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Yup. Well said, Brian. I wrote a pretty strongly-worded comment to Jeff on the Adam and Eve thread after he insulted everyone who believes in evolution. I edited it greatly after cwald sent me the following PM: Quote:We can handle this guy and know that he is an SP or something. I hope we don’t chase him away, and perhaps if he stays around he will understand what’s going on in the church and make some changes in his sphere of influence.
Anyway, what i am saying is I will take some insults from the guy (an SP) and will be “patient”, if it will do any good for those folks in his stake. This is special case IMO.
good luck
I want all of you to see cwald’s message, since I think it shows his heart so well. This can be a bumpy road, but we’ve done some good with cwald – and that alone makes it all worthwhile.
I’m glad you shared that with us all Ray. I like cwald’s approach…not let’s argue with this guy…but let’s let him see for himself. I like that approach, and I think Jeff has tried to be careful, apologizing when told to calm down…so we’ll see if he “gets it” or not.
Makes for interesting postings!
I sent him a personal e-mail (not a PM), asking him to stay and telling him we need an orthodox voice – that we just need it to be respectful and not insulting. I told him that those who struggle here need to know that traditional leaders will listen to them – really listen to them – and accept them despite their different views. I’ll let you konw if he reponds to me.
He made it past my prediction of 10 posts and then leave. He made it to 17 so far! 
I really liked his last comment to cwald. Hopefully, this has been a good discussion for everyone. Controversial folks can make for good conversations, as long as it doesn’t get out of control. Jeff just sent me a LONG response to a private email. To summarize: He’s a STRONG believer in the Adam/God theory – who has known at least two prominent Mormon scholars (older generations, both of them) who served as “mentors” and teachers of that theory to him. Frankly, the way he explained his experience to me smacks of the “secret knowledge” and “apprentice” approach – and I really dislike that approach.
Anyway, that’s why he zeroed so quickly in on the Adam-Eve / evolution thread – and it explains his word choice when talking about evolution.
He seems like a nice guy, and he isn’t looking to flee Babylon by leaving here. He knows he’s heterodox himself, at least in that particular way, so I hope he settles in and fits well in time.
Brian, since you already reached out to wayfarer, cwald, etal, will you send them a follow-up with the basic info above? (that he’s a passionate Adam-God believer, not the rest)
Old-Timer wrote:his experience to me smacks of the “secret knowledge” and “apprentice” approach
Interesting. I wonder if the Internet age makes it harder for the “secret knowledge” stuff of past generations? Its hard to keep things secret when you can google it. We no longer have the secret temple ceremony, or secret masonry, or stuff that Dan Brown writes about…so when it is not so secret…does it lose its potency? Just wondering how that might impact Jeff’s involvement online.
Old-Timer wrote:Brian, since you already reached out to wayfarer, cwald, etal, will you send them a follow-up with the basic info above? (that he’s a passionate Adam-God believer, not the rest)
I think they already understand that he is a strong literal believer and most likely a fan of Adam-God. It comes across clear. I don’t think this guy will last long with us anyway. I just didn’t want people to jump all over him in a knee-jerk reaction. He isn’t the kind of person we target to help. I don’t think he needs/wants help. If he is happy with his faith, then I’m happy for him. He came here mostly to investigate why someone else lost their faith.
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