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Welcome to the island of misfit toys. 
I too know how you feel. Like DA, I do not really expect too much from the church in terms of fellowship and friendship at this point. I generally take the view point that people are busy and self absorbed – just like me.
She (my wife) and I have discussed that there are people that can get up and testify about how great the sisterhood is in the ward and have that be quite genuine. If you are part of the “in crowd” the view can be very different than it does from the “outside looking in.”
A good example is the lack of invitations for my kids. We have had several play-dates where we have invited ward children to come play at our house. I cannot think of anytime that my kids have been invited over to other ward members homes. What about birthday parties? Do none of these kids have birthdays? I get the impression that these things go on – just that we are not thought of to be invited.
Anyway we have been participating in the evening activities of some other churches for a few years now. I have always drawn the distinction that we “participate” in several churches but only “attend” the LDS church. It could also be said that the LDS is our “home church.” A few months ago my wife told me that she wants to start attending one of these other churches every other week. She just says that she feels more connected, wanted, accepted, and uplifted there.
So far it is going pretty well. I wonder/worry though how long we can keep it up before word gets out. I fear negative repercussions from the church both officially and non-officially.
I look forward to hearing more from you.
Roy, if your ward is anything like mine, it could take several years before anyone notices, har. Also, what repercussions? What are they gonna do, make Sunday School MORE boring? If you don’t mind me asking, what churches have you had good experiences with? (Asking for a friend, heh heh.)
Quote:I feel like the Church isn’t doing a good job of being a church, and because of that I don’t see the point in being involved there any more.
Well, I guess the core question here is what is a church supposed to do. Adam Miller might say that church does a great job when people AREN’T being Christlike because it challenges us to love them anyway, even when they are judging us or being self-righteous. I don’t have any great answers on this one, but from everything I see, people both in and out of the church are such a mixed bag of good and bad, really good and really bad, that there are no human examples of “how to be Christian.” How to be Christian is to fail over and over again and then to try to do better. That’s how to be human, too. The Christian twist is reading and trying to follow the things Jesus taught, not just your own conscience.
I think what the church structure should do it usually does fairly well – provides us an opportunity to serve. Something you said that was a very Christian thing, IMO, is that you are a Primary sub. Your reason? Because they need the help and others in the community (in your ward) don’t like to do it. You are filling a need, serving others. So churches give us a structure for serving others in our wards and in our communities at large.
It sounded to me like you were questioning the example your ward members are setting of living a Christian life, which is always a gap. People aren’t great at it. They are good at some things and bad at others. A friend’s dad was an awesome guy, someone I really admired. He was educated and open-minded. He wore a beard when he was a bishop and pushed back on intrusive questions from the SP about it. So that made him, IMO, Christlike because he wasn’t a hypocrite. But then I have also heard two very disturbing stories about him. He is the main reason my best friend’s mom left the church because he hounded her over her divorce (her husband was an abusive alcoholic), and he is the main reason another man left the church because he confronted him about being gay. So those are two very heinous acts in my estimation. Is he a bad Christian? Sometimes. Sometimes disastrously so. Other times, he’s a champion of the downtrodden and a great example. I keep running into people like this in the church. They are horrible and wonderful.
I am dying to know why the name Weaselgirl.
Yeah, I listened to Bill Reel’s interview of Patrick Mason this morning and now I’m all calmed down in my mind. I swing back and forth between “Church is just not working for me any more. I don’t have a place there.” and “I need to be at church because someone else might feel like they don’t have a place there and I can help them feel accepted because I am familiar with that feeling.” Meanwhile, there’s Primary and Ward Choir that keep me sane. Well. Relatively sane. I’m still me.
FWIW, it turns out “weasel” is a Very Funny Word. And weasels in general are just funny looking. I put a lot of stock in funny.
Weaselgirl wrote:I put a lot of stock in funny.
:thumbup: haha…love it.Weaselgirl wrote:FWIW, it turns out “weasel” is a Very Funny Word. And weasels in general are just funny looking. I put a lot of stock in funny.
So…
notbecause of Pauly Shore? Buuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu-dy. Nope, definitely NOT Pauly Shore. But “Buddy” is also a Very Funny Word.
