- This topic is empty.
-
Posts
-
The Missionaries were over for dinner & one of the missionaries talked about his father’s conversion story. His father was influenced by a teacher to investigate the church. He took the lessions & was baptized.
Before the baptism, his teacher gave him a quotation that I’ve heard before but can’t find now.
The quote I’m sure isn’t complete or exactly accurate. I’m wondering if any of you know where I can find it.
It goes something like this…
Quote:It is better if a man were never born then to accept the gospel and then fall away.
I asked the missionary for the basis of the quote but, he didn’t know either.
Does this sound familiar to anyone?
Where can I find it?
Do you think it’s true?
Always curious!
Mike from Milton.
As presented, I think that scripture can be found in Satan’s Guide to Derailing Mormons. Just kidding – I’ve never heard that one. And I’m pretty sure it’s false — in the long run. But I’m glad you’re looking for it so we can explore what was really meant, or if the scripture exists at all.
There is one scripture in the BoM that says when people are once enlightened by the gospel, and fall away, they become more hardened. However, I think this too is an overgeneralization — one man’s conclusion after observing one group who fell away and adopted a nasty culture as a result.
Mike wrote:It goes something like this…
Quote:It is better if a man were never born then to accept the gospel and then fall away.
I asked the missionary for the basis of the quote but, he didn’t know either.Does this sound familiar to anyone?
Where can I find it?
it is in the book of mormon.3 Nephi 28:34-35 wrote:And wo be unto him that will not hearken unto the words of Jesus, and also to them whom he hath chosen and sent among them; for whoso receiveth not the words of Jesus and the words of those whom he hath sent receiveth not him; and therefore he will not receive them at the last day;
And it would be better for them if they had not been born. For do ye suppose that ye can get rid of the justice of an offended God, who hath been trampled under feet of men, that thereby salvation might come?
i guess this a pretty strong standard: not only do you you need to accept jesus’ words, but also the words of whom he hath sent. hey…the 14 fundamentals…I think the quote is wrong, and I think the Book of Mormon passage was written by a man who had seen the destruction of his people and wanted to make a point to those who would come later. Also, we can’t have it both ways. If everyone who “kept their first estate” is better off in the end than before they were born (except the sons of perdition – and maybe even them in some constructs), we can’t turn around later and draw the lines much more restrictively. The only way the quote makes sense is to narrow it strictly to those who essentially look God in the eye and throw their fists. I could accept that, but it’s not what the quote implies – so I’m back to thinking it simply is badly mistaken.
Old-Timer wrote:I think the quote is wrong, and I think the Book of Mormon passage was written by a man who had seen the destruction of his people and wanted to make a point to those who would come later.
Also, we can’t have it both ways. If everyone who “kept their first estate” is better off in the end than before they were born (except the sons of perdition – and maybe even them in some constructs), we can’t turn around later and draw the lines much more restrictively. The only way the quote makes sense is to narrow it strictly to those who essentially look God in the eye and throw their fists. I could accept that, but it’s not what the quote implies – so I’m back to thinking it simply is badly mistaken.
of COURSE it is wrong, and bad doctrine. the founders of the church were interested in creating a system of control, and such proof texts create the right type of lock-in. “if you don’t become one of my spiritual wives, you are rejecting the one who the lord has sent and it would be be better for you and your family if you were never born.”never mind that these proof-texts get quoted out of context, as in the case of the missionary’s father…
with respect, ray, i think we are trying to make sense here of something that defies logic. i am not saying that the plan of salvation is false, it is just that there isnt enough data to sort out how it all would work. if we apply the iron rod paradigm that all scripture is true, clear, and gods words, we will go nuts on the logical inconsistencies. if on the other hand, we apply the liahona paradigm, that all scripture is given by inspiration through the minds and hearts of well meaning but flawed men, then it makes a lot more sense.
With respect, wayfarer, that’s exactly how I see it. 
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.