I should be at church….

[Anonymous]

I am new to this online community. I have joined because I feel I have nowhere else to turn. My faith has been shaken and I need support, but I don’t know where to find it. I would like to share my story, and realize that to some it may not seem like a big deal, but to me it has been very difficult.

I am a 27 year old female born and raised in the church in an area heavily populated with members. Growing up I loved the church and always felt the desire to better myself. I have however been blessed/cursed with an overactive conscience which leads me to feel guilty about about certain things, when others would just let it roll of their backs. I have also struggled with the fact that I never quite feel the way that people tell me I will feel when I recieve ordinances like baptism, (for years I thought my baptism was not done right because I never felt the way my parents and leaders said I would) endownment, and temple marriage. I have never quite felt what other people seem to feel in these instances. I have had many other spiritual experiences, but they have been not grandiose as others sometimes describe them to be.

I served a mission when I was 22 years old. I loved my mission, and I feel it was there I really gained a testimony and felt God’s love for me. It was heartbreaking to come back home. The last night of my mission which was spent in the mission home was a horrible one for me. I was overcome by a sense of guilt. I felt I had not done my best in certain areas, and had made too many mistakes. A pretty awful feeling to have when you have sacrificed a year and a half of your life. I have since tried to forget that experience.

I came home and was involved in church, and the institute program. I dated many different guys, all of which were RM’s. It was hard for me to get older and not be married, as all of my friend’s were married with children already. I tried really hard to do my best and to keep the commandments and do what was expected of me as a return missionary. One day a member of the high council attended my young single adult ward. I knew him from my family’s ward. He sat in on my Sunday School lesson. The next Sunday he returned once again and asked if he could speak with me. We spoke for a few minutes and then he told me he would like to extend a calling to me, and that calling was Institue President. This was a huge shock for me, firstly because I thought only men could be in that position! And also because I would be in charge of an insitute of about 600 young single adults. I was overwhelmed and excited. I took comfort in the fact that the Lord trusted me with this position. I worked really hard, and tried my best in this new position. It helped me to come out of my shell as I can be shy sometimes, and I became aware of the important time of life this was and how many of my fellow young adults needed help. I loved this calling.

A few months later I was given an opportunity to go on a trip to Hawaii with one of my best friend’s. This friend was male, and he worked for an airline. We had a week off of University and we could go on this trip for pretty cheap. I knew there were some underlying romantic feelings between us, but I really wanted to go on this trip, and we still truly believed we were “just friends” and so did everyone else. I told my parents and to my surpise they had no qualms about me going. My mother is quite strict. So we went on this trip, and we had some alone time together and things progressed physically. I knew we went too far together and was quite torn up about it. But i still tryed to enjoy the trip.

When we returned home (we were now officially dating) I suggested to “Rob” that we go and talk to the Bishop. He wasn’t sure we even needed to, but he went along with me to do so as I was just overcome with guilt. I went to see the Bishop and it turns out he already knew about our trip to Hawaii. He didn’t know about this because I told him, but because he had a daughter in the ward who had passed on the gossip. This bothered me. I told him what had happened on the trip, and it seemed he was much more concerned about the location we were in rather than any other detail. This bothered me even more. I had never even volunteered this information to him. Also he other main concern was if I had climaxed. I told him i had, and that was the only thing he was worried about. He told me I couldn’t take the sacrament for a month. He didn’t ask me how I felt, if I was remorseful, how it had been eating away at me. He just gave me my punishment and I left feeling horrible.

Rob also went to see this same Bishop as we were in the same ward, and he had some concerns about how things went as well. About a week later I recieved a phone call from my Bishop saying he needed to speak with me. I asked him if we could get together later that week, and he said he would like to see me in half an hour. It sounded urgent, and when I hung up the phone i felt sick…i had a feeling of what was going to happen. I told Rob if it did I didn’t know how I would stay in the church.

I went to his office and it was my worst case scenario…he told me they were going to release me as institue president. I was absolutely devestated. My heart broke. Heavenly Father had entrusted me with this huge responsibilty and I totally let him down. I was crying in the office and I told my Bishop I didn’t know if I could ever forgive myself. Although I know he was doing his best, he had little to say to comfort me in this time, and I left his office feeling more alone than ever. I felt he didn’t understand how big of a deal this was for me, and that he didn’t really care. I began to wonder if the church was the place for me when it let me down when I made mistakes. I thought I was supposed to be supported through this? Instead I felt nothing. I used to cut occassionaly when i was a teenager, I think to deal with the guilt I so often felt. I hadn’t done it for years, but after that interview I went into the bathroom locked the door and cut myself. I didn’t want to die, I just wanted a release from the emotion, or perhaps to punish myself even further.

