rules are extremely important, while others are less important. Many of the rules of lesser importance are broken now and then. As a leader, if I know they are broken right in front of me, I normally have to say something disapproving about the infraction, or I am giving tacit approval for the people in my “stewardship” to break them again. However, if I don’t know they are being broken, or their non-observance is not flaunted in my face, I will do nothing about them provided the other fundamentals are observed, and people are getting results and doing what they are supposed to do.
Once a sister came to me and confessed to breaking the WofW. She said she had purchased a fruit drink in a can, and after she had drank it, she read the can and saw it it contained black tea in addition to the fruit juice. She was devastated. I tried not to laugh as I told he that yes it was wrong to drink tea, but she did not have to give up her TR. I told her just to be more careful in the future. I think this applies to what SilentDawning is saying. I had to say it was wrong, but was it really?
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