Looking Beyond the Mark

[Anonymous]

Everyone, I am here to apologize. I AM SORRY. In my original post, I wrote:

Quote:

I have had many questions and came here for help STAYING in the Church. What I found was people wallowing in the mud and feeding the doubt. This site has hurt me, not helped me. This site encourages each other to be a jack Mormon, choosing which principles, doctrines, and practices to follow. All we have to do is focus on the “fundamental gospel truths, which provide a basis for faith.”

I know I won’t win friends for this post. I hope all of you leave this forum. I wish the best for each of you.

I didn’t like the “How to Stay” article because of the “Tactfully Embrace the Title “Buffet Mormon”” section. I have really been thinking about this and I realized I have actually been living the “middle way” and it helped me to stayLDS! I really hope that the middle way can lead as many as possible to be a “TBM,” though. I think that does not necessarily mean taking everything literally.

I am sorry for judgmental and condescending things I have written. I especially apologize to wayfarer. On Tuesday I wrote “I will probably find more concerns in the future” and that is true. I don’t have any serious concerns now, but I anticipate needing this site someday. So, I do NOT “hope all of you leave this forum.”

Yes, I saw some responses in other threads that seem to feed the doubt and I wish that wouldn’t happen, but I can see that this site really helps a lot of people. I look forward to sticking around.

[Anonymous]

Congratulations Shawn, it takes a very big man to freely admit his errors. :thumbup: That is the type of thing I aspire to, but it is never easy.

[Anonymous]

I don’t know if you need to apologize. I think you brought up some valid points that needed to be addressed and discussed.

I think you were polite and respectful for the most part.

I hv no problem with your opinion…it’s just not how I believe today.

Sent from my SCH-I500 using Tapatalk 2

[Anonymous]

I also appreciate your frankness and honesty. …just say what you mean and feel and don’t mince words….I insist on it

Sent from my SCH-I500 using Tapatalk 2

[Anonymous]

Quote:

I insist on it

So let it be written; so let it be done. :ugeek:

I just want to agree with cwald’s last comment. I play the heavy here sometimes :shh: and ask people to remain respectful of others, but, in the end, we really do want open and honest commentary and discussion. If cwald and I can comment openly and honestly and still like and respect each other as much as we do . . .

[Anonymous]

I’ll just repeat what I said back on June 19th…

Quote:

I, for one, want to thank Shawn for this thread. It is a good thing for me to think about. It would have been easier for Shawn to just leave and not make any other posts, but he had the courage to share his experience and thoughts. Thank you Shawn, I think that makes the discussions more vibrant, rather than only sharing the posts that agree with the GroupThink. :clap:

I’m glad you’re sticking around!

[Anonymous]

Shawn wrote:

I didn’t like the “How to Stay” article because of the “Tactfully Embrace the Title “Buffet Mormon”” section. I have really been thinking about this and I realized I have actually been living the “middle way” and it helped me to stayLDS! I really hope that the middle way can lead as many as possible to be a “TBM,” though. I think that does not necessarily mean taking everything literally.

I am sorry for judgmental and condescending things I have written. I especially apologize to wayfarer. On Tuesday I wrote “I will probably find more concerns in the future” and that is true. I don’t have any serious concerns now, but I anticipate needing this site someday. So, I do NOT “hope all of you leave this forum.”

Yes, I saw some responses in other threads that seem to feed the doubt and I wish that wouldn’t happen, but I can see that this site really helps a lot of people. I look forward to sticking around.

Please do stick around. You have made a difference, and you have had a positive influence on the spirit of this board, because you’ve stuck around. I appreciate it.

Your message moved me to tears. Dangerous to do while sitting in Washington DC traffic. I appreciate your kindness. I, too, owe you an apology for indicating that you were less than honest in your intent — ‘hoodwinked’ was the unfortunate word I used, and for that I am sorry.

I think your comment about the “How to stay” article is very accurate. While I appreciate the tremendous amount of work that went into the article (thanks, Brian, and others), I’m afraid there is an aspect of the method, that while very pragmatic, may seem a bit disingenuous. We need a better guide for those whose orientation is toward belief. Without it, I’m afraid, we seem to have only one path, to hide and obscure our issues while we try to StayLDS. I do not believe that such a path is sustainable.

I think most here on StayLDS have a degree of belief — some a very high degree of belief. I’m quite impressed that there are some who are capable of believing, having a powerful testimony, while fully being aware of the serious issues in the truth claims of the church. I actually think that many here do fit that category, and I learn from each one who is able to do that. Now, if we could just reflect what makes testimony possible amidst the discovery of all the truth available about the church, I think we could really make a difference in helping people who choose to StayLDS.

Where you and I differed is in approach. I don’t think it’s possible, at least for me, to return to a position where I can say things like “the only true church upon the face of the earth” or “follow the prophet and I’ll never be led astray”. I cannot not ask the hard questions, thinking that by not asking, my questions will go away. I cannot deny the truth that our prophets were profoundly flawed men and often taught for doctrine their own commandments of men. That’s just too hard for me to ignore. I need to embrace that truth, not be afraid of it, yet at the same time, resolve how it is possible that ‘the gospel’ as taught by the church is directionally true, uplifting, and exactly what I need to know and do.

I have talked about and embrace the term “Middle Way”, in spite of some who feel that this is the lukewarm way (referring to an unfortunate verse in Revelation about vomit). I appreciate you’ve come to maybe embrace the term as well. The Middle Way isn’t the way of dissent and negativity, but it’s also not the way of superlatives, apologetic defense, nor baseless claims. The MIddle Way is to find common ground, and dwell in the spiritual truths that are amply found there.

To that end, I really hope you stay, and help us forge that Middle Way together. We don’t know where this will go, but we do know that love and acceptance provide the basis of all that is good in the church. With your help, perhaps we can create a more vital, inclusive community of those who choose to make the very best of staying LDS, and do so willingly and joyfully.

Cheers, my friend.

-wayfarer

[Anonymous]

Since we’re all being so honest and sharing right now, a loooong time ago when I first discovered this site, I also read the “How to Stay” article and decided some of it was helpful (which I held on to) and some of it was not workable for me at all (and I threw that part away and never actually read the article again). I don’t even remember what those parts are now and probably will not rush to read it again. I am more of a believing member due to the experiences that have been given to me. Also, I am a convert and always saw some things differently than some of the mainstream. I have trusted in my own discernment for a very long time….all the way back to childhood. It has served me well. I always felt it was a gift from God even before I really knew about God since I came from a very nonreligious household. There are times it has seemed as if very few people are willing to admit the Emperor has no clothes in some situations locally and I have to stifle screams at those times. This site has helped me to relax about that since I know other people see those situations for what they are too. So maybe this site has been a bit of a pressure relief valve. I am really into the gospel allows for all of us to change and grow and no one is locked into their final judgement yet. I wish things could be different in ALL the wards…some of the stories I read about here and elsewhere are heartbreakers.

Shawn, thank you for staying and for starting such a good discussion that has provoked much thought!

[Anonymous]

I’m glad you’re sticking around Shawn. I don’t agree with everything I read here either. The things I don’t agree with I either ignore, or provide my own perspective on, and move on. For me, the divergent ideas, given in the culture of respect that prevails here, is part of what keeps me coming back. And this means that often people have ideas or perspectives which I don’t entirely agree with — and that’s OK.

For me, an aspect of unconditional love is being willing to co-exist with people who have perspectives that are at deep odds with my own and still have a good relationship. I’m seeing that in your post, which I greatly respect. I think you’ll do fine in this community with that basis.

Here’s a new welcome to the forum!

[Author]

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