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Hi all, I am new here and will try to keep this short but sweet and to the point. I have a tendency to become long winded so I apologize in advance. I have posted elsewhere- on LDSnet and Faces East, I’m sorry if my story is repetitive to any of you! My story is almost identical to Pinkpatent’s except that my husband gave up trying a long time ago to stay positive about the gospel at all for my sake or our children’s sake. Our oldest daughter just turned 9 and waited her entire 8th year for Daddy to decide to baptize her and he never did. I have been through all the phases of being hurt, feeling betrayed, let down, sad, angry that follows a spouse deciding that the gospel (and our temple marriage) is not for him. He has not wanted to take his name off of church records so I don’t know if that means he still believes a little bit…but I don’t think he does. My real concern is what does this mean for eternity if I stay with him? If the kids and I remain active and faithful- will we be together without him in the Celestial Kingdom? It seems very hard to imagine spending my entire life with someone just to know we will be seperated after this life due to his choices. I should really list this under support….sorry!! That’s my story on a basic level. I’m grateful this forum exists! Thank you John!! Welcome! I think it is important to God to maintain a healthy happy marriage, and I’m not 100% convinced that you’ll be separated in the next life, even if he doesn’t come to church ever again. I think he can act Christian, even if he doesn’t go to church. I’m also encouraged that he doesn’t want his name removed–I guess there’s always a chance he could come back around. I think you should encourage him as you can, but don’t hold your breath that he’ll start going to church either. sonorangirl wrote:My real concern is what does this mean for eternity if I stay with him? If the kids and I remain active and faithful- will we be together without him in the Celestial Kingdom? It seems very hard to imagine spending my entire life with someone just to know we will be seperated after this life due to his choices.
Does anyone really “Know” what it will mean in eternity? – We can only guess..And I’m thinking by the love of our Savior ( Jesus Christ ) even those of us who don’t agree with an organization anymore, will find that as long as they remain Christ-like ( kind, patient, charitable .. etc ) they will be just fine – Right along with yourself
You mentioned your “Entire Life” – This life is important too. You got sealed to one another .. To work and become One not to look for greener grass when change happens. Change is a part of life. I always ask my DH .. “What if I was an active believer until I was 70 AND THEN realized I disagreed with many Church teachings, instead of doing so at 23?” .. Well he kind of said by then it would be ok .. idk The point is change is going to happen .. Now or later. I guess the difference is the amount of timing where longsuffering and patience would greatly be needed – And can you cut it or not .. Well I guess it would be a one day at a time process. But IMO as long as a relationship is healthy a marriage/an individual you choose to be with should never be compromised for a new HONEST struggle of faith. – The process is horrible, trust me (IMO) I would much rather want to believe like before my dissafection than the latter.
Church aside – Completely. Do you treat each other with respect .. Do you love one another .. Are you both able to sacrafice when the time is right .. Do you share hobbies..Are you good parents?
It is hard to seperate The Gospel from The Church .. The individual from The Church .. Sometimes you need to brake things down in your mind before you can start building them back up. Welcome – I’m sorry for your pain – I know how it feels..And I’m on the opposite end it isn’t easy .. I’ve been depressed for months BUT am finally snapping out of it.
BTW you mentioned “Gospel” a few times. Is it the Gospel he is leaving or is it The Church he no longer wants to follow – There is a difference. IMO The Gospel of Jesus Christ is perfect .. The Church is not (imo)-And it seems to be “The Church” that many people have problems with … Less on the actual Gospel side. I still have a love/respect/believing relationship with God and Jesus Christ … The Church is what I have problems with .. Just wondering!
LaLaLove wrote:You mentioned your “Entire Life” – This life is important too.
I couldn’t agree more. The experiences in this life are so important, all of them, good and bad. Today is the most important day in eternity, and it will be the only chance we get to experience it in eternity. No matter how long eternity is/was/will be, we’ll never get today back.
Some of us haven’t heard your story so if you want to share more….
Quote:It seems very hard to imagine spending my entire life with someone just to know we will be seperated after this life due to his choices.
I’m sorry to hear your troubled by this, it sounds like a tough situation.
My family went through a recent traumatic event (you can read my intro if you want), and I had lots of fears about my eternal life. I think what I have come to learn is that all we can control is our choice on what we decide to do today, and hope for tomorrow. We can’t make others act or think or believe like we do, as I’m sure you know very well. The trick then, especially in marriage, is how to find peace and love no matter what your spouse chooses to do.
IMO, the church’s doctrine of perfection for eternal families has the downside of how to not feel discouraged when we’re not yet perfect and never will be in this life. I strongly believe the Lord and the Atonement make ways to overcome temporary problems in this life and still offer hope of all the blessings you deserve in the next.
More important than does your husband go to church or believe it, is how well does he treat you and your kids? I’m not asking you to share that with the forum, but to accept that he may never come back to the church, and may someday want his name removed. You can’t control that, although your example may influence…but there is no guarantees on what that will do. Can you still accept him and love him, or is your love conditional on him being Mormon? You need to believe what you believe, but don’t let Mormon doctrine scare you about the next life because things aren’t perfect. They never will be. I believe the sealing powers of the temple have stronger chords than we can understand in this life…we may not understand it, but we should continue to love and accept others and try to find joy in our decisions today. Sometimes, others (like a wayward son or non-member friend) just need to feel we view them as acceptable just the way they are before they can be open to any spiritual feelings. Look beyond “the church is true or it is not true” and just view others for being great just the way they are, no conditions attached. I honestly feel if you have love in your heart and strive to live a Christ-like life, it will not matter what choices others make. The next life will take care of itself, and this life will be more rich and fulfilling. The church is a church of love, not of fear.
