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I actually prefer the group baptisms to individualizing them. It goes along with scripture…like how Christ sought out John doing baptisms of others at the same time, and these people in Mosiah 18:
Quote:16 And after this manner he did baptize every one that went forth to the place of Mormon; and they were in number about two hundred and four souls; yea, and they were baptized in the waters of Mormon, and were filled with the grace of God.
17 And they were called the church of God, or the church of Christ, from that time forward. And it came to pass that whosoever was baptized by the power and authority of God was added to his church.
If it can be done personally for a family, that is fine too…but I think it can become too much to try to make it so special for each child by making them have their own ceremony.
IDK. I can see both sides, just think it can go too far.
I guess that is how I feel about Sabbath Day too…you take things too far (like making kids wear sunday clothes all day and be uncomfortable and wear out the nice clothes) just as a way to physically display devotion that takes away from the true inner purpose of it.
As Uchtdorf says (and I often repeat in my mind since I see it everywhere at church):
Quote:The Savior Himself provided the answer with this profound declaration: “If ye love me, keep my commandments.” This is the essence of what it means to be a true disciple: those who receive Christ Jesus walk with Him.
But this may present a problem for some because there are so many “shoulds” and “should nots” that merely keeping track of them can be a challenge. Sometimes, well-meaning amplifications of divine principles—many coming from uninspired sources—complicate matters further, diluting the purity of divine truth with man-made addenda. One person’s good idea—something that may work for him or her—takes root and becomes an expectation. And gradually, eternal principles can get lost within the labyrinth of “good ideas.”
This was one of the Savior’s criticisms of the religious “experts” of His day, whom He chastised for attending to the hundreds of minor details of the law while neglecting the weightier matters.
Notice how he uses quotes on the religious experts of the day? I find that significant. I guess I try to follow his advice and focus on weightier matters. I don’t find many others’ opinions on the Sabbath day strict obedience to be helpful for me or my family. I find we are happier when my kids do their sporting activities and we go watch as a family, or we go out to eat as a family, or we watch football and rest. I have tried things very strict, and tried things very loose and liberal. I find more peace and focus on weightier matters by keeping the Sabbath day holy in a loose and stress-less way. That’s just me. I understand others who think differently, and I respect them and what they are doing as well. It just doesn’t translate to my own happiness or spiritual growth. It just doesn’t.
When they stress it at church…I keep it in that perspective, and choose for myself what brings me peace.
I recently came across and love this Instagram post by Glennon Doyle, an unconventional Christian to some, and here’s what she had to say on Sabbaths and how to keep them holy, emphasis mine: Quote:It’s Sunday. My favorite day.
All week we create and work and build and then Sunday comes. We stop creating, take a deep breath, step back from all we’ve built and take a good look at it all. Our families, homes, relationships, work —
and even though none of it’s perfect & none of it’s done – We look at it and CALL IT GOOD. Good enough. Beautiful even.Sometimes we go to church on Sunday. We love our church. Some seasons, we find ourselves LOOKING for church in the world and BEING church in the world instead of going to church. We don’t keep any rules about church in our family. God is everywhere and church is wherever people are working together for love.
Friday night we found church at a Chance the Rapper concert. My favorite was @lecrae. This guy got on stage and talked to those 12,000 kids about resilience, dropped wisdom and made hope COOL.
Rap Concert church is a real thing.
Man, we miss the opportunity to learn from some serious ministers when we only look for them on altars.Heber13 wrote:
I love that idea. I even thing more people are finding that preferable on Thanksgiving day…go out to eat and have no dishes and not all the prep work before hand…it leaves more family time.
Funny. I actually did that with the family I lived with on my mission. We even went out to a Chinese buffet. It was awesome.DancingCarrot wrote:
and even though none of it’s perfect & none of it’s done – We look at it and CALL IT GOOD. Good enough. Beautiful even.
this part particularly struck me and I think I needed to hear it. This is something I need to internalize and try to do more of on my sabbath day. This will be something I strive to do in coming weeks, as well as find church and god throughout the week whenever there is love.
