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I feel like im posting alot right now. I just had something happen today that i feel i need to talk about. Its the people at my job again. Today it was accually one person. I was talking to her and 3 others at our lunch. I was telling her about a problem I was having with my daughters school. Its a long story really but she accused me of judging the people at the school. None of the other people agreed wirh her. In fact she told me i was treating the authority at the school like i felt they were treating my daughter. I said to her that these people at the school are adults and all the others laughed in aggrement that the people at the school dont need to treat my daughter the way they are. This co worker ended up telling me if i do what iI am doing ( in not so many words) I wont make it to the celestial Kingdom.
It was very clear that she is an orthadox member of the church and goes by the book. I get it. i used to believe that way. Not anymore. I get the feeling she doesnt believe in standing up for what she believes. Or at least she didnt want me to do that. I felt judged by her.
Thankfully lunch was over so i walked away and she didnt talk to me for quite some time. I got the feeling she thought i was mad at her. Nope i wasnt. To her surprise the next thing i said was something very kind.
Boy was that hard. Really it just makes me sad that she believes that a person wont make it to the celestial kingdom if they make a little mistake. Thats what I feel my daughter did. This is hard to explain. I hope its coming accross the way i want it to. I just feel sad for this lady.
We have a very works based system. I find it interesting how we transform not works concepts into works based concepts. Grace is the “enabling power” that helps us to do the required work. Love of God and our fellows motivates us to strict obedience for ourselves and setting the same high standards for others (to do otherwise would just promote mediocrity and that would not be loving). The idea of the 3 kingdoms came about because it was thought that because there are different levels of works and efforts – there must also be different levels of reward. People are going to people – Mormons just have a slightly different spin to it.
One of the coping mechanisms that I have developed to StayLDS after a faith crisis is to diversify my support networks and friendship groups. I am still friendly with ward members and most of my family and extended family are still LDS – but overall, I have reduced the footprint of the LDS organizational church in my social life.
I am human. I need acceptance and validation. I know that I am not going to get it at church. So I manage my expectations and set up processes to feel acepted and validated outside of church.
Thank you Roy. It is so interesting because over the last while i have been once in a while about my chuldhood and going to church. Most of the time i didnt feel like i fit in. My classmates tried to include me at times. I think it was mostly leaders though. I thought it was because of my upbringing (and maybe it still is) I’ve mentioned before that i came from a disfunctional home life and still believe that was a part of my problems. Although some of the disfunction could be church related. When i changed to a singles ward when i was a young adult i enjoyed the people there more. So i guess i would say i got along with them felt a part of the ward.
I will tell you though after my mission i went to college and two of my friends were not members. I still associated with members but was close to the other two. There were times in big groups of members i didnt always feel comfortable. It might have been other issues back then. Im not surre.
I will tell you though the co worker that stood up for me at lunch today the most I think is not a member or inactive. She was so validating to me. I just need to remember to not talk about certain things during lunch so the orthadox member isnt a part of it. Like you said Roy i can still be friendly though.
Yes, much of human interaction is figuring out what you can say to whom. For orthodox members there is an easy short cut. When talking to other orthodox members and saying things that are faith promoting – you can expect validation, understanding, belonging and a large amount of shared experiences as reference points. It gets much more complicated when everyone you meet is a
:::Roy wrote:
It gets much more complicated when everyone you meet is a:::
It is fun (ok mildly fun) to watch people become unnerved when you respectfully point out that every one is a
::
There is a particular personality type that results in the kind of judgmental orthodoxy you described in your co-worker. Most members I know aren’t that extreme. One gentleman I know, however, is very much that way. He found out a co-worker (who was not active) was living with her boyfriend and lectured her about how she was sinning and the consequences she would most likely experience. The reason I know is that he rather proudly brought it up in a priesthood meeting one time. He also seemed a bit baffled when he reported that the woman didn’t appreciate it much. I think most people in the class (orthodox or not so much) thought the same thing “Why don’t you MYOB!” The thing is, he’s actually a really good guy who takes care of his invalid wife, helps his neighbors, and works hard to fulfill his calling. But there’s something about our difficult and confusing world that moves some people into the kind black and white thinking that can result in such judgmental behavior. I guess its comforting to believe the world is simple. Thanks Gerald for sharing your experience. I did feel like she had the black and white thinking when it came to my problem i was talking about. This is where the parable of Jesus and the woman who has committed adultery comes into play. I get a kick out of people who say this stuff. The reality is only Christ knows what is in our hearts. Good on you for remaining civil. That takes lots of courage. I know how you feel. I often collide with Orthodox members of the church as well.
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