I also thought back to a boyfriend I had at 18 years old. He was 23 an |RM and the elders quorum president. We had made some really big mistakes together, basically everything except intercourse. We went to talk to our respective bishops. I was not given much of a consequence i believe due to my age and I was not endowed. Also he was given a slap on the wrist and was allowed to keep his calling. I know individuals who were disfellowshiped for the same thing. This was weighing on my mind heavily. How could the church be so unfair? Why was i treated so harshly when my mistake was already tearing me apart? I didn’t need any other punishment other than my own. I felt i was released just so they could save face because rumours were already going around about me.

This continued to bother me so I went to see my Stake President about it. I needed support and help so I went to him for guidance. He acted like I was the first person to ever make such a mistake. He had known me as an aquantance for some time and asked me how i could have let that happen? How could I have made such a stupid mistake? This was not helpful. I explained to him how I felt I wasn’t being supported, and told him about my boyfriend when i was 18 and what happened. He wanted to know his name..i reluctantly gave it to him wondering why it would matter. He was upset about that happening. He said he understood it was hard for me to be released from such a public calling, but i would get another one eventually. He didn’t get it. It wasn’t the calling, it was how I felt. I left that meeting again feeling no support or love.

My stake pres was right that it was a public calling. I was released quietly without thanks, and i am sure it was obvious to my peers why I was released which was even more humiliating.

A few months went by and Rob proposed, we set a date to be married and were so happy. But I still had all my mistakes weighing on my mind. I went for my interview for our temple marriage and passed. A few days later I called up my new stake president (i had since moved) and told him i needed to come back in. I was again racked with guilt and felt I hadn’t told him everything. He was kind and helped me through it, he helped me to feel worthy.

We got married, and the months following were difficult for me. I still felt guilty. I tried praying, reading scriptures…when that didn’t help I tried harder. But nothing worked, I still felt awful about everything that had happened. So I eventually made a choice, i wasn’t going to feel guilty anymore. Being in the church equalled guilt…why would i want to be a part of that. I stopped praying because I felt no one heard me or was helping take this burden away.It just was not worth it for me anymore. I still went to church but my heart wasn’t in it.

Recently it has all come to a point. I only go to church if I have to, I resent being there sometimes. I feel like the churc

h wasn’t there for me, so what is this point? Heavenly Father wasn’t helping me…so did anyone really care??

I still love the church. I love my husband and I know he is worried about me. But he can’t pull me out of this either. I am holding onto resentments…I know I am. I realize people aren’t perfect, but this has been so hard for me. I can’t seem to get passed it. I don’t know what to do. I have come to my breaking point where it’s either I get over this, or I leave because I cant stand feeling so bad all the time and so angry. I don’t know how to go back to where I was.

Sorry this was so lengthy. It doesn’t include everything but I hope it all makes sense. I realize it doesn’t seem like that big of a deal. But to me it is. I hope I can find your support here.

Thanks for listening.

[Anonymous]

Welcome, Molly. I hope this forum can help in some way.

I have almost no time, but I just want to say that sometimes people have upbringings that are focused on guilting them into obedience – and sometimes people simply have that natural outlook. Some people simply are really, really hard on themselves – and it takes focus and conscious effort to understand. My wife is like that in many ways, so I understand.

This might be difficult to understand at first, but if you still are struggling with having done things to which you’ve confessed and which you aren’t repeating, you need to understand that you are inflicting pain on yourself. It’s not the Church doing it to you, although members of the Church probably contributed to your perspective in your formative years. At this moment, you are doing it to yourself.

I don’t share that in any way as “blaming” you – or to say that it’s your “fault”. I don’t mean that at all. Please understand that. I share it simply to help you understand that you have the power to change it. “The Church” can’t change it; you can.

If talking about it here is enough for you to start to see and accept that, great. If not, you might need to seek professional counseling. Either way, the key is to realize that your reactions appear to be part of who you are and/or how you were raised, so it’s up to you to find a way to change those reactions and realize you can be at peace with regard to those former actions. From my perspective while reading your introduction, you’ve done everything possible EXCEPT forgive yourself – which can the hardest step for some people.

