Is belief a choice? Also, seriously? No really, seriously?

[Anonymous]

nibbler wrote:

Thanks for the thoughts.

I did mention that I thought it was a loose connection at best. I only found it interesting that it was the first result in a google search and it just so happened to be by the same GA. More coincidental.

I’ll add Niel Andersen’s Faith Is Not by Chance, but by Choice as additional food for thought. It’s another talk that’s only semi-related but it introduces the phrase into our culture, similar to how DFU’s talk was reduced down to “doubt your doubts.” The section on ‘Honest Questions’ is probably more pertinent.

I think the argument being made is that choosing to be in an environment created by the “faithless and the unfaithful” weakens faith/belief and earlier sections imply that continued obedience can make faith/belief grow stronger.

nibbler, I finally got around to reading NLA’s talk you referenced (a daunting task for me, since he’s in the bottom two of the Q12 for me). It’s funny, because, again, he says, “faith is a choice” but aside from that quip, the message of his talk is actually, “the choices you make affect your faith” (my words). His words:

Quote:

How we live our lives increases or diminishes our faith. Prayer, obedience, honesty, purity of thought and deed, and unselfishness increase faith. Without these, faith diminishes.

I agree with that. But I don’t think that is the same as saying “faith is a choice”. I feel that in my case, I’ve lived my life in a way that would have re-grown my faith, had there been something to believe in. If there is a God, he’s been awfully stingy with helping me foster my much-desired belief.

[Anonymous]

I could see there being a circular relationship. Faith is a choice, and how you choose impacts your faith, and based on the faith you choose, it impacts what choices you make, and these choices impact if faith grows or diminishes…and round and round.

Maybe there are also choices to HAVE faith, but also what you choose to have faith in will impact if those choices grow the seed of faith or diminish it.

Until one day, even though you thought you were obeying the church totally in faith, life pushes you to a faith crisis because choices were made to obey on a surface level, but not down deep spiritually enough…and in order for faith to grow further you have to choose which items in the buffet are good for you and which are not.

Faith is a choice. But how and what we choose leads to increase faith in truth or diminished faith.

[Anonymous]

My experience in the church was that faith is a choice. Also that I could pat myself on the back for making the right choices all the while redoubling my efforts that I might never start down the slippery path of wrong choices. I understood that happiness was a choice.

I quoted victor Frankl in saying that holocaust victims had the choice on how to respond to their environment. The church teaches that the conditions of our earthly estate are determined by the choices made in the premortal realm. This teaching has been used in the past to say that black or handicapped or people born into distant lands must have not made the best choices. This teaching is used still today to say that the youth of the church at this moment made the best and most valiant choices.

Paul says, “Salvation is not a reward for the good things we have done, so none of us can boast about it.” This became enshrined in Pauline Protestant Christianity. I speculate that the LDS focus on works was in part a foil to and rejection of a grace heavy (and Calvinistic predetermination) religious environment.

Is religious belief a choice? Yes, I believe it is in the same sense that choosing how long you will live is a choice. Much has been said and written about the things that can be done to live healthier and longer lives. Much of that is true and yet none of it is a guarantee against death. Proper nutrition, sanitation, vaccine use, and other preventative medical care are very effective … yet how many of heavenly father’s children are not in a position to choose these things? Conversely, there are individuals with genetic disorders or other difficulties that will severely restrict their life span no matter what they do.

[Anonymous]

Roy wrote:

Proper nutrition, sanitation, vaccine use, and other preventative medical care are very effective … yet how many of heavenly father’s children are not in a position to choose these things? Conversely, there are individuals with genetic disorders or other difficulties that will severely restrict their life span no matter what they do.

Good analogy.

Also…despite genetics…there is something to be said for randomness of it all too. The best athletes in the top levels of fitness also wear out their bodies, and age poorly. I know many runners who stay fit with regular workouts…but also have ongoing problems with knees and joints and such. Even if it is not genetic…one set of choices seem to lead to additional problems. I don’t think there is a “no suffering” option, despite choices or faith.

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