What has helped me most is to become active outdoors and get in touch with nature. I invite family members to go on walks with me. I’ve increased frequency of date nights and fun little notes of love and encouragement on txt messages and in backpacks. I’ve been going to the park to play ball and be outdoors. I invite everyone in my family to go with me, and if they don’t want to, I go anyway. My new goal is to just be a happy person and let others choose what they will choose, and trust that God will help make things right. The more I do this, my fears and worries of “eternal expectations” melt away.
Try to balance all things in your life. Church is a part of you, not the ultimate everything. If you find the church is more important than your family relationships, re-evaluate your priorities.
I hope that is received as encouragement from one also trying to keep a family together.
” I believe the sealing powers of the temple have stronger chords than we can understand in this life…” I love that statement. I believe in the sealing power. I believe that my husband and I are sealed to each other, even if he now rejects the doctrine. I love him and want to be with him forever. But I also know how important it is to live, love, laugh NOW.
Thank you so much for the warm welcome!! My husband is actually out of town hiking and I was in a rush writing my intro…I just re-read it and realized it sounds rushed. I have loved reading your responses and will post more about our situation under the Support forum later tonight and will try to respond to as much as I can in reply to your kind words. I feel overwhelmingly emotional having found this site. Right now I have to get our children settled for the evening but will write more once they take off for the Land of Nod (hopefully before midnight- they can’t sleep w/their Dad gone). I really look forward to getting to know you all- thank you for the support, and I hope to be a support in return to anyone I can. Cheers! There are some very relevant comments on pinkpatent’s thread, “Trying to Help My Husband”( http://forum.staylds.com/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=368 Quote:This is another one of my absolutely heterodox beliefs, but I personally believe that the core, fundamental, highest command relative to marriage ever given was to “cleave unto her and none else”. In our terms, it is to become one as a couple in all ways. Frankly, I don’t think ANY temple marriage in which the spouses do NOT become one is a celestial marriage – and I believe ANY non-temple marriage in which the spouses truly do become one IS a celestial marriage. The latter simply hasn’t been ratified by God yet (when viewed from a classic Mormon perspective – NOT mine).
Right now, I can’t fathom God tearing apart a couple that has managed to become one simply because one of the partners isn’t totally on board with the religious theology of their time. I personally think those who become Christ-like / godly in this life will have “a multitude of sins” covered by the Atonement – and becoming one as a couple is a key part of that, imo.
So, if it helps your husband to phrase it in that way, go for it.
Also, I HIGHLY recommend watching the movie “What Dreams May Come” – and focusing intently on the part near the end where the husband explains to his wife why he won’t leave her in (literal) Hell (after leaving her in her previous figurative Hell) – why living in Hell with her is better than living in Heaven alone. If you and your husband can see the incredibly deep and profound message I took from that scene . . . I think much, if not all, of your collective angst and concern will vanish – and you can tackle life together with faith that you will remain together eternally simply because you won’t accept anything else. (Fwiw, that’s how I feel about my wife – and ain’t nobody going to split us apart, ’cause we are welding ourselves into one being.)
Welcome! I’m going to look for your other topic… Welcome to the site. My own feeling is that your marital commitment is more real and important than a theoretical afterlife and eternal reward. I think that is what is meant by the BOM when it says we shouldn’t “look beyond the mark.” We focus so much on the possibilities of the eternities, and we forget that we have a life to live right in front of us, and plenty of work to do to become the kind of person we need to become. We’ve committed to love our spouse and to be married to that person in total fidelity. IMO, t can’t be right to try to get off the hook for something like a difference in belief (perhaps for issues of abuse or marital infidelity, but not for differences in belief). On the contrary, that just provides you more opportunities to support and rely on one another, IMO, and to create real intimacy that is not based on an assumption of shared beliefs. What hawk said. Welcome, I look forward to learning more about you.
FWIW I am a strong believer in placing more importance on this life here and now, than on a theoretical afterlife. I know that goes somewhat against the whole “eternal perspective” that the church teaches is so important, but for me personally, this is the only life that I am absolutely certain of.
I also really agree with hawk, and in the past she has given me basically the same advice – to put your marriage first. I guess if I am really honest, that is the main reason I still attend church.
Anyway, welcome. I hope you find some answers in this forum.
I will only add that my sister’s husband was excommunicated a while back, and he has been extremely hostile toward the church at times as a result. However, while she’s considered her options, she really does love him. Her love for him and acceptance of him has also helped him to be more tolerant of her beliefs over time. He’s come to a much better place as a person over time as a result. I doubt he’ll rejoin the church (not that it’s out of the realm of possibility), but his initial anger was really misdirected toward her when it was the church he was upset about. That’s pretty common initially, but when he saw her loyalty to him, he simmered down quite a bit. Regarding your eternal family — one thing I believe firmly is what its says in the BoM, that people are judged according to their knowledge. So, you can count on HF looking at your husband’s inactivity with a wise and loving eye. The scriptures also say that we will acknowledge that his judgements are fair — so, while I don’t have a direct answer — I do see a tremendous amount of hope for you and your husband’s eternal family given the exit clauses Heavenly Father provides Himself with, to allow for mercy later on. And also, if you or your husband belonged in any other Church, there would be no hope of eternal family at all…
SilentDawning wrote:And also, if you or your husband belonged in any other Church, there would be
no hopeof eternal family at all… I know my belief is contrary to what has been taught in the Church about eternal families, but I just cannot accept what you wrote. I believe there is ALWAYS hope, no matter what your religious affiliation. I choose to believe in a loving Heavenly Father who will not separate loved ones. But that’s just my opinion for what it’s worth.
I agree with Kalola – and I believe what she said is taught in “pure Mormonism” like in no other religion. After all, we do vicarious ordinances for ALL.
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