Again, welcome. I look forward to your participation here and to what all of us can learn from you. We’re not experts on lots of things, but we do understand to varying degrees struggling with things as they relate to the Church.

[Anonymous]

One thing that we’re raised with is this feeling that someone has to tell us we’re forgiven. Well, we don’t. You remember your “sins” only with the remembrance that will bring us down to repentance (BoM somewhere) pray and move on from there. We can’t depend on someone else to tell us we’re ok. That’s God, Jesus, and the Holy Ghost’s job. We just have to believe it.

[Anonymous]

Molly — you aren’t the first person to make this kind of mistake. I know first hand that LOTS AND LOTS AND LOTS of people have made the exact same mistake you have. Sexual temptation is one of the biggest temptations facing youth and young adults, and people do succumb to it. Also, the way your stake president reacted that led you to believe you’re the only one on the planet to make such a mistake isn’t something you should hang on to. Whether that was his intention or not, you are part of a large group of people who have been in your position. I know this from sitting in on the Church disciplinary councils and also due to people coming to me and confessing such things even shortly after baptism when I was a missionary (I directed them to their Bishop, but listened and gave whatever counsel I could give anyway).

I too suffer from what my mother called “a guilty conscience”. It used to torment me to death. I would have an acheivement in my life and I’d feel guilty that I was getting the blessings of the achievement for some reason — perhaps the way you felt after your mission when it was over, and you should’ve looked back with a sense of satisfaction and the accomplishments in it.

When I had an achievement, the guilt would totally detract from the achievement. Recently, I spent a little under a thousand dollars on myself on something temporary and definitely a luxury, WITH the permission of my wife and family. I felt guilty as sin about the whole thing. I spoke to my mother about it on the phone and she said “Don’t do a number on yourself again, JUST ENJOY IT”. And that helped. I also feel guilty about some of the perqs in my job, and lately, I’ve been saying to myself “just enjoy it — take it — there may well be times when there are no perqs at all, and there have been times when I’ve had it rough in my employment. Just enjoy it”.

My point is that some positive self-talk like the kind I’ve been giving myself could go a long way to help you counteract the thoughts of guilt that you have. If I was you, I’d focus on the fact that you were given the Institute president job in the first place. This speaks volumes about your ability and commitment. Also, recognize that time will eventually dull the negative aspects of this experience. Try to look at the situation from the perspective of 30 years from now. It won’t be siginificant at all unless you somehow let it knock you off the path of activity.

And most of all, be forgiving of yourself. It’s a skill you can rely on in many situations hence when you try to do things you’ve never done before, and make a mistake, or when you put your foot in your mouth, or when you have an error in judgment. I can’t say I’m perfect at it, but I have to say, being able to forgive oneself is a passport to peace….

[Anonymous]

Molly, you are A-OK. You are OK.

Here’s the Good News according to Tom: Before the world began, you and the Lord saw that there was an opportunity for you to glorify Heaven by taking a stint in this world. You embarked on this experience with the express understanding and agreement that here you would lose your way, forget heaven, forget your fellows, abuse them, and be abused by them. You agreed that despite all this, you would not cry foul, and that in the end you would be glorified with the Lord. Now that you are here your life has indeed gone according to plan, and you are still the same beloved and bold daughter of the Lord. The fun part of the venture was the prospect of entering into the rest of the Lord while still dwelling in the flesh. Nevertheless, it would be profitable, good, and fair if you never rested until the end, and you would be grateful for the ride. You don’t have to prove yourself to the Lord. You don’t have to prove yourself to yourself, and you don’t have to prove yourself to the great heavenly throng. You are free to find and follow the great plan of happiness, wherever and whatever that may be. You and God are on the same team (says Brian).

Feel free to find somebody you can hug, and hug them every half hour for a day.

[Anonymous]

Hi Molly,

I also haven’t had the same experience with ordinances that other people said I would. Maybe there are other people out there that don’t have grandiose experiences and that have similar experiences as you possibly and it’s ok? Can you reflect on your great experiences as a missionary or keep that in mind when you feel bad? Also, many people have never gone on missions or done anything like that. Maybe you can remember that you sacrificed a lot and did a lot more good than any little mistakes you may have made along the way.

I am sorry that you left feeling horrible and worse than you walked in. I can see why you would be very upset after talking with him when he didn’t even ask you or seem to care if you were sorry or not. And it sounds like you felt like he was not loving or caring about the whole thing.

