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I read on another board that until 1978 only p’hood could pray in sacrament meetings. The church handbook since then simply says “men and women can be asked to pray in church meetings.” It doesn’t even say they have to be worthy or members.
I would be delighted to see this happen. RS should be about more than big hair. Wouldn’t like to see public prayers though – some people might use it as a political/doctrinal soapbox.
Ray, I can respect that. There are so many dumb, pharasaical convenctions and traditions surrounding women and public worship in the Church. I had a ward where the order of the sac mtg talks had to go by priesthood authority, so the ladies went first, then the men. A woman couldn’t give the final talk at a sac mtg if there were any priesthood brothers speaking. My DW experienced another frustrating convention: although women may pray in sac mtg, a man must give the opening. My wife is not a native English speaker, so she gets nervous speaking and giving prayers in sac mtg. Once, 5-6 years ago, a counsellor in the bishopric asked us if we’d give the prayers as we sat waiting for sac mtg to start. My wife was nervous about it, but agreed that she would if she could go first and get it over with so she wouldn’t sit and brood about it all meeting long. The counsellor looked at us with a look as smug and condescending as any I’ve ever seen and said “Oh, no, that can’t happen. The priesthood has to say the opening. I’ll put Brother Kumahito down for the opening and you down for the closing,” and he walked off. My DW was furious. So I told her I had a simple remedy for her situation. I told her “Honey, you just go up there to give the closing prayer, pull the mic in real close to your lips so there’s no mistaking what anyone’s hearing, and loudly say that prayer in Japanese.” I promised her two things would happen: (1) lots of people would come up after and say that they thought her prayer was beautiful (this came true) and (2) she would never be asked to pray again in that ward (which also came true). It made her feel a whole lot better about the situation, and got her off the hook for public speaking / praying for 3 more years.
Sometimes I wonder if stuff like this isn’t what Adam was offered: the philosophies of men, mingled with scripture.
:angel: Quote:
There are so many dumb, pharasaical convenctions and traditions surrounding women and public worship in the Church.My grandmother was asked once to talk about her first experience in the temple in sacrament meeting. The bishop just asked her from the stand, not beforehand. Now my grandmother was big into preparation, so being asked to speak on the fly did not meet with her approval. However, she was also humble, and so she did what the bishop asked without comment.
This was her first experience in the temple: There was no preparation, she saw her mother and aunts making her temple clothes with no explanation of what they were for or meant. Then she went and was given no explanation for anything that was happening and she spent the day frustrated and confused. At the end, as she was walking into the sealing room with her soon-to-be husband he gentlemanly opened the door for her. As she started to step in, her way was barred by the Sealer and she was told “Sister, in the temple the priesthood always goes first.”
I’m sure that isn’t at all what the bishop was expecting. But I think about that every time I go to the temple now, especially when I walk into a room in front of a man, that little moment was what my grandmother remembered most about her wedding day for all of her life.
On Own Now wrote:I don’t care whether men or women pray in GC… but I wouldn’t mind a trap door that is automatically activated after 20 seconds.
FTW!
We did a poll on this at W&T:
http://www.wheatandtares.org/2013/01/19/let-the-women-pray-weekend-poll/ There was a comment on a different post there this week that really gets under my skin. The post was about whether women already have the priesthood because they perform ordinances in the temple and wear the robes of the priesthood. “I am satisfied with my role as a woman in the church. I believe I used my agency to choose my sex in the pre existence. I enjoy my role as wife and mother. I am blessed by Heavenly Father who answers my prayers.” The answer just sounds like the switch got stuck on some pre-programmed Stepford Wife. She is just regurgitating a party line like she hasn’t got a thought in her empty head. Nothing she is saying is inherently bad or wrong, just completely irrelevant to the discussion. Motherhood is equivalent to fatherhood, not to priesthood. I have little patience for dunderheads like this. Fortunately, I almost never hear this kind of thing at church. Your results may vary. Of course, it’s the internet. Maybe somebody is having me on.
rebeccad wrote:Quote:
There are so many dumb, pharasaical convenctions and traditions surrounding women and public worship in the Church.My grandmother was asked once to talk about her first experience in the temple in sacrament meeting. The bishop just asked her from the stand, not beforehand. Now my grandmother was big into preparation, so being asked to speak on the fly did not meet with her approval. However, she was also humble, and so she did what the bishop asked without comment.
This was her first experience in the temple: There was no preparation, she saw her mother and aunts making her temple clothes with no explanation of what they were for or meant. Then she went and was given no explanation for anything that was happening and she spent the day frustrated and confused. At the end, as she was walking into the sealing room with her soon-to-be husband he gentlemanly opened the door for her. As she started to step in, her way was barred by the Sealer and she was told “Sister, in the temple the priesthood always goes first.”
I’m sure that isn’t at all what the bishop was expecting. But I think about that every time I go to the temple now, especially when I walk into a room in front of a man, that little moment was what my grandmother remembered most about her wedding day for all of her life.
That’s the biggest problem with any church, perhaps our especially. Individual understanding (or call it bigotry in some cases) will always taint things.
mackay11 wrote:The church handbook since then simply says “men and women can be asked to pray in church meetings.” It doesn’t even say they have to be worthy or members.
I was asked to give the opening prayer last Sunday and I haven’t held a TR for 3 years. My wife was concerned that might mean that she was on the hook to give the closing prayer (it didn’t).
Quote:My wife was concerned that might mean that she was on the hook to give the closing prayer (it didn’t).
I have heard that the Handbook advises not to ask men and women to pray in the same meeting.
rebeccad wrote:Quote:My wife was concerned that might mean that she was on the hook to give the closing prayer (it didn’t).
I have heard that the Handbook advises not to ask men and women to pray in the same meeting.
‘Cuz then there is a risk of unintended prayer co-mingling, leading to unwanted prayer babies (prayer-lets)?
Just teasing..couldn’t resist. I loked it up in teh last week or so and it just says men and women can give prayers in meetings.
I bet prayer-lets are cute though
:clap: The general advice is to not have husbands and wives give the opening and closing prayers, since it might send an unintended message to single members. I agree with that completely, and it shows that the leadership is trying to get local leaders to be aware of these sorts of issues. We are nowhere near where we need to be, but I really do believe the awareness and effort are there – some statements (like Sister Dalton’s recent one) notwithstanding.
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