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There are many people that struggle to stay on or get back on the boat, it’s a good article for people in that camp, but there’s this other group that isn’t fully on the boat and wouldn’t appreciate the recuse efforts that the article calls for. Is there a way to tell the difference between the two types of people that are overboard? When to do everything humanly possible to get someone back on the boat and when to help them swim to wherever they want their next landing spot to be? We can always ask directly I suppose, but is the culture more equipped to help people with “their” journey or better equipped for helping people on “the” journey… if you follow.
I like the attempt of this article to be more inclusive and non-judgmental. Those are always good things. The problem I have with this general analogy is the assumption everyone in the boat has that this is the best boat to be in or the only “true” boat. The analogy is not inclusive of the fact that some raised in the boat find out it is unhealthy for them or that there are other boats on the waters that may also be “true.”
The boat may be a great vehicle to get towards the desired destination, and the rules one must abide by to stay on the boat may work perfectly for some or even work well enough to want to stay. Others may have spouses who love the boat and its rules so they stay for that reason.
Some who want to stay in the boat have come to realize it has some problems that many don’t or can’t see. They may quietly slip out at times to swim in the clear waters beside the boat and then get back in. They know they can’t be too vocal about these things or the captain could kick them off the boat. They wish the boat was a little more inclusive and that some rules could be adjusted, but feel comfortable enough with their personal growth in their own unorthodox way that the boat is worth staying on.
But there are some others for whom staying on the boat is just not the best decision. There are some who, for their personal integrity, spiritual health, or other reasons, must leave the boat and either swim on their own or find another boat. And those folks should be honored, validated, and assisted as well.
In sum, I wish the analogy could be expanded to be even more inclusive, but this article is a good start.
DoubtingTom wrote:In sum, I wish the analogy could be expanded to be even more inclusive, but this article is a good start.
:clap: :clap: :thumbup: OK…I was TOTALLY thinking this exact thing while reading it.
In general, it is an anology, so fine…the point of it is a good one to not judge those that are trying to Stay LDS. And the fact it is in a well accepted media that members and leaders are likely to see…that is great. So…I applaud the good stuff.
I should stop there. It’s a good start.
……..buuuuut…I won’t just stop there. 😳 Let me just add this…because I feel it is similar to thoughts I have on some people that bash a talk like Elder Christofferson…the other view of things is good to talk about and establish…but if you take the alternate view too far…it is just another view, not as effective maybe than a third more elevating viewpoint.
For example…
Quote:Climbing back in the boat can be a slow process….[snip]
This process is guaranteed to be difficult and can take a lifetime. When people are fighting the waves and doing their best to hold, one of the last things they need is for those on the boat to comment on how wet they are.
So…first of all…it’s an analogy…so it is about the point being made…I get it. I like the point that trying to get back in the boat is not easy, and we should realize that instead of thinking people outside the boat want to be there or are lazy. Just because I didn’t fall out of the boat, doesn’t mean anything in comparison to others out of the boat. OK…I accept those points being made…it is difficult, let’s not worry about judging them.Just, kinda silly they would take the analogy so far as to make the absurd comparisons that don’t really apply to a hypothetical boat situation.
For example…
Quote:is guaranteed to be difficult and can take a lifetime
? Who climbs in a boat for a lifetime? If you’re gonna use a boat analogy, stick to the parameters of a boat analogy. Nobody tries to climb in a boat for a lifetime. OK…I won’t get hung up on it…I think they are making a point (it just doesn’t fit the analogy for me, but whatever).
But this part is the part I take exception to and that DT mentions has a feel of not being inclusive enough, from what I was thinking DT was hinting at…
Quote:Rather than being concerned about the puddle they may make on the deck, let’s be the ones reaching over the edge and pulling people up.
When you belittle the TBM for how they believe…you’re just asking for them to shake their head at how much you don’t understand them, and makes it easy for them to circle the wagons against fiery darts from the opposition that are clearly not true. It doesn’t progress the dialogue.
So….in this analogy…it’s ok to slam the people in the boat as so shallow they don’t care about people outside the boat, or they care about asking frivolous things like why they got wet, or judge them as never even thinking to help pull people up?
The analogy went a bit too far and into more hyperbole, I guess to make the point.
But…by doing so…just kinda ragged on boat people as if they don’t care about Christ’s teachings…which is not what I see.
I see church people trying to think of how to have loving approaches to rescue and reach out to and help and call out to help as much as they can…and when doing so…sometimes get it wrong and sound judgmental, sometimes really misunderstand the struggle others are going through (my bishop did), and sometimes offend by trying to help someone that doesn’t want help.
But they aren’t standing looking at puddles.
The article made a good point…just fell short for me because it doesn’t give the church enough credit for how much they try to do to help others.
You can’t rag on the church for “rescue efforts” that are offensive that they are trying to brainwash people and just want statistics and just want watchmen on the watch towers to get tithing money, and then turn around and use analogies blaming people in the boat for not thinking to help people in the boat or go rescue people. At some point…church goers will just feel they cannot win with those that are struggling with their testimonies because it is always just judgement back at them.
If you make weak arguments about the validity of a faith crisis…I think it just fuels others to not understand it or to just brush it off. We need better arguments, better analogies, better discussions. Not just finger pointing back and forth.
IDK…just my thoughts. DT said it better…it just wasn’t inclusive enough. I like a better approach like DT had where we aren’t so sure the boat is all there is to the story. More sometimes that life throws you out of stage 3 or the boat, even if you didn’t want that. It happens. And it’s survivable.
I may have gotten too literal in the analogy and hung up on it. Like I said…I’m glad it is something people talk about to better understand it isn’t just lazy as the reason people are overboard. Just…while making the point to the struggle of a faith crisis…just…motes and beams, and all that.
My thoughts are a lot like Heber’s. I thought it was an excellent analogy, but I didn’t like how it seemed to over-generalize and characterize the average member. I probably will use the analogy at some point, but I won’t take it as far as the author took it – or, at least, if I do take it that far, I will emphasize that (too many but) relatively few members are represented at those extremes.
The fact that we are seeing more and more of these type articles does tell me that more and more people are having and expressing doubt or all out leaving – despite statements to the contrary in conference. I agree, LH. Yep. It is more and more and it helps people think differently as it becomes more commonplace of a topic.
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