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When I was HPGL 5 years ago, one brother in our quorum always seemed to be speaking positively about the way I tried to lead our quorum, and generally, seemed to like me and seek me out.. Well. he’s shown up at my house about 3 times during the commitment crisis that started 3-4 years ago. He claims he’s not there on assignment, but something inside me tells me that’s not the case. And that whatever I say, goes back to our priesthood leadership locally.
However, I seem to have gotten more and more comfortable sharing my divergent thoughts with him over the years. The ground is fertile for it as our local Ward is really struggling. They installed a Bishop who epitomizes the wrong kind of leadership in a faith-based organization. Sacrament meeting attendance has fallen from about 110 to 40 each Sunday — just so you know there is in fact a systemic problem with the leadership.
Last time he came (Saturday), I shared the following:
1. I am putting in 5-15 hours per week with a community organization, which represents my priesthood service.
2. My family is active in a different Ward
3. My daughter is attending various “camps” at BYU, received her YW medallion, and is fully active.
Since he intimated that the Ward is really suffering under the current Bishop, I ventured forth and shared the following:
1. That I believe we conscript people into callings more than we should; that we should be seeking to align passions and talents with the needs and the church — that we should avoid church egocentrism.
2. That I noticed organizational egocentrism happens in the Church, and also, in other non-profits like the one I’m serving right now; it’s not owned entirely by the church.
3. That the programs are worn out to many of the brethren — the same programs over and over and over again — and they often don’t seem to work (such as HT). How it actually damages relationships
with leaders and followers in some cases. Also, that when HT stats never change, that normal organizations would re-evaluate the program, and make adjustments
4. That people should feel free to resign from callings when they aren’t working for them anymore.
5. That I believe the HT structure is a good thing to place service between the Bishop and families who have needs in the Ward – with the structure activated when there are legitimate needs expressed by families.
That badgering people for HT visits when there is no felt need only wears out the priesthood holders and annoys the families.
6. that I think it’s time we stop chasing less active people and focus on making our programs good. When people spontaneously come back to church, they are drawn in by the quality of the experience — a big problem in our local Ward.
I shared a few other things, but he nodded his head most of the time at what I was saying and provided statements of agreement most of the time. He’s worn out, I can tell, but serving out of a sense of duty.
I realized it was time to stop when I asked his own opinions. He replied
“Yes, i see your points, but if I allow myself to think it, I’ll stop being active”
He also commented, as several other people have said to me in the last few years that I “think differently than other people” and that he likes it.
It was an odd visit. He walked the line between affirmation and dissaffirmation pretty well. I think he silently believes most of what I observed, but as he said, isn’t willing to let himself think critically, or embrace it given the damage such beliefs can inflict on testimony. I also wish I could trust him to be at my home for purely altruistic reasons. I have feeling he’s the long,hairy arm of the local HPGL.
Just thought I’d share. I’m sure all this will go back to the local leadership.
After years of caring about that, I care less than before. My wife indicates there is no way she will ever go back to our local Ward, and unless we move into a different Ward in the same stake, it will not likely matter.
Sounds like a good visit SD. I especially wish that some thought would be given to improving the church experience.
For to many people “church” is something that must be endured for the sake of going to heaven.
:lolno: Thanks Roy — I always feel sheepish when no one answers a post. Thanks for your commentary…I appreciate it. Sounds like an interesting visit. Did you feel reckless or angry when you said all those things? Just curious what your state of mind was. For your sake I sincerely hope your home teacher isn’t reporting back to anyone. I would find that so frustrating and deflating, considering he claims not to be there on assignment. We have recently had an active home teacher, for the first time in probably 8 years. I think I am on the ward’s radar and wouldn’t be surprised if my home teachers were reporting back to someone. My bishopric dropped by for a surprise visit last week. We hadn’t been at church for about a month due to sickness and a vacation. It was a nice visit—they just chatted for a few minutes, said they missed seeing us, and left.
I wasn’t reckless or angry. First, I framed up my life as one characterized by activity, with my family active, just in another Ward. Given the shrivelling attendance at our home ward (Sacrament meeting attendance declining by about 60%+ with the advent of a new Bishopric a few years ago). Second, I told him that I was dedicating a lot of my time to service to others. My criticisms — I felt he sincerely agreed with them as he IS worn out from our programs, does find it monotonous himself. When I was HPGL he would often complement me on the way I didn’t beat up on everyone about HT etcetera. I also gave no concerns about things that Bishops tend to punish you for — such as doctrinal doubt or any concerns about the truth claims of our religion — just being tired of the monotony of the whole thing.
If he does run back to the local leadership, I’m at the point I don’t care as much anymore. I’ve expressed some concerns with the administrative side of the church, but my family doesn’t want to attend this ward ever again in their lives. Not my active, TBM daughter, TBM wife, or frankly, myself. My son doesn’t care one way or the other.
I think the only way this will hurt us is if I want back into leadership again in this Ward or Stake. And at this point in my life, I don’t want it — at least, not here in this geographical location.
Ya at the risk of being “unpopular” I have all those same thoughts not just in church but in other orgs and businesses I have been that have used the sane or similar programs. All of the church programs can be found in other orgs. And have long been studied to have those side effects. So to me it’s just stating a fact. On the other hand I stay in orgs. Long term that use different more free flowing structures. To much structure or work structuring yourself to the program instead the the program structuring insert to those serving it is mentally and physically draining beyond belief to sustain.
A good example is I find it more worn out and backwards growth(going down hill) in 3 hours of service in that then in 30-40 hours at work or doing construction work service. That’s pretty eye opening and there is research(a ton) that point to that along with the monotonous and the dude effects of that. Even more interesting is the research that shows the sane results for marriages breaking down for the same reason. Monotony is a minor cause in marriages to go sour and “feel a lack of love and connection with spouse” so I am not surprised it would be true for a religious relocations hip as well.
The counsel is that spontaneous and free flowing ideas and work at the right moments can help the marriage work in a long lasting and real way. As well as the research for orgs. With the programs. There is actually consulters who show business and orgs how to incorporate it for a better more healthy environment.
If I find time I’ll try to find them.
Anyways ya, I like that approach to it. You didn’t say anything wrong, spoke truth, listened and were respectful with it.
Personally I love the people in the church and love to help them in ways I can. But that doesn’t take away from the facts and the resulting side effects of those facts. If they would have a hard time about that then I can’t serve them well of I have to walk in egg shells while serving them. I’m that sense, I wouldn’t care either if they made a call to not include me in service where you can’t give honestly of yourself and your thoughts and ideas and feelings, knowledge and experience.
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