- This topic is empty.
-
Posts
-
Some of you know I felt a hole in my spirit when I felt I couldn’t serve at church any longer. I then turned to community service and put in a lot of time. It was pure service, and at times I paid to do it. One conversation with a Bishopric member went well after the Bishop sort of accused me of being a benchwarmer at church. I told the Bpric member about all I am doing, and he at least seemed understanding there wasn’t a lot of time left over for church.
But two other people — a Ward leader with whom I have a lot in common and a close friend, both indicated that community service is no proxy for church service. For the Ward leader, it came about when I indicated that I felt that during this season, my time needed to be focused in the community for the good of my career, and my personal growth; I had stopped growing/progressing in church service. I still wanted to be involved and serving in some capacity, but not full tilt as I have done in decades passed.
She disagreed, and I indicated that I’ve noticed that we don’t tend to value community service (particularly if it appears to interefere with church service) — and she nodded her head.
The other person, a friend, indicated that I had “set my sights on the world”, and expressed disapproval. I indicated that service is to humanity, not just the church, and that there are conference talks extolling the value of community service. He was immoveable.
It seems that the local leaders really and the TBM’s I spoke to only care that you are available to help the church achieve it’s goals. Other forms of service are invalid.
Comments on that?
“Inasmuch as he have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me.” SilentDawning wrote:It seems that the local leaders really and the TBM’s I spoke to only care that you are available to help the church achieve it’s goals. Other forms of service are invalid.
I’m sure it makes you feel that way. It is just because they are on Team Mormon. Service to other teams is not about the service, but about the loyalty to the tribe. That may be myopic, but I don’t know if you can expect it to be different unless you’ve spent the time with them that they truly understand you (which sounds exhausting). On the other hand, showing up at all meetings, and doing little that really impacts the community, will garner you accolades (which sounds hollow).
Some people are busy serving in the Church. It probably sounds to them like you are criticizing or devaluing what they are doing – like you are criticizing them for not serving like you are serving, in and out of the Church. Thus, they probably are defending themselves from perceived attacks. I understand that reaction completely, even though it is incorrect in this case. Frankly, as your friend, I think you need to work on letting go of this topic with people at church. That is on you, completely, not them. For people who are busy with real service (and things done at church for others is real service), even implying that they aren’t doing enough or that their priorities are messed up is a losing proposition. So, let it go.
I also would suggest you work on reframing your community service in ways that they might accept. You might say something like:
Quote:I still want to help the Church and build up the kingdom of God on Earth, but I also want to help establish Zion in our community. I’m trying to find the balance that works for me – and, right now, I have felt strong impressions that I need to do as much as I can in the community and still do something in the Church. I appreciate everything you are doing in the Church, and my balance might change in the future. Right now, this feels right for me.
First…I never framed it in a way that was threatening to them. For the bpric member it was a good conversation . He seemed to understand and appreciate it all. With my friend it was a mistake. Time to drop it as it was just a convo among friends. He is in a different country. For the local leader it was cuz she asked me what I wanted to do in the church. She was trying to see how i might serve in her auxiliary….at that point I shared. I guess this is another issue on which I must remain silent at church. It doesn’t seem to get easier. Sent from my XT1080 using Tapatalk
I do like your phraseology though ray except for the part about building up Zion…for me it really does not have to be about the church all the time and I see Zion as a church construct in its traditionally used meaning Sent from my XT1080 using Tapatalk
SilentDawning wrote:…for me it really does not have to be about the church all the time…
That’s cool. I agree with you. I just doubt we’ll ever get that from those at church, especially the 10%ers…you know…those 10% of the ward that do 90% of the work. In their heads…they’re building Zion literally. Let them have that vision. It makes them feel good.
I think Ray’s phrasing is helpful to assure them, even if in reality there will never be an understanding that there is life outside the church. To them, the church is the gospel, which is reality, which is eternally the way things must be. To them…service in the community is nice, after you’ve done your home teaching, or you have time as an added bonus to the true and living service…which is in church callings. It’s stage 3. When they say stuff to ya…you gotta tell yourself it is coming from Stage 3…they don’t understand Stage 4 or 5. You can’t expect them to, nor need them to reassure you that stage 4 or 5 is OK.
Service in the church is your duty. Outside the church is “nice”. It’s just how they see it.
This seems like a good place to repeat what one bishop said to me. He had called DW and I into his office because we were attending the other ward (rather than the ward where we were zoned). One of the rumors floating around was that we had changed wards to free up our mornings to attend other Christian churches. We explained to him that while we do “participate” in programs hosted by other churches we only “attend” the LDS church. I explain it to our non-LDS friends by saying that the LDS church is our “home church.” He told me that from his perspective there is so much to do in the LDS church that one might never have any time left over to participate elsewhere.
I agree with Heber that to him, it was probably a question of loyalty and that even if what I am doing at these churches is good (building bridges and all that) – I must be neglecting the better option of completely dedicating my time and efforts more exclusively to LDS causes.
