- This topic is empty.
-
Posts
-
nibbler wrote:
It starts a discussion and creates space for people.
I don’t have a strong opinion about the event, but I’m thankful for the space it created in my LDS world. My husband, kids, church friends all know it happened, and that I wasn’t there. I’m sure they’re happy about that, but the extremes that some went to might make it easier for us to have a conversation.Well said, Ann. Having the discussion is what is worthwhile in our families. When people lack a voice in the organization they demonstrate. When 15 men decide everything for 5 million how can you blame them. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Heber13 wrote:I’m not sure I agree, nibbler. By some people seeing the resignation, they may assume those that didn’t join the movement are fully on-board with the policy. Which isn’t true. But the news shows only those that speak up.
That is an issue. From a quoted participant in the the Washington Post article:Quote:“I feel like if your name’s in the church, if you keep your name in the church, you’re supporting their decisions and the choices they’re making and their doctrine.”
Closer to home, I noticed last Sunday morning that my Church building had been hit with a barrage of eggs. Did the people who voiced their opinion in that way know that I, an Atheist who supports SSM, would be in attendance with my wife, a believer who supports SSM? Doubt it. Would they still throw eggs, anyway, because they think we’re responsible for this bad doctrine by not leaving? My guess is ‘yes’.In the Black & White view that makes up how people see the world, it’s easiest to label groups and assume or pretend that they all speak collectively: Mormons think a certain way… those who disagree either get ex’d or they resign. Yet, we here know that is not the case.
nibbler wrote:The resignations trickle down to the Onion:
http://www.theonion.com/americanvoices/former-parishioners-protest-mormon-lgbt-policy-51856 ” class=”bbcode_url”> http://www.theonion.com/americanvoices/former-parishioners-protest-mormon-lgbt-policy-51856
I like:
Quote:How could a faith invented less than two centuries ago have such an antiquated policy?”
Those were rather mild-mannered. Not that it will probably amount to anything in the end, but there is a petition to classify the church as a hate group.
https://www.change.org/p/barack-obama-classify-the-mormon-church-as-a-hate-group ” class=”bbcode_url”> https://www.change.org/p/barack-obama-classify-the-mormon-church-as-a-hate-group Looking back at the 2 revelations since Joseph Smith, One was the end of polygamy (the government was just about to shut down the church), the other was blacks and the priesthood/temple ban being lifted (there was significant pressure coming from things like not being able to play in college sports, and rumors the church might lose tax exempt status). Until that kind of social pressure is applied I don’t know that the general theme will change. Maybe if more people within start raising more of a fuss then there is a chance in a few decades.
LookingHard wrote:Not that it will probably amount to anything in the end, but there is a petition to classify the church as a hate group.
https://www.change.org/p/barack-obama-classify-the-mormon-church-as-a-hate-group ” class=”bbcode_url”> https://www.change.org/p/barack-obama-classify-the-mormon-church-as-a-hate-group
This is a great example of an extreme on the opposite side of the same coin. There are so many things wrong with the ‘petition’ that I cannot even bring myself to answer any of it.It’s a good reminder that I’m so grateful to be part of a community like StayLDS where we look for peaceful cohabitation rather than emboldened rhetoric (especially of the non-logical variety).
On Own Now wrote:
This is a great example of an extreme on the opposite side of the same coin. There are so many things wrong with the ‘petition’ that I cannot even bring myself to answer any of it.
I agree, and hope nothing comes of it. I’m afraid, though, that there will be professional fallout for members associated with the policy. (The personal fallout is becoming obvious and rightly has center stage.) The church cantalkabout freedom of religion and the public square, but there will be very little they can doin a timely, comprehensive way to stop discrimination against members. Two candidates for a faculty job, one LDS, the other not. I can see schools, even more than before, going with the latter on that basis alone. Wow Quote:Your Questions for Granddaughter of LDS Apostle M. Russell Ballard
Surprise! It looks like tomorrow I will be interviewing the granddaughter of M. Russell Ballard who recently resigned her LDS Church membership. Please post your questions for her here! (Respectful questions only please. She loves her grandfather.)
http://mormonstories.org/your-questions-for-granddaughter-of-lds-apostle-m-russell-ballard/ ” class=”bbcode_url”> http://mormonstories.org/your-questions-for-granddaughter-of-lds-apostle-m-russell-ballard/ LookingHard wrote:the other was blacks and the priesthood/temple ban being lifted (there was significant pressure coming from things like not being able to play in college sports, and rumors the church might lose tax exempt status). Until that kind of social pressure is applied I don’t know that the general theme will change. Maybe if more people within start raising more of a fuss then there is a chance in a few decades.
I really think the change with the priesthood ban was internal pressure, not external. Seeing people join the church and wanting temple blessings, or seeing the stumbling blocks to missionary work, made David O McKay and many others question the traditional doctrine. It just didn’t feel right to many…they just hang on to prophetic authority uttered it, and that was all. I don’t think tax exempt status was the motivator. I truly think SWK and others felt wrong about it and were hoping the Lord would confirm it should be removed. That took decades, sadly.But still…to talk about our current issue in our day, if there were practical reasons such as threats from government that it was a discriminatory practice or something…it might help the prophets compromise for a greater good. But I think they’ve positioned themselves to be protected from that now.
So, I still think it will be decades, and then hopefully it will feel wrong enough they internally change it because it isn’t doctrine based. As they said with the priesthood ban in the essay on the website:
Quote:given the long history of withholding the priesthood from men of black African descent, Church leaders believed that a revelation from God was needed to alter the policy, and they made ongoing efforts to understand what should be done. After praying for guidance, President McKay did not feel impressed to lift the ban.
It may not need to be revelation to initiate a policy. But it seems to then need revelation to remove it. And then…Quote:Reaction worldwide was overwhelmingly positive among Church members of all races. Many Latter-day Saints wept for joy at the news. Some reported feeling a collective weight lifted from their shoulders.
Yay…a weight that we placed on our shoulders ourselves can be lifted eventually.
:think: I feel the weight now.
I feel that on my shoulders also. I do agree the more I hear about some of the possible legal reasons I can see a scenario where the church asks its legal council for some ways to protect itself and some of the corporations it owns as well as BYU. The lawyers come up with some legal protections. The brethren don’t comprehend where the heart and mind of the church are at (and even leaders that have access to Handbook 1) and without really thinking about it they release this not knowing what they are going to do. I heard someone quote that they feel like the church contradicted it’s doctrine in exchange to be in a better legal position to fight a cultural war against gays.
I am not comfortable being conscripted into such a war. I am a conscientious objector for that war. Can I sign up to be a medic?
Mormons seem to be fairly comfortable with wars, from pre-existence to Book of Mormon decapitations to pioneer wars to our modern wars…it is always good vs evil. Quote:(Rev. 12:7–9).
That war, so bitter, so intense, has gone on, and it has never ceased. It is the war between truth and error, between agency and compulsion, between the followers of Christ and those who have denied Him. His enemies have used every stratagem in that conflict. They’ve indulged in lying and deceit. They’ve employed money and wealth. They’ve tricked the minds of men. They’ve murdered and destroyed and engaged in every other unholy and impure practice to thwart the work of Christ.
– Gordon B Hinckley, The War We are Winning, General Conference Oct 1986
Don’t forget our lovely hymns. We are all enlisted till the conflict is o’er. I’m busy beating my plowshare into the shape of a sword.
If it really comes to war, don’t look for me on the battlefield. Look for me in the tents, carrying a lantern from bed to bed.
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.