Also, have you ever tried visiting a Christian Church? I remember I used to feel really guilty all the time in the mormon church for things. Little things even. I felt like I was never good enough and after visiting a Christian Church and listening to the music I just felt Gods love for me there for some weird reason. I never felt that way in lds church back then though. It might be helpful to take a break from church and just decide to try it again in a month or two or however long.

I don’t know if any of this helps much because honestly I am struggling a lot too. I hope you can stop feeling so guilty and feel good at church again somehow.

[Anonymous]

Molly,

The part of your story that I find really interesting is how you have been unable to overcome feelings of guilt. That really rings a bell for me because my husband has had similar problems. He found himself feeling guilty about things that everyone else would just let “roll of their back.” He also spent a lot of time in the Bishop’s office confessing even after I told him there was no need. He could not let go of the guilt. It is a horrible way to live.

The only thing that has been able to help him is anti-anxiety medication. We finally came to realize that the guilty feelings were actually a part of some sort of depression that showed itself with feelings of guilt. I did some online research to find out that depression (or anxiety) can manifest itself by guilty feelings. It was getting bad enough that he had suicidal thoughts. With medication he’s able to function pretty darn good. He is currently the bishop in our ward (a very, very sympathetic one I’d say!) and even though he often still feels “unworthy” the overwhelming guilt stays away as long as he takes his medication. He’s now able to see that he wasn’t just always under the influence of Satan to make him feel bad it was his own mind that was messing him up!

I’m not sure if this could be the case with you but it maybe something you want to research and find out if you could be helped in a similar way. Feeling guilty after you have gone through the repentance process is not right!

[Anonymous]

Hi Molly. Welcome to the forum, and I hope you find some support here. You may feel alone, and you may feel guilty like you don’t measure up and others have it all figured out but you are alone, but that is not the case. There are billions and billions of souls going through this mortal experience, so the odds really are quite good what you are going through is pretty similar to what so many others go through. You need to allow yourself to not be perfect…and that is perfectly OK to do!

I loved the way you expressed that despite your tough times and feelings, there are so many things about the church you love. It would be a shame to throw all that away. I went through a tough time, but felt I wanted to keep those things about the church that are precious to me, and just work on the few things I was struggling with. It was a good thing for me. I feel much more confident now about myself, and much less worried, guilty, or insecure…and I can put what others do and say in perspective to what I think is right for me. I feel closer to God because of it.

Since the burden of guilt is something you’ve struggled with for so long, that should be what you focus on (in my opinion) while clinging to the other things that you love about the gospel. Guilt can be something good for us to help guide our actions and avoid repeating mistakes, but it should not be the emotion that dominates our life…the Savior did not teach, “You should feel guilty you’re not as perfect as I am”.

The story of the lady caught in adultery brought before the Lord is a great example of what he taught…”Go and sin no more” (after he reprimanded the others for being judgmental … see? everyone has something to work on!). He showed how He views it when we make mistakes – ask forgiveness and be done with it, learn from it, resolve to do something different and grow from it. That’s all He cares about…are you growing. Don’t limit your growth because you hang on to guilt, and don’t play the “I should’ve” or “I could’ve” destructive and unproductive mind games. Yesterday is in the past, tomorrow is the future, live in the present and make today your best.

Have you ever read “Believing Christ” from Stephen E Robinson? I recommend that. It is a good approach to Faith in Christ for reducing our guilt and realizing what Christ really taught.

In the past, I have been racked with fears and guilt, and I have also found studying Buddhism to really enhance my understanding of myself, and peace, and my beliefs in the gospel.

Don’t worry about what others experience in their spiritual journey or try to compare theirs to yours… yours is yours alone and is sufficient for you to find peace and happiness as you learn from experiences in this world. We are here to support you, keep sharing your feelings as much as you wish, and know that you are not alone in these feelings you have and there is a way to get through it. I’m certain of that. Happy prayers and best wishes to you!

[Anonymous]

Think seriously about what “observant” shared. Many moderate cases of depression and anxiety manifest themselves in excessive feelings of guilt. It certianly would be worth investigating, imo. (and, as I’ve said at many sites, medication properly used should be seen as a wonderful gift and blessing – not stigmatized in any way)

[Anonymous]

Molly,

Welcome to the forum.

