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Hello each and everyone. I enjoyed listening to John Dehlin’s podcasts on mormonstories and I’m sad he stopped his project last year… 
I’m a non-LDS and have been an investigator of the LDS faith for about 2 years I guess. I figured out that this belief system won’t make me happier or give me greater spiritual or theological insights in any way. But now I know how such religious groups work and why some adherents become disaffected when they hear some less faith-promoting stuff about their Church’s history, leaders, evolving doctrines etc. I’ve talked with lots of missionaries, members, local leaders, ex-members, investigators, struggling members to get a broader image of this LDS-culture. I was discussing doctrines, theology, philosophy, persons and events and learned that the ordinary member is generally unaware of the problematic sides of his/her religion. Being naive is what seems to “help” most people to stay in the Church
What kind of help are you offering? According to your introduction, you decided the LDS church won’t give you happiness or valuable knowledge. Are you still considering joining the LDS Church? The site here is about staying in the Church, not so much another site to hash over the flaws and failures. That does naturally come up in the process of trying to stay. We are already aware of the problematic sides of our religion. That is why we end up here.
Your name is borderline offensive. I might see if we need to change it if you decide to stay and participate. Your avatar might be from a funny video clip, but also seems a little borderline… at least for a site about trying to promote the positive sides of our religion.
Valoel wrote:Your name is borderline offensive. Your avatar… also seems a little borderline… at least for a site about trying to promote the positive sides of our religion.
Yeah. Valoel is right. This site is about figuring out how and why to StayLDS for those who are no longer “naive” as you put it.
Those of us who are here are entertaining the idea that the LDS Church can make some people happier and more spiritual. Perhaps not us personally, but perhaps so with enough reworking. We aren’t exactly anxious to convert the world, but we accept that the converts we see may be actually taking a step that’s positive for them personally. Or maybe not.
John Hamer (
http://mormonmatters.org/2008/02/24/a-veil-runs-through-it-a-mormon-cosmogony/ ” class=”bbcode_url”> http://mormonmatters.org/2008/02/24/a-veil-runs-through-it-a-mormon-cosmogony/ (1) Scriptural Literalist. The scriptures say that it happened in such-and-such a way. That’s how it happened. Any competing so-called scientific “evidence” that seems to contradict the scriptures should be discarded because the scriptures are a more reliable authority. Rob Osborn (#55) seems to be making the case for this view.
(2) Traditionalist. Joseph Smith and the apostles taught that certain things happened certain ways; we’ve passed that knowledge down and it’s as true today as it was in 1844.
(3) Neoconservative. Science as we understand it is in total harmony with both the scriptures as well as with all the important statements of early leaders. And I can prove it using an incredible intellectual apparatus that will dazzle the eyes, cf. FAIR.
(4) Average. I know the gospel is true, as are the scriptures, the teachings of the prophets, and (in a general sense) science. Although I haven’t thought through the implications and whether or not I’m simultaneously holding contradictory opinions, I’m not really worried about it.
(5) Neotraditionalist. Traditions should be honored, but the spirit of the movement included a gospel that was up-to-date in 1844. To honor that spirit, the gospel must be up-to-date now. (I don’t have a good name for the vision I’m articulating on this thread because it’s probably the most rarely held category on this spectrum.)
(6) Liberal. It’s clear that the scriptures contain inspired myths that did not happen, but are still the word of God and can still inform our lives. For the actual functioning of the universe and history, we find more useful information through the sciences and scholarship.
(7) Rejectionist. The contradictions between the scriptural and traditional positions and reality, the inconsistancies of the neoconservative and average positions, and the silliness of neotraditionalist and liberal positions, have left us with nothing worth salvaging. I’m going to move on, but in the meantime I feel the need to explain to you why I’m leaving.
At this site we are trying to avoid approach seven. Your approach seems like type seven, which would be more appropriate to Recovery From Mormonism.
KM
Sorry, but I don’t fit in any of your categories. I have a more or less certain concept of God, believe that mythology is a necessary element of religion and reject literal interpretations of both scripture and events like “the first vision”. I always try to encourage people to get a realistic, conscious understanding of religion to avoid further disillusions as well as exaggerated guilt or arrogance. No one needs to “recover” from Mormonism, Christianity, Islam or Atheism if one accepts that all religions have their valuable and problematic sides.
I rarely get dogmatic here or elsewhere, but if you want to stay in this group, please show it by changing your handle and avatar – even if only to show that you recognize how offensive they are to others. [MODERATOR ACTION] I removed this thread from circulation in the open areas of the board. I will send an email to HYWP letting him know what I did, and letting him know he isn’t a good fit for the community the way he presented himself.
I’m just not comfortable at all with his username. Not just being a prude (which I might be), but also because it is a trigger for guilt and bad feelings. HYWP comes across as someone out to stir the pot and cause drama. The avatar matches his demeanor.
If anyone strongly disagrees, feel free to say something. I could be completely wrong. We could put it all back very easily. Let me know.
Letter sent to HYWP: ################################################
Hi,
We decided to remove your introduction thread and close your “haveyouwatchedporn” user account. The avatar and username are just too far outside the type of atmosphere we want to build at our site. It also doesn’t seem like you fit the target audience closely enough. There are plenty of sites out there to discuss the mormon church and its beliefs. Some are probably a better fit for you. I wish you the best of luck.
Sincerely,
Valoel
Any response from porn? Seems like the right decision. No response so far, but it hasn’t been that long. I will pass along anything if it comes up. I agree with the decision. Response from HYWP: I think I will tell him he can rejoin with a different name and avatar. That was our main issue. I will also remind him that our community is about staying in the Church, and that he can participate as long as his discussions stay within that framework.
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Hi, can I register again later using a different user name & avatar?
Because I’d like to join the discussion. Thank you + have a nice weekend
David
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P.S. His name is David Hoàng, email=
ttblades@googlemail.com I googled “david hoang” and got two people – an artist (25 yo) in Seattle and a doctor in San Francisco. I’m ok reinstating him under probation, but I’m wary and can’t shake that feeling. I say we need to keep an eye on him and know exactly who he is when he re-registers.
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