I also agree with Ray that trying to explain it to people in a way that they would validate your choices is a tough proposition. I suppose I actively avoid getting into these types of discussions with people.
SilentDawning wrote:For the local leader it was cuz she asked me what I wanted to do in the church. She was trying to see how i might serve in her auxiliary….at that point I shared. I guess this is another issue on which I must remain silent at church. It doesn’t seem to get easier.
More recently, due to conflicts in the church/work schedule DW and I are being released from our calling of team teaching in the primary. I was looking forward to a break from having a calling. The same counselor that offered our release also extended 2 new callings. DW feels good about her calling. I am less excited about mine as the assistant scout/mutual activity leader for the 11 year old scouts. It is not that it is terribly demanding. We have 1 or possibly 2 boys attending and they have been meeting with the other wards to get a bigger group. Having 2 dedicated leaders from our ward for this age group might be a little overkill. I imagine ward/priesthood counsel brainstorming what assignment they could come up to give me to keep me connected and engaged in the church for my own good when I was of the mindset that I had just done my contribution in the primary and was looking forward to taking the next year off.
I suppose this is part of a larger issue that the church is generally not very accepting/accomodating of those that wish to stayLDS on their own terms.
It’s funny that for a church that prides itself for teaching its members that all of us can receive revelation for the truthfulness of the gospel, the church, and all truths outside of the church that too often the leadership teaches the truths like many other churches tend to teach them is if the things that’s taught is all true. It cannot be false. And if they are true, then humble yourself to get the witness that they are, or if you don’t you’ll lose your eternal salvation. Roy wrote:I suppose this is part of the larger issue the the church is generally not very accepting/accomodating of those that wish to stayLDS on their own terms.
Well said, Roy.
At some point, the journey is the personal one. You can grow by realizing you are gonna do what you think is right, and not go to church for affirmation from others who are not on your journey. You just go, or don’t go. But Ray said some good things about how you can try to speak like the tribe if you want to make that effort so others don’t need to worry.
I have seen…honestly…that going to church is about validating the correlated message to members. It is less about preaching to visitors or less active members or about members on fringes with differing beliefs. If the community service fits into their ward script or plans somehow…they’ll be all over it. Otherwise, they aren’t seeking to validate others. They are affirming their views to hammer it home and unify the ward. It’s not a bad thing.
I gave a talk about service a few months ago and tried to focus part of it on service outside the church. I found great value in the February 1999 Ensign. https://www.lds.org/ensign/1999/02?lang=enghttps://www.lds.org/ensign/1999/02?lang=eng” class=”bbcode_url”> Interesting, DJ. And quoting Ensign articles is excellent! So…do you think it was approached as community involvement
in addition tochurch service, or instead of church callings and still equally valid? I agree with all of this. I guess part of me felt I could gain acceptance within the LDS church by pointing to my community service efforts. That people would accept those as a valid alternative to church service. Not so. The small sample I have taken shows me that 66% of the dedicated, TBM people reject the notion that community service is a valid form of service over the long-term. 1/3 of this sample (bpric member) was neutral on it, or perhaps didn’t share their true feelings. Perhaps part of me thought I could not follow the party line in church of never saying no to a calling, while still receiving validation and respect for service to humanity. Not so. There was a close brush with success in this arena when the Stake Public Communications person was planning to call me about some kind of recognition in papers or the church news but that never happened. Perhaps they saw my unorthodoxy and decided I wasn’t a good example of a Mormon to be worthy of such recognition (I won a community service award for my efforts last year.
I do like the idea of appealing to personal revelation, though, as Ray suggested.
I think an appeal to the articles of GA’s on community service also can help justify it somewhat. But only in a defensive mode — not in a defensive attitudinal way (like getting your back up when someone challenges you) — but when someone is proactive in calling me out about my lack of church commitment — have prepared answers.
Heber13 wrote:So…do you think it was approached as community involvement
in addition tochurch service, or instead of church callings and still equally valid? I think this could work better. Accept a small calling in the Ward, like being a secretary in an auxiliary, or Sunday School President’s counselor, or maybe just putting on activities for youth, or the Ward — something tiny, while putting out big effort in the community. But I’m not holding my breath. I’m already kind of doing that right now in the Ward I attend, and I’m still getting this push back.
And one thing that bothers me is that the post above implies that a key component of the service’s value is in its potential for missionary work. I firmly believe it doesn’t have to be about the church all the time. That pure service is good for its own sake, and sometimes, for the sake of one’s growth and well-being. It can also help with church burnout, as a change can be as good as a rest.
Heber13 wrote:Interesting, DJ. And quoting Ensign articles is excellent!
So…do you think it was approached as community involvement
in addition tochurch service, or instead of church callings and still equally valid? I didn’t reread them, but as I recall the articles aren’t about church service at all – they are about making our communities better places through service. It might be implied that church service is important, but that wasn’t the central message of the articles. One of them is written by a Seventy (at the time) and it was actually a speech given to a group of municipal leaders.
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.