Old-Timer wrote:

Think seriously about what “observant” shared. Many moderate cases of depression and anxiety manifest themselves in excessive feelings of guilt. It certainly would be worth investigating, imo. (and, as I’ve said at many sites, medication properly used should be seen as a wonderful gift and blessing – not stigmatized in any way)

I agree completely with Ray and Observant.

I would also add, that talk therapy with a professional therapist could be very helpful. Shop around and find one that works for you. The church can recommend one for you but with your feelings it could work better to find a therapist outside the church. There are pros and cons to both a Mormon/ non-Mormon therapist. I think it is most important to find someone who works well with you and you feel comfortable with. I know that this has helped several of my loved ones that have dealt with difficulties.

Also, I would like to recommend a book that helped change my life. It is by Cheryl Carson titled “Forgiveness: The Healing Gift We Give Ourselves” A lot of the book is about forgiving others but it also discusses the importance of forgiving ourselves. I have learned that feelings and believes only have as much power as I give them.

Again, welcome and I hope you can find some help here and peace your life.

[Anonymous]

Such great advice here. I especially wanted to echo the advice of Ray, Observant and Heber13’s book recommendation, Believing Christ.

Guilt is fine up to a point – it helps us correct behaviors we need to correct. But what you are describing is unhealthy guilt. Church discipline is very inconsistent in these matters. Bishops and SPs are told to follow the Spirit, but they also use their own human filters. Some of them are harsher than others, as a result. And to some extent that can be OK. Some people are prone to view forgiveness as permission to do whatever they want. Clearly, that’s not you. You have been forgiven, and you just can’t forgive yourself. You’ve got a negative talk track in your head despite having a wonderful husband and normally positive feelings about the church even though you’ve been let down. You have to replace that negative self-talk with what is useful. Guilt is only good so long as it is useful. The guilt you are describing isn’t useful or productive.

I often think of the story (whether it’s true or not I don’t know) of an 80-year old woman who goes to confess to her bishop that before she was married she committed a sexual transgression, and since then she has lived her life and fulfilled her callings, and been a faithful wife, and she asks what she needs to do. He says she’s already done everything she needed to do by being so faithful. Just remember, you’re only 27! What would your 80-year old self say to you? She would tell you how fortunate you are and to forgive yourself already and start enjoying your life again!

[Anonymous]

I want to thank everyone so much for their comments and support. It it nice to know that I’m not alone in this.

Thank you for the book recommendation. Believing Christ has actually been sitting on my bookshelf unread…maybe it is time to pick it up.

I think a lot of my issue is feeling guilt over what I did, but also a big part of it is feeling resentful towards the priesthood leaders involved. It makes it hard to trust anyone in the church after this occurred.I have been holding onto this for a couple years and have not been able to let it go. Have others been in a similar situation? And how did you deal with it?

Mainly I just wanted to thank everyone again for their kind words, I cannot believe how supported and loved I feel.

Thank you!

[Anonymous]

I’m a little late jumping in, sorry. I was travelling this weekend.

molly wrote:

Thank you for the book recommendation. Believing Christ has actually been sitting on my bookshelf unread…maybe it is time to pick it up.

Yes! That book is right up your alley. I highly recommend it, especially for what you are talking about.

I can’t add much to all the other great advice. The overwhelming impression I had reading your story though is this — leaving the Church won’t solve your problem. It will follow you right on out the door.

You really need to find some way of letting it go. The conflict is inside your heart. Sure, you had a lousy Bishop. But you don’t seem to be connecting with the idea of forgiveness and atonement. You sound very perfectionist too, which is common among us here.

[Anonymous]

I have suffered from perfectionism as well. One comment here that Euheremus, a member of this site made, was that you have to look at the mistake as something you did ‘in that situation’. It was a one-time mistake, and doesn’t necessarily have to be something which defines your character forever.

[Anonymous]

SilentDawning wrote:

I have suffered from perfectionism as well. One comment here that Euheremus, a member of this site made, was that you have to look at the mistake as something you did ‘in that situation’. It was a one-time mistake, and doesn’t necessarily have to be something which defines your character forever.

That made me think of this beautiful statement from one of my favorite poets.

“Your identity is not equivalent to your biography. There is a place in you where you have never been wounded, where there’s a seamlessness in you, and where there is a confidence and tranquility in you, and I think the intention of prayer and spirituality and love is now and again to visit that inner kind of sanctuary.”

-Poet & Philosopher John O’Donohue, Interview with Krista Tippett on Speaking of Faith, “Inner Landscape of Beauty” Feb 8, 2008

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