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Hi everyone, I’m still in the early phases of my faith crisis, and I’m glad I’m stumbled across this forum. Until now I thought I was a rare case, I didn’t think people like me ‘lost their testimony’ or ‘went apostate’. I was born and raised in the church, always active, extremely literalistic in my reading of the scriptures and took everything the General Authorities said as gospel truth, served a mission, graduated from one of the church’s universities, etc. But then my last semester in college I started having real doubts. I had confronted most of the big historical issues on my mission and was able to deal with them fine, but the last couple years I have been studying books from other religions, like the Quran, Baghavadgita, and the Tao Te Ching. I was also becoming more well-read in general, and over time I think it just came to the point that black-and-white thinking didn’t work for me anymore. I begin seeing that all religions have good principles mixed with the imperfections of human nature. It was really hard for me to accept the idea of a one-true-church. From there it has escalated into a full crisis mode, where I’m not even sure what I believe on fundamental issues like who/what God really is. It has been a real internal battle for me. Because the church has been so much a part of my identity the idea of completely leaving really scares me, but I also find it uncomfortable to sit through church meetings when I simply don’t believe everything anymore. My username makes reference to Plato’s analogy of the cave. (There are enough intellectuals here that reference hopefully won’t be entirely wasted). In a lot of ways I wish I could go back to living the way I did and thinking the way I did in the metaphorical cave, but after you’ve left you simply can’t return and see things with the same eyes. Anyway, I’m just happy to know that I’m not the only experiencing what I am.
Welcome. I can relate to your journey in many ways. leavingthecave25 wrote:In a lot of ways I wish I could go back to living the way I did and thinking the way I did in the metaphorical cave, but after you’ve left you simply can’t return and see things with the same eyes.
Nope. Can’t go back. Can’t push the toothpaste back into the tube once it gets squeezed out. Only way out is straight on through the dark tunnel. Keep pushing forward toward that point of light. It gets bigger and bigger until finally you pop on out to the other side. You will figure it out (what is best for you).
leavingthecave25 wrote:Anyway, I’m just happy to know that I’m not the only experiencing what I am.
You’re not the only one. You just joined a group of thousands and thousands and thousands — those living deep underground in Zion, under the ashes and ruins of what was once our “real” world (Matrix reference).
welcome. I’ve read the Qur’an twice, and don’t really see the need of returning to it. Too much like the old testament for my taste.
The Lao Tzu (Tao Te Ching) is entirely another matter: I have 60 different translations in my library, and have learned classical chinese well enough to read it in the original. Fantastic work. This has been my passion for about 20 years.
I lived in India for the past two years and have a deep appreciation for the Bhagavad Gita, and have learned enough sanskrit to get through that. These are fantastic works.
I appreciate your path — learning that the literal model of belief in the church doesn’t work. But in 2 Ne 29, JS has nephi revealing that god would speak to all the nations of the earth, and they would write it. This he has being said about 580 BCE, right during the Axial age, when Lao Tzu, Buddha, Confucius, and many other sages around the world were writing about the same things. Interesting, to be sure.
One thing I appreciate in JS was he was willing to be syncretic — that is, he adopted beliefs from a wide variety of religions and thought systems into the church. This has caused problems for some, as the origins of the temple endowment in Freemasonry are rather obvious. But what was the problem with this? If truth is revealed to the heart and mind of those who listen to the spirit, then being able to re-assemble the gospel, that is, ‘all truth’, requires an eye to find it anywhere it may be found. Since the time of Joseph Smith, that syncretism has taken a back seat to orthodoxy — a think which God condemned in the first vision.
So welcome to this board!
Leavingthecave, thank you for your introduction. Very interesting. You defined yourself as
Quote:…’lost their testimony’ or ‘went apostate’
May I suggest that it’s too early to tell.Or maybe your just evolving?
Give it some time.
Welcome to the Group.
Mike from Milton.
Welcome, Cave. I had a similar experience to what you describe on my mission. We met the most wonderful man who invited us in to chat. He knew who we were – he’d lived in the US for several years (I served in a mission where the church was brand new, and 90% of people had never heard of us) and had already had several missionary discussions in Colorado. He was back in the old country again, and struggling with the lack of a church support structure. He’d converted to Seventh Day Adventism in the US. He proceeded to tell us the story of his conversion, including his dabbling in the LDS Church before his witness of Adventism’s truthfulness. To hear him bear his testimony of Adventism — you could have just as easily substituted “Mormonism” in his testimony, and it would have sounded like the most sweet, humble testimony of our church. This in itself was very confusing to me … I thought there was only “one true church.” But what made it even more confusing … the Holy Spirit’s presence was palpably manifest as we both bore testimony to each other with firm conviction. I wasn’t testifying of Mormonism, and he wasn’t testifying of Adventism – we were both testifying of the Gospel of Christ. There was nothing adversarial at all about it – he was sharing with us, and we were sharing with him. It was one of the most sublime moments of my life. We invited him to listen to the missionary discussions again; he politely declined, although he invited us to come back any time to talk. That episode caused me a lot of soul-searching about the “one true church” claim. I brought this up with my mission president, who was (is) a lovely man. He gently explained to me that the LDS claim to be the one true church did not, necessarily, demand that all other churches be patently false. He asked me whether I believed the HG would testify of truth, regardless of the setting. I agreed. He then asked, “well, if this gentleman sat in an Adventist church on a Saturday morning and heard a sermon on the Atonement and the role of Christ as Redeemer, why should he not receive a witness that this message is true?”
I’ve come to know that God loves all his children, and he gives them all directions and guidance. There are truthes of the Gospel in many of the religions and philosophies of the world, and when we hear those truths, we connect with that aspect of God. It seems like you’ve experienced that, too, Cave.
Best wishes on your journey – the church is definitely richer for having thinkers like you. I hope you can find a place in the church to stay.
If everyone leaves who is different, the Church is much poorer. Welcome. I hope your participation here helps you find a joyful, peaceful way to stay and make the Church more of what I believe Zion really is – a union of love, not of exactly the same thinking.
Those are some great thoughts kumahito. Leaving thecave, welcome to the group. You are alone with all the rest of us, all together!
:thumbup: I look forward to learning from your posts.Thanks everyone for the warm welcome! Being on the forum the lat few days has already started to help me to have a more positive outlook on working through everything. I’m looking forward to getting to know everyone and hearing their insights. Welcome! We need your insights too!
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