I requested a meeting with SP and a church court

[Anonymous]

Hi everyone,

I don’t post that much these days. But I wanted to let you all know about a recent return from “retirement” in support of John Dehlin’s pending disciplinary council, and Kate Kelly’s excommunication. I sent a letter to my Stake President requesting a meeting and/or disciplinary council. In that two-page letter, I made it clear that I support the questions that Ordain Women is asking, that I support gay marriage and the desperate need to include our LGBT brothers and sisters in our church in a positive way, that I have doubts about some of the fundamental truth claims of the church, and that I have openly published these views.

We met this past Sunday morning for about 40 minutes or so. He did not endorse any of these causes or my views directly. We disagreed slightly on what might be “eternal” and unchanging doctrine, and what isn’t. I brought up that I see things in a more open and progressive way, and that others lean way more in the conservative direction. We talked about how it’s OK to disagree. Overall he was VERY empathetic to the issue of people having problems. The main line in the sand for him was if I was purposely causing people to leave the church (which I do not do); or if I was saying the church is wrong AND I have the new correct answer for everyone (which would be preaching false doctrine). Because I am exploring ideas, asking questions, and not claiming to have the new answers for everyone, it is not apostasy.

I told him that Kate was a better and more faithful member than me. He fell back on the position that she isn’t in his stake so it isn’t his place to judge her on that. He can’t know more than the little bit that is in the news.

He does not agree with me. But he was very compassionate and understanding of why I might see things the way I do. He’s a great guy. I felt welcomed by him, and that he would much rather I was active in church WITH MY VIEWS than not.

My hope and wish is for the church to be more like this. I went in ready for a fight, but I have to tip my hat to being treated like I would want all of you to be treated, everyone else to be treated. The main problem is still consistency. I don’t think most members feel like they can say what I said without serious church and social consequences. I really hope the message of inclusion can be pushed down to the local level (and even change some hearts at the top). I hope we can draw more attention to this, in a positive way. But I am ready to “do what is right, let the consequence follow.”

Anyway, there’s a Washington Post article out about this today. Here’s a link to the developing story:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/folllowing-kelly-excommunication-mormon-dissenters-push-for-disciplinary-hearings/2014/07/09/4b0b5592-0761-11e4-bbf1-cc51275e7f8f_story.html

[Anonymous]

Thanks for sharing that, Brian. It is a very valuable perspective.

[Anonymous]

Thanks for sharing, Brian. I won’t be joining anyone in requesting a DC, but I will say I am pretty confident my SP would be very open – he tolerates me.

[Anonymous]

Thanks

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk

[Anonymous]

Sounds like an overall good experience.

I think over time the experience you had will become more uniform across the church. I’ve heard several conversations initiated by orthodox members with the subject of wondering why so many people are leaving. Don’t take that comment the wrong way… I think some people take delight in spreading rumors that “lots of people are leaving,” like it’s wishful thinking on their part. I don’t take delight in it and I don’t even know whether that’s true. My point is that if lots of people are leaving over differences in belief, etc. then I think we’ll see leaders take action from the top down, translating into training local leaders to present a more unified approach.

If nothing else lots of people leaving will give local leaders lots of practice in dealing with it …and I believe time will show them that love is the absolute best approach.

[Anonymous]

Great post and thank you for sharing. In order to avoid hi-jacking your post, I will post a question in the support forum regarding the consequences of ‘coming out’.

Thanks for this update though. I hope more and more local leaders develop the compassion and understanding to be able to deal with ‘the crazy ones’!

[Anonymous]

Thanks for sharing this, Brian. I confess I was curious. You said:

Quote:

“My hope and wish is for the church to be more like this. I went in ready for a fight, but I have to tip my hat to being treated like I would want all of you to be treated, everyone else to be treated. The main problem is still consistency.”

My guess is that 80% of bishops and SPs would be OK with doubters and OK with those who have the socially progressive views you (and I) have. But that 20% is out there.

[Anonymous]

I think that takes a lot of courage to step up like that. I do think it would mark a person as unsuitable for leadership in the future — at least, in one’s own stake, but it is courageous nonetheless. I personally don’t think I could do it given the fact that my family would not understand what i was doing.

I am glad you SP was understanding. That is good news. However, it will be a long time before I have the trust in our local leadership (whoever they might be) to be truly open about how I feel and why I lost my commitment to the LDS church.

[Anonymous]

I’m reading a bit about the Strangers in Zion group.

There’s a story in the Washington Post. Brian is quoted often.

As is often the case the comments to the article are rather depressing.

[Anonymous]

I appreciate that your SP indicated telling others that they have to leave and that you have the answers is what makes the difference between disagreeing and apostasy. I think that a meeting like that between you and the Sp and Bishop would probably work but I can’t for the life of me see a lively discussion like that going on in a high council meeting. In my stake in Oregon it couldn’t happen in SS, or RS or priesthood meeting, at least not yet.

[Anonymous]

Brian, thanks for sharing your experience. I have recently returned to this site, because of the news over John D. so many things i have read at other sites have left me feeling so dark. It has been refreshing and helpful to come back here and read the many posts here at stay lds. I to, have had a few discussions with understanding Bishops, and Stake Presidents.

[Anonymous]

MesaMom – Thanks for popping by and sharing. We’d love to have you hang around.

[Anonymous]

Thanks for sharing Brian, I am SOOO glad that you had a good experience with your SP. I hope that there is more than 80% like hawkgrl said, but that’s probably an accurate number.

[Author]

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