Weaselgirl wrote:Roy, if your ward is anything like mine, it could take several years before anyone notices, har. Also, what repercussions? What are they gonna do, make Sunday School MORE boring?
If you don’t mind me asking, what churches have you had good experiences with? (Asking for a friend, heh heh.)
I truly am hoping that nobody notices. As for repercussions, I worry about people ostracizing us as apostates unofficially and officially perhaps not let me bestow the Aaronic priesthood on my 8 year old son in 4 more years.
We tend to connect more to churches that are more accepting and inclusive. In Iowa it was a Baptist church. Their initials were FBC=First Baptist Church but they had changed it in most of their literature to read FBC=Faith Building Community. I met with the pastor there and he told me, “You can be saved and be Mormon, but it won’t be the Mormonism that saves you.”
Now we live on the west coast. The church that we have connected most with is a local Assembly of God church. They have embarked on a marketing push of the subtitle “a place to belong”. It is a growing church with paid youth and children’s pastors, wonderful “small groups” and other programs, and the most welcoming and accepting vibe I have ever encountered. They seem to do so much with the local rehabilitation center and battered woman’s shelter that these organizations regularly refer individuals. We have been participating at this church for the last 5 years being openly (if discreetly) Mormon and no one has made us to feel as though we are not a welcome part of their faith community.
I see so many people at this church that are connecting with God and that I believe would not be able to succeed in an LDS environment. They are having their spiritual needs met in ways that, for many of them, would not be possible in the LDS church. I am glad that they have other options than the LDS approach.
Quote:I feel like the Church isn’t doing a good job of being a church, and because of that I don’t see the point in being involved there any more.
Bingo. I see it when I talk about my community work with members. Their eyes glaze over. They see that I will be of no use in the church to them so long as I am so busy with other pursuits. it is like I am a unit to be enlisted in whatever needs the Ward has. So they lose interest in you. I slowly trained my Bishop, whose first call was to say “We need an executive secretary”. Great. What about what I need right now? YOu haven’t seen me at church for a few years now (been to a different Ward), perhaps we should address any underlying issues that might prevent me from simply latching on to whatever the Ward needs right now?
These thoughts ran through my mind….I feel, at times, the church is a bit like the Borg on star trek where it assimilates our skills and makes us part of the hive/collective, with very little thought for our individual needs and individuality.
However, you can still be at peace with it, without leaving it. Lots of us have done that…
Weaselgirl wrote:Meanwhile, there’s Primary and Ward Choir that keep me sane. Well. Relatively sane. I’m still me.
Hi, Weaselgirl – I’m glad you’ll be posting and look forward to hearing more. It’s easy to think that your own problems with the church are the most unsolvable ones. Part of me think I could solve the “lived experience” ones pretty easily, and would prefer them over my truth/history ones. But you remind me that it’s all daunting.Hang on to ward choir and wring everything out of it you can. I literally thank heaven at least once a week that I have an interest and skill that keeps me feeling safe and useful and fed at church.
Ann wrote:Weaselgirl wrote:Meanwhile, there’s Primary and Ward Choir that keep me sane. Well. Relatively sane. I’m still me.
Hi, Weaselgirl – I’m glad you’ll be posting and look forward to hearing more. It’s easy to think that your own problems with the church are the most unsolvable ones. Part of me think I could solve the “lived experience” ones pretty easily, and would prefer them over my truth/history ones. But you remind me that it’s all daunting.Hang on to ward choir and wring everything out of it you can. I literally thank heaven at least once a week that I have an interest and skill that keeps me feeling safe and useful and fed at church.
Yeah, I find that I read other people’s experiences and think that they just need to do X or Y and they’ll feel fine about things. Where with MY situation, I mean, how do you fix that? But I’m sure it all has to do with each individual’s life experience and how they interpret things and stuff. Like for me, I’m pretty sure I exaggerate in my own mind that I am not important to anyone. Like a mopey teenager would.
🙂 Which is fine until I see myself actually forgotten about. And I’m sure other people who have a hard time making the Church History thing work for them would do much better if that hadn’t been such a clustercuss over the years. I find that stuff mildly annoying. Others find it deafening.Love the avatar! Cute little weasel!
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