Perhaps while there is ongoing goodness we can look for…Sunday can be a day set aside to remind myself to stop and think about it. The rest of the week I should not get too wrapped up in over-thinking it all…but do the work…show the love…then use 1 day a week to stop to reflect to make sure I am on track, whether inside an LDS chapel or somewhere else.
More for me to practice and repent and try again.
Heber13 wrote:
I actually prefer the group baptisms to individualizing them. It goes along with scripture…like how Christ sought out John doing baptisms of others at the same time, and these people in Mosiah 18:
You have some very good points Heber. Also I have noted that most other churches do it this way. They have a specific time when any who would like to be baptized may do so (more or less). However, these seem to be primarily adult convert baptisms as a spiritual choice.
In our church baptism at eight years of age is a rite of passage. As with other rites of passage (think bar mitzvah) families are going to want to have some celebration. I do agree that this can go too far and some baptisms (and related celebrations) may be far too extravagant. I think we are largely on the same page here.
I find it interesting that our church still largely does individual baptisms for adult converts. We do not seem to follow the example of John the Baptist or Alma for them. It can be a hard thing for parents to accept an impersonal baptism for their child but see a special ceremony for a convert baptism that will likely not be active in the church after 6 months. However, I can sympathize with the awkwardness of any adult being baptized surrounded by 8 year olds. Perhaps the most fair thing to do would be to hold 2 stake baptism days – one for children and another for adults.
regardless, my main point was that doing weekly baptisms is likely far too large of a burden upon the local leadership. They are unpaid volunteers and deserve to have quality time with their families just like the rest of us.
It depends on the area but around here the adult convert baptisms are few and far enough between to where a leader would schedule a special meeting whenever the convert wanted. They’re trying to be accommodating because often the convert may have taken some time to make the decision and may even be hesitant. Meanwhile, in the case of a child of record baptism, what is the family going to do? The child is going to be baptized eventually, so there’s less incentive to do something special. To the church it’s routine, it would be up to the family to make the baptism special.
Going back to converts, often the convert doesn’t have a family to make it special so it really is up to the church to make it special.
I suppose we could move to a monthly adult convert baptism day and then go all out to make it special.
One other thought, if there was a once per month adult convert baptism day I can envision missionaries becoming more manipulative (not on purpose) to ensure that the person they have been teaching for a while hurries up to meet this month’s deadline because transfers are coming and if they miss the date this month they may not get to be there when their convert is baptized. But I suppose that’s not too different than what is currently going on, but more of a week to week thing as opposed to a month to month thing. But I guess the longer the time between opportunities the more the sense of urgency that the baptism occur during the next available opportunity.
On the baptism front – Our Stake had a “If you fill it. They will come.” program. For nearly 6 months, on the third Saturday of the month convert baptism or not, we filled the font with water. Had the missionaries all there with talks, hymns, the works. As members we were encouraged to attend. With the idea that acting as if would show faith. Eventually our “converts would come to the water.”
I never attended. Only heard them discussed ad nauseum over the pulpit and meetings.
I am certain the reason we failed was our lack of James Earl Jones. Without his stirring speech we just couldn’t make it happen.
mom3 wrote:
On the baptism front – Our Stake had a “If you fill it. They will come.” program. For nearly 6 months, on the third Saturday of the month convert baptism or not, we filled the font with water. Had the missionaries all there with talks, hymns, the works.
Wow. What an incredible waste of time and resources. I can totally see this happening.
mom3 wrote:I am certain the reason we failed was our lack of James Earl Jones. Without his stirring speech we just couldn’t make it happen.
😆 …ya…if only we had the voice of Darth Vader on our side!Quote:Roadrunner wrote, Wow. What an incredible waste of time and resources
I know. The water alone that was just dumped. It was the worst (not just lame) plan/idea I had ever heard of.
Heber wrote,
Quote:if only we had the voice of Darth Vader on our side!
Nibbler??? Your skills are required. I see a meme or gif here?
:clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:
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